Instead of making my own post about the same thing I’ll add to yours.
I live in Denver, Colorado, 80204, but I also go up to Boulder, 80302
We usually have 4-7 guys every Saturday up for a game of AA50 or Diplomacy, though college gets in the way sometimes.
just PM me if you live in the area and want to join
in Revised, the Allies win
in AA50, the Axis win
that, and you get a bigger board, more units that are more balanced and have a better price structure, Italy and China are included, although if you have 6 or 7 players I think those 2 guys would get bored and possibly angry from having to play their pitiful nations
if you are on a budget, or if you want a quicker game, you could just buy Revised but adopt some of the rules from AA50.
You could adopt the AA50 Tech Tree and Researcher tokens rules for example, though you would have to modify the Super Subs and Improved Shipyards to reflect the difference between AA50 and Revised.
You could adopt the new rules for Strategic Bombing Raids.
I don’t think those above 2 would change the revised game much, you could also adopt the new unit specs and prices, though this will definitely change the sea part of the game a lot. You could even make up your own national objectives or haphazardly create an Italian player with a marker or some paint on a few pieces.
I am considering this alt rule:
China collects IPCs, and their Inf cost only 2 ipcs (and they can only buy inf)
They have no capital, so Japan can never take their money.
They now have a more normal turn order of: Purchase Units, Combat Move, Combat, Non-Combat Move, Place Units, Collect IPCs (No Research&Development).
All their other rules are the same as before, (they can build anywhere in China that has less than 3 chinese units, can’t move out of China, part of USA turn still, etc.)
1941 and 1942 setup, China starts with 7 IPCs for both (since they have 7 territories for both)
I like this rule because having an odd number of territories now actually does something for you (you can save that 1 ipc for the next turn)
I also like how this gives China a reason to attack, since any gains made during their turn equal more IPCs for them, rather than the current rules which mean that Japan can erase any gains China makes before China gets to ‘make’ new inf.
It also seems to balance Asia out a lot more, currently Japan is way OP.
What do you think?
-Veqryn
@Imperious:
Soviet 1942 Strategy:
Build 8 Infantry or 4 Infantry and 1 Bomber
Attack one of the following groups of territories:
- Ukraine with 3 Inf,1 Art, 1 fighter 9v7
- E Ukraine with 3 Inf, 3 Tanks, 1 Art 15v12
- Belorussia 3 Inf,1 Bomber, 1 Tanks 10v6
Or attack:
- Baltic states with 3 Inf, 1 Fighter, 1 Tank 9v6
- East Ukraine with 6 Inf, 3 tanks, 1 Art 18v12
- Belorussia with 3 Inf, 1 Art, 1 Bomber 10vs6
Move the sub to SZ#2
Help UK with 2 Inf to Persia from Kazakh
Help China with 2 Inf to Chinghai from Novo.Place and center 8 Infantry in Stanovoy and Inf in evenki to Yakut
In the first one you leave Karelia open to be easily conquered, germany has 96% chance without even risking a plane, and Italy can take Caucus with 57% chance of winning.
In the second one, again Karelia can be easily conquered by germany since you only have 2 inf left there and they can bring 4 land units, a bombard, and any planes they want, and Germany can also easily take the Caucus since you left Ukraine alone, and if they do not then Italy can try like above.
I’m not sure I like these moves, but kudos for putting them out there anyway. (I should add that I play with NOs, so holding Karelia and Caucus are important to Russia)
I am indeed playing NOs, since I am partly assuming that Larry Harris, his team of playtesters, and the Wizards of the Coast playtesters, all built and balanced this game to be played by the rules they wrote, NOs and victory cities included.
However, with this post I was hoping people would evaluate the moves I am making and discuss possibly better Axis strategies and better Allied strategies to deal with them.
For example, what is better? To take Gibralter, To attempt to take Trans-Jordan, or to do something completely different with that transport?
Should Italy focus on Egypt and Africa, or should they instead try for the Caucus or Ukraine each turn to put more pressure on Russia? Or perhaps both, get Egypt the second turn, wait for the allies to commit to north africa, then switch gears and move your stuff to the Russian front?
And what allied strategies seem to be working for you guys? Mine don’t.
I just recently tried to take a Chinese territory with 4 chinese inf in it, using 3 inf, 1 art, 6 fighters, 1 bomber.
i rolled 2 hits, he rolled four 1s,
i rolled 2 more hits next round, he rolled snake eyes.
a total of 6 1s in a row, almost made me cry / strangle him.
I’ve played 3 games so far, all 3 times the Axis won. All three games were played on a real board, the first two using dice, and the last game we used the “battle calculator” in tripleA to make sure we our dice were staying close to the “approximate” outcome.
As Japan:
Builds a Industrial Complex for Manchuria, a transport, and a destroyer (dest is a precaution against american subs, otherwise a 2nd transport)
Fleet in 38 attacks 35 (Indian sea), with an extra fighter from Thailand. Should win with maximum loss of a carrier.
Cruiser in 50, Fighter and Destroyer in 51, Sub in 46, and Bomber in Japan attack 53 (hawaii), should have just the fighter, bomber, and maybe cruiser left (carrier in 51 does not participate)
Inf in Kwangtung, plus inf and art from japan, attack Fukien. may use battleship bombard if wanted, or noncom it to better spot.
1 Inf from Manchuria, 1 Inf from Kiangsu, Fighter from Formosa, Fighter from Japan, attack Suiyang
2 Inf from Kiangsu, 1 Fighter from Manchuria, attack Hupeh (this is optional, in the last game I did not attack Hupeh and instead used that fighter to attack Suiyang. the reason not to attack Hupeh is that China can bring 4 inf and a fighter into hupeh next turn).
Noncom 1 inf from Thailand to Burma. Noncom 2 fighter to Burma, 2 fighters to Thailand, and 2 Fighters to Manchuria.
Next turn you will proceed cautiously against China (keep your attacks overwelming in nature and they will not be able to counter attack much or at all) while setting up for an attack on India (assuming britain stays there) with 3-5 inf, 1 tank, all air, and depending on USA’s moves, your battleship.
Turn 3, take over India.
Turn 4, Defeat any USA navy at solomons/carolinas/hawaii/newzealand assuming they are going KGF, otherwise reach a stalemate in pacific. Do not worry about retaking solomons, you are getting all 3 of your NOs anyway. You should be dropping at least 11 land units into asia per turn, start pressuring russia by turn 5 or 6 through both top and bottom. Japan is way OP and ends up making more money than America at turn 3.
Germany:
Buy 5 inf, 3 art, 2 tanks, .or. minus a tank for a tech researcher token
Subs in 7 and 8 attack sea zone 1 (cruiser and transport in canada)
Destroyer in 13, Fighter in France, Fighter in Germany, Fighter in Norway attack sea zone 12 (cruiser and destroyer), should lose only destroyer
transport in 13 takes 1 inf from france, conquers Gibraltar (keeps 5 ipcs away from england for 3 turns or more, or until you take egypt)
[an alternative to the above 2 moves is to send your bomber to sea zone 12 instead of your destroyer, send the fighter in bulgaria and destroyer in 13 to attack the british destroyer in 15, and transport 1 inf and 1 tank from france to attack Trans-Jordan]
If Russia has 6 units or less defending Karelia, I would recommend attacking it by transporting the tank and inf from Northwestern Europe, cruiser bombard, the tank in Poland, the 3 inf in the Baltic States, and 2-4 planes depend on what you have left. If Russia did not kill your inf in Finland, use them too (and that means you can attack a Karelia with 7 units or less too).
As far as Finland, Belorussia, and East Ukraine are concerned, Attack whichever has the tanks and arty in it, assuming you can smash them. The board can vary a lot by this early point so use your judgement not to overextend too much, while killing Russia’s money units.
If by the odd chance Russia did not kill Ukraine, and left 5 or less units in the Caucus, you can attack it with 2 inf, 2 tanks, 3 planes, and win.
Noncoms:
I switch the arty and the tank in northern africa. 2 fighters land in Morocco
I leave Northern Europe with nothing in it. If the Allies want to move their ships this close on the first or second turn, go ahead, I would enjoy destroying their fledgling navies.
I move the tank in France to Poland, and the 4 inf in Germany to France, 1 fighter lands there.
I move any units in Ukraine out of Ukraine. If Russia can blitz through I leave 1 inf.
Other than that I move everything towards Karelia, and land 2 fighters in the Baltic States.
Next Turn: focus on getting Karelia every turn. You should be able to get all 3 of your NO’s almost every turn, and at the very least 2 of the NOs for sure.
Move 1-2 inf to france each turn. If you get all 3 NOs you can afford to build 1 fighter/bomber per turn too.
Make sure each turn you can defend France and Germany and Poland.
Italy:
buy 1 inf, 1 transport.
I generally wait til the second turn to attack egypt. Just move guys to Libya for now.
Send 1 inf to France, 1 to Bulgaria.
And there you have it. The unstoppable Axis Strategy.
My friends and I are thinking of giving China 2 extra infantry in Chinghai to balance the game better. I haven’t tried the 1941 setup yet, but the 1942 setup seems like Japan is just a little bit too powerful with their 3 NO’s per turn (Japan can outspend USA, wtf?). Seems like a 55-60% chance the Axis will win 1942 setup, but this is a pretty dice game so your results may vary. However, this game is still young and I am confidant people will come up with better strategies for the Allies.
Other rule ideas I thought up was an errata for China: China gets 1 inf Plus 1 additional inf for every 2 of their territories they control during the Mobilize New Units Phase of their turn. (this would give chinese players more reason to attack during their turn to get that extra infantry) and an errata for the Japanese 2nd NO: they need to control 5 of the those territories instead of 4.
thx all,
Veqryn
see I thought things like Wake Island and the Solomon Islands in the 1942 were considered NOT to be “original japanese territories” for the purposes of the British NO., while things like Manchuria is considered an original territory, because the japanese symbol is printed on it, even if it is chinese at the same time.
….
?
i got mine on Craigslist about 1 week ago, used for $65. one dice missing, and a dime sized indent on the little board for tracking your income that noone uses.
I’m going to go out on a limb and say I got a hell of a deal.
if you are playing 1942 setup, does the solomon islands count as an original territory?
also, does manchuria?
thx
(this is for the purposes of the British National Objective that says if allies control an original jap territory they the brits get 5 extra ipcs)
The Answer, from the Official FAQ posted on the Wizards of the Coast website, and also posted on Larry Harris’ website:
These are Original Japanese Territories (same for 1941 and 1942):
Japan
Iwo Jima
Okinawa
Caroline Islands
Formosa
French Indo-China Thailand
These are NOT original Japanese Territories (same for 1941 and 1942):
Manchuria
Kiangsu
Kwangtung
Burma
Wake Island
Philippines
Solomon Islands
New Guinea
Borneo
East Indies
from below:
From the FAQ:
Q. When the rules refer to the original controller of a territory, do they mean the controller at the start of the scenario or the controller printed on the map?
A. The controller printed on the map. The original controller of a territory is the same whether you’re playing the 1941 or 1942 scenario. China is considered to be the original controller of Manchuria and Kiangsu, and Japan controls these territories as an enemy power at the beginning of both scenarios.
I agree with the first half of the first post, that risk management is an important part of the game.
having dice compels players to attack with more forces or overwhelming forces to ensure that they are victories. In low luck, you can attack with the exact quantity you need and no more, often allowing you to attack more territories per turn, which changes it into a different game.
so, I just got the AA50 game finally, and i have one major question.
is it worth it to the allies to have the USA fight germany and japan at the same time (like in rl)?
as far as the game goes, there seems no point in splitting your income when you can spend it all against germany, not to mention that unless you spend a lot against japan they can just ignore and continue to make gains in asia, while germany and italy against russia and uk is favorable to the axis.
question on the starting income that all players have before taking their very first turn.
ok, so the rule book says this:
1941
Germany …… 31
Japan … 17
Italy … 10
United States … 40
United Kingdom . 43
Soviet Union … 30
1942
Germany … 37
Japan … 31
Italy … 10
United States … 38
United Kingdom . 31
Soviet Union … 24
but the forum fact sheet seems to say that any bonus income that is true gets added in there too (for example that USA gets +15 more ipcs starting income in 1941).
so which one is it?
I have been turn 1 russia 1 tank, 1 arty, 5 inf. I’ll try 3 + 3 instead for a while. (you put the inf in caucus, 2 tanks in moscow right?)
Why are you building a Carrier with England, i thought that was america’s job? (especially since america will get to put 2 ftrs on it when they build it, while england’s fighters should be used up killing stuff, either baltic or germany norway/karelia)
If the german baltic fleet moves to SZ6, you have to attack it with your UK 2 ftrs 1 bomber or else they threaten a combined attack of navy + air force on the allied fleet. If germany keeps it in SZ5 you can ignore them for a turn or more. If you do not take them out, then you can not take Norway turn 1 uk, and if they are sz6 you also can not take karelia turn 1 uk. Do you disagree? Why?
I have been using the moscow ftr to land in china, and attacking french indochina with 3 inf and 1 ftr, then landing ftr in china also. The carrier, destroyer and transport hit the SZ59 transport and kill it, the sub in SZ40 hit the jap sub, and the transport moves up one to threaten borneo for a turn 2 strike. I also tend to move up to 3 tanks and 4 inf into sinkiang. This allows me to take manchuria and china with russia turn 2, and half the time the brits get french, the other half they leave it unoccupied. This splits up the japanese airforce, usually meaning they leave the trsport in 46 alone, attack pearl with the bare minimum, and take china with only 1 inf left. They then lose a couple ftrs to a russian attack on kwangtung turn 3. After that I begin withdrawing from asia back towards persia, sinkiang and yakut.
If, instead of doing this you use the trsport with 2 indian inf plus ftr to attack and retake egypt, you will slow the african campaign down enough to delay a landing in algeria until turn 2. I can see this being beneficial as the addition of 1-2 transports, a carrier and fighters will limit the german ability to destroy the fleet (they can still attack, take out all trsnports, then retreat). Unfortunately, you basically give asia to japan and will have a big jap stack and 5 ftrs plus 1 bomber on moscow’s door turn 4, not to mention an unstoppable ipc generation in japan. If germany feels they can not stop your fleet, they will use their airforce against russia instead, which could end up hurting you more. I actually enjoy throwing my navy at germany in order to kill 5-6 ftrs turn 1 (turn 2 germany).
lastly, if people aren’t using TripleA, what are they using instead?
thx again for comments,
Veqryn
So if two expert players went against each other, each had equal luck, and neither used techs, it would be a long and balanced game, with either side having the potential to win for long into the game, and the final result being very close to going the other way?
the strategy i most often see is russia hitting west russia with tons, and reinforcing the caucus. If you attack west russia and ukraine I am willing to bet you lose a lot of stuff on pretty dicey outcomes, but i can see it being a good strategy too. I’ll give it a try.
If the uk, russia, and usa combine their shipping into the sea zone off algeria (and land guys in africa while they are at it) the total comes out to 4 transports, 1 sub, 1 dest, 1 battle ship. An attack with 6 fighters and 1 bomber leaves you with 2 fighters 1 bomber and no allied ships left. An attack with 5 fighters 1 bomber should be 0-1 ftrs 1 bomber left. An attack with baltic fleet and 5 fts 1 bomber should leave you with no more baltic fleet and your air force intact or 1 ftr lost.
If uk and usa wait til turn 2 to land somewhere, the pressure on russia is nearly unstoppable and germany definately gets to secure all of africa and possibly up to or including persia. Not to mention a free turn to use their airforce to hit russia with.
If you do not push japan off the mainland, it does not matter if they lose 1 or 2 islands especially since it will take until turn 2 to lose 1 island (and only if allies are really lucky) and until turn 3 to lose 2 (again, allies have to be increadibly lucky to get 2 by then, usually 0 to 1). Japan only has to focus on expanding to india and china to offset these losses. Any addition pacific fleet building by the USA means less atlantic fleet building, which in turn means no serious pressure on germany til at least turn 4, which is far too late in the game to make a difference.
I don’t have internet except at school for the moment, but once i have it or this weekend I will be online to do some tripleA. Do you guys use the unstable version or the stable version? (i have only stable 1.0.0.3 right now)
thx guys for actually reading and responding,
I would really love some really specific turn 1 and turn 2 russia uk usa help.
I’ve played axis and allies classic and revised, along with a whole slew of other games, but i’ve never played the anniversary edition (i think the price tag is scary).
so before i consider the investment, what do you guys think of it?
my main concern is: is it well balanced?
better balancing than revised and classic i hope, at least?
what else do you think?
thx
veq
edited: ( I like my games to be balanced without the use or tech)
I’m new to the forums but not to the game. After looking online at some websites like this one, I have found many people talking about “bidding” for the axis, which I remember from the classic version. But I am confused, because in revised it seems that the bid should go to the allies player, as they are the ones in deep. I have yet to lose a game playing as the axis, and always lose as the allies (excluding luck based wins) to a player of the same skill. The game is basically over on the 3rd or 4th turn.
Here is where I am coming from:
Turn 1: Germany take egypt with 2 units left, plus 2 more in libya, squares away with russia but leaving its front line in just one huge stack to deter attack. 4 fighters in WE, 2 fighters 1 bomber in libya, baltic fleet moves one space. Builds 8 inf 4 arty, or 8 inf 2 arty one medit transport.
Turn 2: If england and the US land in africa turn 1, the entire air force kills them with 2-3ftr, 1 bom left over. If UK lets baltic fleet live, usually not, but if they do, the baltic fleet helps out kill all allied ships. If UK and US set up for shuck shuck into scandinavia, this buys Germany extra turns and gives it complete control of africa yay. 2nd turn build is usually 7-9 tanks.
Turn 3: Everything you can spare musters in Ukraine, this stack is huge. Probably have used a few arty and inf here and there with ftrs to recapture belo and karelia. Now you ignore karelia but recapture belo. Your africa core has taken everything but that annoying south african sitting in rhodesia, and should be walking into persia. If allies landed in africa, you killed their navy but are left with 4 enemy inf, 2 arty, 2 tanks, and you are running away from them while claiming land. 3rd turn build is usually 4 ftrs, 1 inf/arty.
Turn 4: Russia has a massive stack of everything they can spare sitting in the Caucus and maybe an allied fighter there too. You hit it with your stack, your battleship bombard if you still have it, 6-7 ftrs plus bomber, and you win handly with about 7 tanks left over. Russia only have 6 or so units left in Moscow. Japan is definately past india and singkiang by now. Opponent concedes. If opponent does not concede, sacrifice you entire airforce to take out his entire combined navy for the second time next turn, while building a nice 15 stack of inf and arty in europe just to prove he can’t do shit.
And here it goes from the Pacific Side of things:
Turn 1: Japan can either build 2-3 more transports or 1 transport and a factory, plus w/e or save it. Allies tend to have 3 good strats:
First involves running away from the japanese front to consolidate at choke points, ie, singkiang and persia. Russia brings back the top of 10 inf certainly helps there, and japan doesn’t gain much from 1 money territories. Generally under this strat allies don’t build factories, and usually consolidates full UK navy with 2 inf from australia in bottom sea zone 30. Japan counters this buy building factory on mainland to get the boot. Invades china with 1-2 ftrs and 6-7 inf (1 maybe left to go into india), taking it with 3-5 inf left usually. Battleship and carrier plus 4 ftrs (move carolina carrier to sea zone next to btl to allow you to bring 3rd ftr), and hits pearl harbor with bomber, sub, destroyer and battleship. Usually have either battleship or 1 ftr left from UK navy btl, and bb and dest and bomber left from pearl. Build factory where you it, transport some troops.
Turn 2: You use one tank to start taking russian land while the rest of your group starts to consolidate in China. Your bb and transports might take india now, or if you already have it attack persia with just one inf to get bombardment. Mainland fact builds arty or tanks.
Turn 3: all your planes should be on mainland, singkiang has maybe 12 inf. I might wait one more turn depending on rest of the board and if you are committing any troops to persia. Mainland fact builds tanks.
Turn 4: your tanks and air sweep away sinkiang, you should also have persia now with good use of your 3 undesturbed transports and bb bombard. Russia shits herself. Germany should have destroyed one or two allied navies by now and is not feeling too threated, even if they lost africa. Allies will have troops either pushing into persia or consolidating in karelia. Russia is likely to have westruss, belo and maybe ukraine, but she is running out of forces because of germanies counter attacks. Allies rush to defend moscow but soon japan starts to top 50 ipcs while germany is definately not below 34 and could well have more than 40 if they held well. Because they have had to buy up to 3 new navies, the allies are only bringing in maybe 6 troops a turn, while japan should be bringing much more than that. Allies can’t counter attack with 3 seperate forces (and few aircraft), they can only defend, axis get huge economy going, win.
Second strat involves a slow try at pushing japan off mainland. UK builds india fact, US builds singkiang. UK navy again consolidates. Russia moves troops into stack of 6 in bury, 2 next to it, moves 4 inf into sing maybe with some tanks, keeps planes within range of japan. Japan uses same strategy to kill UK navy, again tih bb or ftr left over, and same strategy for killing pearl, with bb, dest and bomber left. Hits China with everything else, again the same 3-5 inf left over, lands planes and drops off troops in kwangtung, evacuates manchuria and french indo china. If you go with factory you put it in kwang, otherwise you get your 2 extra transports.
Turn 2: Russia swats you out of china, UK attacks but fails to take kwangtung. You don’t have much left in kwang, if you made a factory you have reinforce it, if not you can use your battleship to bombard and move down to french indo or up to manchuria. You reinforce with 8 new troops plus 4 ftrs (good reason to stay in kwang is that you can land ftrs there). Keep producing, any above the curve use to buy a fighter. Send extra trns to pick up troop of philipines and east indies. US doesn’t do much, builds 2 tanks, moves some planes in.
Turn 3: Russia and UK might attack you, but they have no more steam left and no new reinforcements. They could sit their ground instead, or even being moving backward in the hopes they have delayed you long enough to be able to defend their factories. But they have spent too much money pushing back japan so the delay doesn’t net them anything since it takes them longer to hurt germany anyway. Russia should be starting to hurt a little. You sit your ground or push out depending.
Turn 4: You expand outward. Germany should on the steps of the caucus and might have won that already since the allies couldn’t help and russia had to use some of its own to help the btl against japan. By turn 5 the game is yours.
Third: a much quicker push, haphazard and luck based. Russia does same setup, keeping planes in range, definately has tanks close. Uk attacks french indo with 3 inf and 1 ftr, should win with 0-1 inf and ftr left. Uk dest kills you transport, Uk sub sinks your sub, 2 transports and carrier might group up off coast of french or go with destroyer or my favorite is transport goes 36, carrier goes 48 and other transport goes 46 creating a wall that your bb can’t get through to hit dest. UK and US can build factories, or 2 bombers each.
Turn 2: Russia hits you hard, you lose china. UK may hit you bomber, fighter and 1-2 inf, it will lose but retreat with bomber. You build / land more troops, with 4 ftrs too. If US built 2 bombers on west coast it may go for longer range aircraft and heavy bombers, then fly 3 bombers into your fleet and win, you could now be fleetless or almost. If US went for factory instead they will be landing their bomber and 2 fighters on your side, moving 2 inf up.
Turn 3: Russia hits again, loses. UK may hit your with 1-3 bombers now, you could lose it. If you don’t then US will deal the knockout blow. You are off the mainland and possibly don’t have much of a navy (although they don’t really either). You can build up your navy again, and your airforce, and make another go at it. But either way, due to the overwelming allocation of resources to the far east, germany is knocking on moscow’s door and they aren’t knocking back.
Turn 4-5: Germany takes moscow and caucus, allies begin to strat bomb germany.
Turn 6-7: Germany liberates japanese territory with the help of japan’s new forces. Whatever happens after turn 4 is variable. This is the best I’ve done as the allies. I’ve won with this strat against lots of people, but whenever I play against myself my axis kicks my allies ass.
I’ve tried lots of variations. I’ve tried dropping a russian and british ftr in china before japan’s first turn. I’ve tried building up a navy for the first 2 turns then jumping into either western europe or africa or finland. No matter what I try it seems to be on the lower side of the scale of probabilities for winning. Oh, and I forgot to mention that none of my examples use bids, and germany doesn’t use rockets because that just makes it even more rediculusly OP to be axis and I can’t allow myself that advantage.
thx for reading this long post, hope you have some genuinely good input for me,
veqryn