@barnee
Hi barnee,
Are the BM objectives added as a map option, or automatically later as rounds pass?
I have quite a few ideas, but I will do one aspect per post.
I have not looked into Oztea 1939 before, but I did read up on the forum chat of the link you sent. You explained the Vichy mechanics (if they went into play) and they are similar, but different from the BM ones.
Personally, I was happy with the BM Vichy Rule set, although, I did find that the Axis can take advantage of it to eliminate Allied units without a fight while also collecting units in North Africa (take Southern France g2 or g3). I haven’t played BM all too much, I really do like playing with g40 bids, but I also enjoy historical realism, if it can work with mechanics and balance. That is the key, finding something that incentivizes certain historical play, but has trade offs for balance.
Based on historical facts and relevance to adding some balance/trade offs to the Mediterranean opening and further historical game play I came up with the idea to have a French battleship start in SZ 92. I then went down the rabbit hole of coding conditions based on various historical what ifs. This unit type actually aligns very well historically and is also the perfect unit for balance as I will explain.
Anyways, I have fully coded the following to work. You may know all of the history explained, but I will lay it out for my points.
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Game setup with French battleship in SZ 92.
Logic and balance note: Italy most likely has it’s Med no Allied ship bonus denied anyways first turn as it could try to kill SZ 93 units but there is no point to risk losses since they become defensive units with Vichy or can just be eliminated for free later. This battleship in SZ92 thus provides a hindrance to an easy Gibraltar take over by Italy, which the game opening usually lets happen more easily than reality was, but is not a block. Yes, you can sacrifice a UK blocker but generally those units are used for Taranto and the other Italian destroyer, if not running away for later. Anyways, this gives Italy a trade off to make as if it really wants Gibraltar it will need to pass on other battles to try to take out the ship.
Historical note: The original game setup actually represents the ratio of where and how much French fleet there was in each area (reality was 40% French West Africa, 40% Toulon, 20% UK/Egypt/Madagascar). The missing aspects are the battleships that were in French West Africa/Dakar. This battleship is supposed to represent the fleet at Mers-el-Kebir, which comprised of many battleships. The UK attacked this fleet and sunk one battleship with the loss of many French sailors causing a break in UK/French relations. The French were quite bitter afterwards. What if this attack never took place? I have coded various scenarios with the choice of the player’s direction.
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Scenario 1: Italy kills battleship to take Gibraltar. The game plays out normally as it would now whether Vichy rules activate or not, aside from losses and changed moves.
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Scenario 2: UK puts at least one ship (condition) into SZ 92 to sit with French battleship. This makes it even harder for Italy to take Gib, but if Italy does not go for it, the following will take place if BM Vichy rules activate. All other Vichy rules are unchanged. The battleship will be removed from SZ 92 (implying that the Mers-el-Kebir attack has taken place because of the UK unit(s)). There were surviving battleships though, and these have gone to SZ 87 to port Dakar, which is also a place for another historical battle/event. A Neutral Axis battleship is thus placed in SZ 87 defending French West Africa. This is thus a trade off the Allied player has to make on UK1, it benefits one round to lose out in another.
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Scenario 3: Italy leaves the battleship and UK does not add ships to SZ 92. When Vichy activates the battleship stays in SZ 92 but still turns into a Neutral Axis unit, thus blocking the UK from moving through Gib to the Med. This seems like a worse option for UK to take, but it has benefits later on (French not mad at them).
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Scenario 3a: UK wants to get into the Med so has to kill the battleship. This somewhat simulates Mers-el-Kebir, albeit the French are now already Vichy (not historical anymore). Consequences are that the Vichy rules will play out as they normally would with no more additions (I find them quite Pro Axis - French unhappy with Allies). The battleship is removed from the board and not put in SZ 87.
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Scenario 3b: Allies leave the battleship alone in SZ 92, Italy and Germany can use for extra defense. Seems a little too much on the Axis side? Wait until the next condition. If Axis take Algeria (it is Pro Axis) to complete the Italian objectives for all of North Africa then the French feel the Axis are breaking their terms and also trying to get a hold of the fleet in Mers. Instead of scuttling the ship though it makes a run for it to port Dakar, but this time as a Pro Allies unit to sit in SZ 87. French West Africa (if not taken yet) also switches from a Pro Axis to Pro Allies territory and unit (the rest of North Africa, Syria, Etc stay Pro Axis if not taken yet).
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Scenario 3c: Like 3b Allies leave the battleship, and this following scenario can happen independently of Algeria or at same time. If Axis take over Southern France then normal Vichy rules happen and SZ 93 ships are scuttled and all Vichy infantry units are removed from board, except for French West Africa because they are not mad at the Allies so they become Pro Allies (no Mers event has happened). The SZ 92 battleship is moved to SZ 87 and becomes Pro Allies as well.
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Scenario 3bc: The following is a condition that can happen if b or c takes place. While the French are now upset that Germany went back on its word they are still not up for a fight again (why other Pro Axis armies disbanded). French West Africa just needs a reason and contact by the Allies. Allies could take French West Africa in non combat move but my coding is bugged and the Pro Allies infantry unit does not convert, so I made another thing for it to do. If Allies own Morocco and Algeria during French Politics turn then the infantry unit in French West Africa will turn Free French and the SZ 87 battleship will also turn Free French. Again, coding created a no movement issue after conversion, but I just used it as a logical mechanic that they needed some time to figure out what they want to do and so cannot be used that turn. It also doesn’t just throw a battleship against Axis player right away that came out of nowhere, and Allied player cannot use it for extra defense in SZ 91/92 then either. I am fine with having the code fixed so that it can be used, but it works as is this way and I think is fair for game balance.
Below is a copy/paste of the 1939 Vichy rules you mentioned. I have some comments of what I do/do not like about them and how they would not work with my current rules.
Update to 1.87
Optional
Vichy Option
Adds Vichy rules. They are as follows:
All Players start at war with the “True Neutrals”. If Germany conquers France on turn 2, it will activate the “Vichy Option”. After their Non Combat Move, each French territory will be rolled for to determine if they become Vichy controlled or not. A roll of 1,2 or 3 and the territory turns Vichy. A 4,5 or 6 and it remains Free French. The only exception is “Southern France” which automatically turns Vichy. I feel making all territories be Pro Axis aligns with history best, especially with Mers-el-Kebir happening. It also opens up more possibilities to the game. French territory is usually just dead territory, but there are pros and cons for both sides for it staying as French game wise. I like that in BM both the Allies and Axis can make the decision and actions in order to try to stop Vichy from happening, this dice rolling thing just adds luck (not my thing).
Southern France will also have 2 Vichy Infantry placed there. All Vichy territories and units are represented by the “Neutral Axis”. They behave the same as Non-Vichy Pro-Axis Neutrals. No problem with this, I am assuming these are 2 additional infantry on top of the 1 inf 1 art to start?
If any Allied units are present in a territory that becomes Vichy, on their turn they have the option to stay and fight or leave, if possible. The only exception are air units, which are destroyed. (Not desirable but it’s how triplea does it). BM just has the condition that these territories stay French if Allied unit (land unit I think) present. Again, I like that a decision can be guaranteed, unless Axis respond and try to kill the Allied units
At the beginning of France’s 2nd turn, each French Naval Unit will be rolled for to determine if they become Vichy. A roll of 1,2 or 3 and the Unit is immediately ordered to the Vichy Harbor in Sea Zone 93. A 4,5 or 6 and it remains Free French. Seems complicated and unnecessary. The 110 cruiser might not exist after G1, I would not do it for the SZ 93 units, but historically the Madagascar unit could be part of the French fleet that was blockaded by the UK in Alexandria. Meaning historically the destroyer probably shouldn’t be there, however, even though that destroyer is generally pretty useless, it can do special things at times, especially in the Pacific. Losing it as a unit might shift power to Axis.
Vichy ordered ships must take the most direct route possible to Sea Zone 93. They may not attack (Player Enforced) but can defend normally. Once a Vichy ordered ship arrives in 93 Sea Zone, it will “turn” Vichy at the end of the turn. Vichy Ships are controlled by the “True Neutrals”. They are at war with all players. They may not move and defend only. If going through with this then maybe make the units Pro Axis right away to start their trip. Opens it up to historical play out better (e.g. SZ 72 destroyer would just get blocked at Suez Canal I guess like historically. As for ships being True Neutrals while at SZ 93, that one I can agree with.
If a ship hasn’t arrived in 93 Sea Zone by the end of French turn 3, it will not automatically turn “Vichy” if it enters 93 Sea Zone on the following turns. You may either use “Edit” or decide that the Captain has disregarded his orders and has stayed Free French. Not sure how you would decide disregarding orders - likely whatever decision will be helping one player or the other. If the units are Pro Axis on route then Gibraltar should block SZ110 (if UK owned) unit and Suez Canal will block destroyer. Haha now I actually kind of like this travel rule, but only as Pro Axis units. If they cannot enter then destroyer disappears (captured in Egypt) and the cruiser can head to port Dakar SZ 87, potentially working along side my battleship rules. Thumbs up now :)
If Southern France is taken over by any Axis player, then all Vichy territories immediately revert to Free French. This includes any Vichy Units that are present.
Depends, historically the Allies were already coming when the Axis did this so the French were bolstered and convinced to change sides. I am OK with this, but I feel they should disband instead if no Allied presence in Africa. Also, historically the French were still mad at the UK, perhaps if the order of things were different they would turn French.
Vichy Naval Units are rolled for to determine their fate. On a roll of 1,2,3 or 4, the Fleet is scuttled and removed from play. On a roll of 5 or 6, another roll is taken. On a roll of 1,2 or 3, the Fleet reverts to Free French. On a roll of 4,5, or 6, it turns into the Axis player. Adds luck to the game adding change and balance. Generally not for this, but the unit count is pretty insignificant. If the coding works, seems fun and interesting.
If Southern France is controlled by an Allied player (excluding Russia) a roll of 1 thru 5 will scuttle the Fleet. A roll of 6 and the Fleet will revert to Free French. Vichy land territories are unaffected. OK
If Southern France is taken control of by the Free French, the Fleet and all Vichy territories immediately revert to Free French. If France is liberated, all Vichy territories and units revert to Free French. OK
Japan War Scare Optional (for USA)
3 PUs if Japan attacks French Indo China and is not at war with the United States. Turn on in “Map Options” before game start. OK
The Vichy Option is based on Xeno’s “World at War” and how the BM mod addresses it. The French Fleet seems the biggest player in it to me. Italy has a tough go getting to Africa imo. This has the potential to help. It also gives a historical nod to going all “Churchill” and sinking it or turning Axis, only with more success than what really happened. : ) Ah, so I guess I didn’t need to explain so much history :)
At any rate, it’s a Vichy option : )
