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    Topics created by Veqryn

    • VeqrynV

      New World Order - Small's Tournament - $200 in prizes for top 3 - Free entry

      Tournaments
      • • • Veqryn
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      VeqrynV

      Click here to sign up for the tourny:
      http://www.biscon.com.au/tourny/dice/index.html

      This is a tournament using NEW WORLD ORDER Small’s mod,

      Tournament money donated by ‘Railroad’, a big fan of the map.

      Completely Free Entry, free to join and play

      $200 USD in prizes.
      1st gets $125
      2nd gets $50
      3rd gets $25

      The tournament is scheduled to begin 1 September. The STRICT deadline for each game being the end of the month, preferably finish way sooner. Any player that has not submitted a result in time or atleast emailed me to explain why unable to finish in time, will DEFINITELY get a loss for that game. Rounds will overlap, once first 2 games complete I will assign them round 2 opponents.

      NWO Smalls map again games must be played using dice not LL, and railroad wants me to compete in it too. Eliminated from the tournament after 2 losses. No bonus game vs me at the end like last tournament. Games to be played with the lobby. PBEM is ONLY ok if both players agree to it. Most know when they should concede, but you get auto win if get both double opponents production and have more than 1000 TUV higher than opponent. I have already taken into account that production and TUV values are not always entirely accurate.

      If game isn’t finished by the timelimit, the judges panel will look over the saved file and decide the winner, with consideration given to availability of the players. Anyone not wanting to play in the tournament, and I have played vs before, please advise me if you willing to be on the panel.

      I believe the map is balanced, but there will be a bid regardless. Normal bidding process used in other nwo tourny. Highest bid gets axis, negative bids fine. 1 unit per territory, can only place if same nation already has units there and if on land owned by that same nation. Person on left of draw page bids first. Bids can be in .5 increments ie elite costs 3.5. But 2.5 or 1.5 or 0.5 is not allowed. Players may withdraw from the tournament after any game, just email me, their names will appear in red in the draw.

      Winnings preferably sent with paypal, but will send bank cheque etc if you prefer. Use the join link to join, and until the tournament starts you can see the current entrants on the draw page.


      Small’s Website

    • VeqrynV

      New World Order - variant with Revised rules on a new, giant custom map

      Other Axis & Allies Variants
      • • • Veqryn
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      KurtGodel7K

      http://www.triplea-game.org

      The best solution to the problem is to download TripleA. The above link will let you do exactly that. Not only will this engine allow you to play Larry Harris maps, it also allows you to play a good selection of player-created maps. Some of them are significantly better than any of Larry’s maps, at least to me. (Including New World Order, Rising Sun, and Domination 1914 No Man’s Land.)

    • VeqrynV

      TripleA 1.3.2.2 Stable has been released

      TripleA Support
      • • • Veqryn
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      VeqrynV

      TripleA 1.3.2.2 Stable has been released (July 23rd, 2011), download it here:

      https://sourceforge.net/projects/triplea/files/

      direct link:
      https://sourceforge.net/projects/triplea/files/TripleA/1_3_2_2/

      Maps were updated on July 9th 2011, so please redownload your maps if you haven’t already (especially any ww2v3 style maps)  (repairing and some techs won’t work unless you redownload your maps)

      Changes from 1.2.5.5 to 1.3.2.2

      All known bugs in 1.2.5.5 are fixed. Major improvements to the AIs, especially to Moore AI. A new AI added, Dynamix, which is land only for now, but still being worked on. 4 new maps added, now TripleA comes with 11 games. More help for new users, including tool tips for unit stats and abilities. Massive expansion in the options and customizing of games. Many new options which allow modders to make their own board games, and their own rules and gameplay. Partial support for Axis and Allies 1940 games. Pacific 1940 is 80% done, while Global is 40% done.  This is still being worked on of course.

      thanks,
      veqryn
      http://triplea.sourceforge.net/mywiki/

      I should mention that Revised, Spring 1942, and the 50th Anniversary Edition look beautiful on this release!  Come give TripleA a try….

      For those of you who do not know, TripleA is a game engine for playing A&A and similar games online, both for Live games and PBEM.  It also has single player against 3 different AIs, and Hotseat mode.  There are regularly 20-60 people in the online lobby, and lots more people play custom games and really big maps by PBEM.  
      :mrgreen:

    • VeqrynV

      TripleA 1.3.2.2 stable version released!

      News
      • • • Veqryn
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      VeqrynV

      It has been over a year since the last stable (1.2.5.5) was released, and a new stable version has been released: 1.3.2.2

      You can go download it here:
      https://sourceforge.net/projects/triplea/files/

      direct link:
      https://sourceforge.net/projects/triplea/files/TripleA/1_3_2_2/

      Maps were updated on July 9th, so please redownload your maps if you haven’t already (especially any ww2v3 style maps)  (repairing and some techs won’t work unless you redownload your maps)

      This version fixes all known bugs in past unstable versions.

      Major Changes since 1.2.5.5:

      4 new maps come included with triplea, so now you get 11 games by default (about a 100 more available for download of course) Major improvements to the Moore AI, and a new land-only AI added Significant improvements in options to customize maps and create new mods Support for Global 1940 40%, Pacific 1940 80% done New lobby features, and usability features like tooltips, helpful links, etc.

      Most of the improvements to triplea have been behind the scenes, in making the engine more flexible and capable of handling new rules and new types of games.

      If you are looking to play Axis and Allies on TripleA, bear in mind you have download the maps for each A&A version,
      they are named:
      World War II Classic  =  A&A Classic
      World War II Revised  =  A&A Revised
      World War II v3  =  A&A 50th Anniversary
      World War II v4  =  A&A Spring 1942
      World War II Pacific  =  A&A Pacific 1940

      To download maps, just start up triplea, and click the “Download Maps” button.
      Then add this link to the box and hit “List Games”
      http://downloads.sourceforge.net/project/tripleamaps/triplea_maps.xml

      (do not click the above link.  instead, copy and paste it into the text box inside triplea, then click ‘list games’)
      click here to see a picture tutorial of how to download maps

      Enjoy!

      Veqryn
    • VeqrynV

      Krieg, need clarification on movement of Fighters at sea

      Axis & Allies Revised Edition
      • • • Veqryn
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      KrieghundK

      I doubt it, since the game is out of print.

    • VeqrynV

      Building an AI that plays Axis and Allies games, need help with strategy

      Axis & Allies Global 1940
      • • • Veqryn
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      newpaintbrushN

      This thread shouldn’t just be in A&A Global 1940.  I suggest creating a main thread, and stickying a sub-thread in each forum that refers to the main thread.

    • VeqrynV

      Building an AI that plays Axis and Allies games, need help with strategy

      TripleA Support
      • • • Veqryn
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      VeqrynV

      Here is a preview of some of the stuff in that thread I linked to earlier…

      Currently, this is the best AI algorithm we have…
      I came up with it in about 2 hours, so I really would like some people to comment on it and improve it:

      Post1:
      I wish to expand on what i wrote before:

      1. The AI should first figure out what battles it can possibly win. 
      1.1 First the AI should figure out “what enemy territories can my land units reach” and “what sea zones can my sea units and/or air reach”. 
      1.2 Simple evaluation heuristic of the enemy zones found in 1.1: Hitpoints and Defense strength of enemy territories (simply add up the number of units [counting 2 hit units as 2 units] and call that hitpoints, then add up the total defense strength of those units).  So for example, a territory with 1 BB, 1 CV, 1 DD, and a Fighter would have 5 hp and 12 defense. 
      1.3 Now we can use a heuristic to reduce the number of territories we must look at.
      1.3.1 Is there any land units that can hit our capital (including by sea)?  If so, decide how much is needed to attack it and win with 99.5%, then remove this territory or territories from the list we made in 1.2.  If we can not attack it and win (like if for example it is an amphibious attack), see how many units would be needed to defend successfully against it, subtract the number of units we will be building in the capital, then move the required number of units to the capital, prioritizing movement coming from interior territories first.
      1.3.2 Are there any multi-move & blitzable units that can reach into our interior money territories?  If so, decide how much is needed to attack them and win with 95%, then remove that territory from the list.  If we can not win against it, move a cheap unit to block the blitzing path and make sure to not include that unit in our further calculations.
      1.3.3 Can we move to an enemy capital?  If so, can we win (with at least 1 land unit left over)?  Is the TUV swing not too horrible?  If we can, do it, then remove that territory and the used units from out lists.
      1.3.4 Do we have any multi-turn-amphibious-transporting-moves pending?  If so, complete the transport chain movements, then remove any affected units and territories from the list.
      1.4 Now we must make a full inventory of what forces WE have at our disposal that can reach each territory on the enemy-territory-list. 
      1.4.1 For each territory on that list, analyze all our territories within max_map_land_movement spaces for land units, max_map_air_movement spaces for air, and max_map_transport_movement spaces for amphibious troops.  Like before, simply add up hitpoints and attack power, storing them for each territory on the list.  Make sure not to include any units used in parts 1.3.1-1.3.4. 
      1.4.2 Now do a simple evaluation to remove territories where we would not win from the list.  This could be something like: if ((our attack power + (hitpoints * 2)) < (enemy defense power + (hitpoints * 2))) then remove territory from list.
      1.4.3 Now we have a much much smaller list of territories.  We can run a battle calc simulation on each territory to see if we truly would win or not.  This does not need to be to 5000 calcs, this can be something like 100 for low luck and 500 for dice.  I dunno, this can be tweaked in the future.  Record the results for each territory.  Remove the territory from the list IF (we have less than 75% chance of winning with a large TUV swing, or less than 95% chance of winning with a moderate or small TUV swing) [TUV should be considered as a percentage of total TUV on the map or a multiple of the average unit price, that way this function will scale up with big maps or expensive unit maps]. 
      DONE PART 1, we now have a list of places we can win.  The list only includes places that we can win with 95% certainty, or 75% certainty with a big TUV swing.

      2. The AI should then decide which of those battles are the most important in forwarding its objectives. 
      2.1 Before we can remove the little battles from the list, we need to find out if we need those units to be committed to a more important bigger battle.
      2.1.1 Analyze each territory to come up with a value of each territory based on: is it in the direction of an enemy capital, can the enemy retake the territory next turn, how big is the TUV swing if i attack, and territory PUs (multiply territory PUs by 3 if there is a factory present).  For example, if the AI is germany, it might look at belorussia and add up the following: +6 points because it is in the direction of the enemy capital, -11 because it can be retaken by russia the next turn with only -11 TUV swing, +6 because the TUV swing is 6 in its favor for the attack this turn, and +2 because the territory is worth 2 PUs.  This gives belorussia a score of 3 in the AI’s mind.  (the only subjective thing here is how many points to give a territory because it is on the way to a capital, and perhaps also how we wish to calc the counter-attack-possibility part [we may have to add something here to give the destruction of land units a bonus over the destruction of air and sea units, because air and sea units cost a lot more but are usually less important, but this can wait][the value we give territories on the path to a capital will also have to scale up to maps with expensive units]).  Resolving ties could be done randomly or a new function could be applied.  If there are no moves that have a positive value, then exit loop (this would mean everywhere has a big big counter attack potential, so we should hold off attacking and build up forces). 
      2.1.1.1 How we could analyze the position of a territory is this: 1) Is the closest enemy capital to the territory-we-would-move-to, also closer to our capital Than any other enemy capitals? (ie: is this the closest enemy capital we are moving towards)  If so, give 3 points.  2) Is the territory-we-would-move-to closer to the closest enemy capital than the territory-we-are-currently-in?  (ie: are we moving towards any enemy capital at all)  If so, give 3 points.  [We could also add in: Are we moving towards the closest enemy factory?  If so, add 1 or 2 points, depending on value of factory and territory.]

      3. After analyzing all attacks, pick the one with the highest score.  Perform that attack with as many units as can reach it to achieve 97% win chance, choosing first units that can only reach that territory (stopping when we reach 97% or when we run out of units to move).  [debug may wish to recalc the battle, to make sure everything is going according to plan].  Commit those forces, removing both those forces and the territory from the list.

      4. Now loop back to 2.1. 
      4.1 We may wish to include a special function for little attacks & land grabs that runs once after 2-3 loops.
      4.2 Loop back to 2.1 again.

      5. Continue looping until we have either run out of units to attack with, or run out of time.  We should perform at least 4 loops minimum before we check for running out of time.

      DONE PARTS 2,3,4,5, the AI has now attacked a variety of places. 
      Now the AI starts rolling battles, starting with the biggest battles first.

      I hope this makes more sense,
      perhaps I can put it into pseudocode later
      thx,
      veqryn

      ps:
      Most of the moving towards enemy capitals will actually occur during non-combat, when the AI should be reinforcing towards the closest enemy capital that it can reach, while making sure to send enough to defend against other nearby enemy capitals.

      The only multi-turn considerations in my stuff above are, 1) calcing counter attacks during part 2.1.1, and 2) Processing any multi-turn-objectives.

      The only multi-turn-objectives we should create for now are sea transports + amphibious landing/reinforcing objectives.  Anything else would be too complex.  These sorts of objectives should be created during the purchase unit phase, then handed over to combat and noncombat moves, as well as deployment.  I believe that all movement that would involve a sea transport should be handled under multi-turn-objective handlers.  This would prevent things like moore-ai’s short attention span where it loads a unit onto a transport and then offloads him to the same spot he loaded him from.

      Nations who do not have a direct land path from their capital to an enemy capital should have special purchasing functions that create many multi-turn objectives to build land units and sea transports and then load and drop off those land units in a staging area.  After the drop off, the multi-turn objective for those land units ends, and the normal considerations above take effect (ie: move towards the enemy, etc.).  The transports that just dropped off guys will create new objectives to return to the capital or other island factories to pick up more guys.  After they pick up, that objective ends and they get a new one to drop those units off in some staging area.  Etc.  As you can see, these objectives are linked to individual transport units and the land units that are created on islands with no land link to enemy capitals (assuming they have already cleared the island/continent of other enemy territories, which should be checked for).  The objectives should be simple, and try to drop off units at the closest valuable land point, but they must also allow for situations where a map might have a lot of water and it could take many turns to reach that territory (think of america in the Great War map).

      Post2:
      1. How do I figure out how much is needed to defend against an enemy capital?
      How I imagine it:
      First, figure out what nations are your enemy.  This could be done at the beginning of each turn, in order to spread the work load.  Basically, compare their distance from you on land, their distance from you on water, their TUV, and your TUV, and Check to see if you have allies that are closer to them than you are.  Based on that info, come up with a list that includes 1 primary enemy, X secondary enemies, and Y enemies that will not be considered for now. 
      Second, use some route-finding info to figure out the quickest couple paths from their capital to yours, then include any paths that are within x of that (lets say x=1, and the quickest path from russia_cap to germany_cap is 4, then you will include any routes that are 4 or 5 territories long [to allow bigger maps, x could by dynamically set as a percentage of the quickest route but at least equal to 1]).  Get a list of all territories that are in those routes, discarding duplicates. 
      Third, analyze those territories to figure out current balance of power.  IF (((Enemy #ofHitPoints4 + total_attack_power + total_defense_power) - (Allied #ofHitPoints4 + total_attack_power + total_defense_power)) > X) {send more units in that direction}

      2. What is the general purchase algorithm for the AI?
      I don’t think moore ai’s purchase algorithm is that bad actually.  Basically,
      first you need to figure out, are we an island nation, or a land nation?
      If we are a land nation, should we buy any sea units defensively?  If not, buy a good mix of land and air units.  If we have very little money, focus only on cheap land (compare the average price of land units to our total money, AND/OR compare the number of open production slots we have to our money).  If we have a decent amount of money, still buy at least 50% cheap land units, but use the other 50% for expensive things like tanks and fighters.  AI should try to maximize hit points before anything else.  Hit points are worth at least 2 or 3 times more than attack/defense values. 
      (Some maps have specialty units with high attack and low defense, like bombers [4/1] or mortars [5/0], or high defense, low attack, like bunkers [0/3] or fortresses [0/4], etc.  The AI should give things that are not balanced a small disadvantage, so for example if something has an attack or defense value of zero, or has no movement, or has an attack or defense that is >= triple the other value, then it gets a small disadvantage in the purchasing algorithms.)
      If we are an island nation or there are no more enemy territories connected by land to us, we should figure out first if we should buy defensively or offensively.  Evaluate the navies and airforces of our primary and maybe secondary enemy, then try to keep at least equal.  Assume v3 transport rules, that transports are not used in combat.  Purchase enough fighting navy + airforce to keep ahead of rival nation(s).  Any money left over should then go to transports and amphibious land.  Figure out how many transports will be arriving next turn to be filled up (based on multi-turn-objectives attached to each transport), and buy enough land units to fill them.  Extra money should be spent first on 1 transport, then on land to fill it, then on another transport, then on land to fill that one, etc, (or the other way around).

      3. What is the general placement algorithm for the AI?
      Place land stuff as close to the enemy as we can.  Cheap & slow stuff goes closer, expensive and fast stuff goes further away because it can catch up.  Make sure capital will have enough in it to be defended successfully.  Make sure we are placing our ships together and on the correct side, especially placing them with other combat ships or further away from enemy.  Make sure if placing transports, that you also place land to be transported there too.

      Post 3:
      A quick run down of Non-Combat turn:

      Figure out where the enemy can attack. Figure out which of those areas we can defend successfully.  (first try to defend capital)(make sure to include place/deploying units in these calcs) Decide which defenses are the most important. Commit those defenses, looping back to choose other places to defend, that way the most important place gets defended first, etc, down the line.  You need to loop in order to remove units from consideration once you have decided to move them. Once you run out of places you can successfully defend, retreat from all other places. Make sure to leave single blockers in places that could be blitzed, when either the blitzing force is huge or the territories are worth a lot of money. Make sure to move air units to places that will be defended successfully.  (occasionally the ai will f-up and have air that can’t be defended. make sure to still move it, even if you will lose it) Now look at units that have not yet moved.  Begin moving them towards the primary enemy, and a little towards any secondary enemies if applicable (except do not move them to places you can not defend, found in #5).  Try to clump them together, not spread them out (a simple bonus to moves that end in larger stacks, over moves that end in smaller stacks, or something like that).

      (we need a way to keep track of units that have not yet moved, units that have moved, and units that should not move at all because they are staying put)
      (if you want this could all be done during combat move, … with the exception of landing planes)

      As you can see, this bears a lot of resemblance to my combat move algorithm. 
      Hope you like it,
      thx,
      veqryn

      [please go check out the whole thread for more details!]

    • VeqrynV

      Subs question

      Axis & Allies Revised Edition
      • • • Veqryn
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      KrieghundK

      Destroyers delay the removal of sub casualties, allowing them to fire back in their normal step even if they are hit by a sub.  However, both attacking and defending subs always fire in the Opening Fire step, so a defending sub will return fire even if it is hit, regardless of the presence of destroyers.  This is because fire within a step is simultaneous.  In effect, the presence of a destroyer only affects the ability of surface vessels to return fire when hit by subs.

    • VeqrynV

      My way of balancing pacific 1940, good for j1, j2, and j3

      Axis & Allies Pacific 1940
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      M

      My thinking is as a separate game this setup is flawed, but I’m betting anything that the Global game (the one we are all going to play from here on out for the most part) is pretty balanced with the addition of all those Russian infantry to the North of Manchuria. Something tells me that India crush strategy will take a beating.

    • VeqrynV

      Axis and Allies on Diplomacy Board…. while you are waiting for Europe

      Axis & Allies Europe 1940
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      zoooomaZ

      Can we combine this with A&A on a Colonial Diplomacy map and play global?

    • VeqrynV

      Anyone have LSSAH's contact info, OR have the galaxy map for TripleA?

      TripleA Support
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      VeqrynV

      I am looking for LSSAH
      he is the guy who created a ton of the unit art for TripleA, as well as creating some very very beautiful maps (Empires, and Space / Galaxy Map).

      I managed to find Empires in full form, and I found the relief image for the galaxy map, but have not found any other files for the galaxy map.

      If anyone either has lssah’s contact info, or knows where i can find him or get to him, could you post it or pm me with it?

      If anyone has the Galaxy Map (for the old triplea), anything for it, i would love to have it.

      thank you,
      Veqry

    • VeqrynV

      TripleA: Where to dl, How to Download Maps, Pictures of games TripleA supports

      TripleA Support
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      PantherP

      @redrum:

      Yeah it would be good to update or remove this post now. It would be good to review all the stickied posts in the software subforum.

      Unstickied today, I am about to create a new thread collecting the latest relevant links.

    • VeqrynV

      What is the typical bid, and what are some good basic strategies?

      Axis & Allies Europe
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      M

      Usually the only way to stop this strategy is by sending planes via UK to Leningrad so Russia can transform them into Russian units. Also if Germany makes a mistake and leaves no fighters in Berlin you have to make him pay with SBRs. Also if you can do this, use the 12 IPC bonus in the Middle East so Germany has to waste more time trying to control that.

      But I have found that you can make the battle a lot more interesting by also building artillery with Russia in large amounts to create a dead zone, if Germany is foolish and sends it’s infantry forward too soon the Artillery bonus plus the converted fighters will make them think twice about pushing too fast, allowing the US more time to mount an invasion on fortress Europe.

      But that does not mean this strategy is fool proof, you usually have to hope for a German mistake for you to get the upper hand, but playing this way definitely makes Germany have to play nearly flawless in order to succeed before the US becomes a threat.

    • VeqrynV

      What is the typical bid, and what are some good basic strategies?

      Axis & Allies Pacific
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      a44bigdogA

      Veqryn after you have read the essays Frimmel linked to (so of the finest strategy essays on the site in my opinion) check out my thread Australian Push. Kreig says he has never seen it before and I have never lost a game with it.

      AAP is not balanced all that well, in that Japan wins most of the games by a wide margin, but it is very fun to play. If nothing else for the challenge of seeing if you can eek one out for the Allies.

    • VeqrynV

      TripleA now has over 60 maps, and over 100 games (April 2010)

      TripleA Support
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      Deaths Head 420D

      You forgot to mention the best Map ever-
      Neauschwabenland.  Free for all style map, where each game is always different

    • VeqrynV

      Sub rules question

      Axis & Allies Spring 1942 Edition
      • • • Veqryn
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      KrieghundK

      @Veqryn:

      can you move a submarine into (not through) and stop in an enemy controlled sea zone during combat move, and choose not attack?

      No, you can’t.  However, in AA50 and AA42 if there are no enemy destroyers you can submerge at the beginning of the first combat round, effectively avoiding combat.

      @Veqryn:

      can you move a submarine into (not through) and stop in an enemy controlled sea zone during Non-combat move?

      In Revised, no.  In AA50 and AA42, yes, regardless of the presence of enemy destroyers.

    • VeqrynV

      New section

      Other Axis & Allies Variants
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      ?

      What ever happened to Yanny?

    • VeqrynV

      Japanese Strategies

      Axis & Allies Pacific 1940
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      P

      Nevermind.  I read the faq and changed the declaration for the USA.  So why wait to take the phil’s on J2 instead of just taking it J1.  You give the USA time to move everything, giving it that much more firepower to assault japan.

    • VeqrynV

      Empires - Napoleonic Wars

      Other Axis & Allies Variants
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      P

      I would like to play this as a board game with my gaming group.  Are you willing to share this game with me?  Can you give me the map file as a pdf file?  I would also need the rules as either a Word or pdf file.

    • VeqrynV

      Low Luck with AA guns and anti-aircraft fire

      Axis & Allies Anniversary Edition
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      HolKannH

      Pretending you get that hit, and way to ensure that only 1 fighter dies would dramatically increase the odds of bombers and tactical bombers dieing.

      I disagree, you forget to take into account the chances of an extra hit are minimal. Let’s redo the example, but with assuring maximum one type of aircraft survives, for instance, simply remove the fighters/bmrs from the pool after you assign the first hit.

      So redoing the example with 999 fighters + 3 bmrs. First assume no extra hit: you allocate the sure hit by rolling a 1002 sided die, if it’s <1000, a fighter dies, if it’s >=1000, a bmr dies. With extra hit: a fighter and bomber dies (this follows from rolling a 1002 sided die for the sure hit first, remove the type of casualty, and roll another die for the other type, which by then is the only type left, so will for sure be hit). Now let’s analyze chances:

      The chance you hit a fighter is: the chance the sure hit is a fighter + the chance the sure hit isn’t a fighter (which removes the bmrs from the group) and the extra hit hits. Mathematically: 999/1002 + 3/10022/1000 = 99,7%. The chance you hit a bmr is the chance the first hit is a bmr + the chance the first hit is not a bmr and the extra hit hits. Mathematically: 3/1002 + 999/10022/1000 = 0,5%. (Note these chances do not amount to 1 since on average more than one unit is hit. Moreover, on average, 1,002 units are hit, which is exactly the sum of the chances ;) ) So in almost all battles, a fighter will be killed, but never more than one, and almost never a bomber, and never more than one. So no dramatical increases of bombers dieing with this approach, a very slight increase at best. Very much within the margins of LL imho  8-)

      This reminds me of a method of handling AA I invented before, struggling with the same problem in AAR LL. I forgot it in my previous post  :roll: It’s fairly elegant, but has (in little cases) a chance of “both bmrs dieing”. Here’s how it goes:

      So, 9 fighters, 5 bombers, 7 tacs, 8 lancasters, 1 zeppelin and 3 ufo’s are being attacked by an AA. First remove groups of 6’s and remove these sure hits, just like you said. Then line them up on one long row. So 3 ftr, 5 bmr, 1 tac, 2 lnc, 1 zep, 3 ufo. Now divide them in ordered groups of 6: 3 ftr + 3 bmr, 2 bmr + 1 tac + 2 lnc + 1 zep, 3 ufo (= rest), and roll a die for each group, with the number of the die appointing the aircraft hit. For instance, you roll 4, 3, 4. So in the first group a bmr (the 4th aircraft) is hit, in the second a tac (3rd), and in the third nothing (you needed a 3- to hit, the 4th aircraft is “empty”). This is my preferred way of solving LL AA: no more hits than needed, no deep calculations, easy way of handling the extra hits. Actually, it’s a generalization of the “groups of 6 are sure hits”-rule: a group of 6 is nothing more than 6 aircraft for which a die is thrown, but since all the aircraft are of the same type, and since the group is exactly 6 large, the number on the die will always point to an aircraft of the type of which the group consists.

      However, there is a problem with this approach: suppose the second die in the example was a 1, then two bmrs would have been hit, which you want to avoid. My advice: order the groups as good as possible (with as little types in two groups as possible). In the example: 5 bmr + 1 zep, 3 ftr + 3 ufo, 1 tac + 2 lnc. As you can see, no aircraft type is in danger of getting two hits. This however is not always possible, but even in those rare cases, the type to split will contain at least 4 members (always split the largest type), so it is acceptable that 2 of those group can die instead of one. I deem this also very much within the approximative margin of LL to ADS.

      For instance, applying this method to your example (999 ftr + 3 bmr): divide in 2 groups, with the ftrs split (they are the largest type). So 3 bmr + 997 ftr, 2 ftr. Now the chances of a bmr being hit are 3/1000 = 0,3% , the chances of (minimum) one ftr being hit are 997/1000 + 2/1000 = 99,9% These are actually the exact average chances of ADS! And compared to your method (which has the advantage of no double bmrs hit), it’s pretty close I think.

      To summarize, use my method, with the “split only if needed, split to never more than two, and split the largest types first”-rule, and you won’t need to worry about chances or double bombers. Happy rule crunching :mrgreen:

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