What if Hauptmann-Jager is planning on countering the Allied counter to the G1 buy?
With what? Jennifer Connelly? That’s one smokin’ hot counter if I ever saw one. You could distract your opponent while you build more navy and snatch Russian pieces off the board. Hereafter known as the German Jennifer Connelly response to the Allied response to the German Baltic buildup. Or the JC softcore porn defense for short.
Oh yeah. (+1)
But getting that many destroyers built and mobilized to that area will in turn probably mean that the Allies controlled more land up to that point, which in turn could fuel a navy and/or air force to sink those destroyers. In fact, I think that would be the case.
Call who?
(+1)
I call the Russian bluff. Stacking in Bury is usually a bad idea even if I don’t attack it on J1.
My Japanese fleet rarely arrives at sz34 until the 5th round or so because I go after the south pacific IPC’s. That’s usually fast enough to close the canal before the Allies make it through. And I end up buying 4 or 5 more TP’s for use in sz34 anyway so for that price plus or minus a little extra pocket change I could have 3 more DDs to work with and still be able to land 4 units from persia to IEA. Once the fleet is assembled (2 BB, 2 CV, 4 fig, 4 DD, +/-1 TP) it would take the Allies a ton of IPC’s to knock it out of the water and a lot of time to do it since any navy would most likely have to go around Africa with the suez closed. More often than not the Allied navy has to rush into the Med and trade Egypt or T-J just to keep me from getting through the canal first or be stuck in sz12 protecting their TP’s from German air so they can get ground units through north Africa. One way or another the Allies rarely have the time or resources to devote exclusively to killing the Japanese fleet. The only real drawback is the IPC’s spent to develop Combined Bombardment.
I may have started this race late, but I’m getting a lot of mileage out of this thread. (+1)
I have never seen a German player who keeps the fighters on the CV in the Baltic once the Allied attack is about to go down so essentially 2-3 TP’s, 1 CV, or 1 DD built on G1 all defend about the same in the end.
Benefits of building….
1 CV.
The presence of the fighters usually requires an extra turn of Allied building before the attack is made so you have an extra turn to delay having to build defensively to defend Berlin.
2-3 TP.
Allows for heavy counterattacks into Norway or Karelia or reinforcement of Eastern from Germany or even Western if need be.
1 DD.
none. Don’t do it.
@AJGundam:
Find another person to stalk again that will boost your count
(+1)
Person?
(+1)
And raise…… (+1)
Jennifer Connelly. Yummy.
The NA is Japan’s - “Tokyo Express”, and the Combined Bombardement is a Tech, researchable by any nation. A Japanese Tokyo Express Destroyer MAY conduct shore bombardment (if Japan has the Combined Bombardment tech) into an enemy territory while it unloads its 1 Inf into that territory as part of an amphibious assault.
Not a bad little combo, especially if you pair it with Banzai Attacks! Whoop!
~Josh
But it costs a lot of IPCs, and destroyers are not that much use outside of battle, and Japan will probably not be fighting any major coastal battles that it would not already win, barring the possible exception for Western US, for which numerous destroyers probably would not be much good unless Japan built mass destroyers in the first place, which would tip off a skilled Allied player.
(+1)
But it would sure go a long way toward keeping the Allies from stacking in Persia, Egypt, T-J and the entire east coast of Africa once you get to sz34 in force.
I call. (+1)
The goal isn’t to discourage an attack on Ukraine, but to encourage one for the aggressive Russian players. With 2 inf in WR the Ukraine/WR attack gets pretty risky especially in WR.
2 inf in Ukraine doesn’t present any dilemma for the Russians. Belo/WR can go on just as if those inf were placed in Libya. There are no more units defending those territories. The problem is that WR has to be attacked on R1 no matter what. By adding the bid to the territory that ALWAYS gets attacked you put the pressure on the secondary territory. Either you make the secondary attack with the minimum amount of units or run the risk of taking a beating in WR. The risk may be high enough to a conservative player that both Belo and Ukraine aren’t attacked which provides immediate value.
Attacking WR/Belo is probably the best move but with the added inf in WR the Russians are going to take 1 more hit on average there so you don’t really lose much and the minimum Belo attack isn’t used for an IPC gain. It’s main purpose is to trade off 3 forward German infantry for 3 Russian infantry to keep the Germans from massing armor under the cover of advanced infantry. So it becomes entirely likely that a good defense in Belo coupled with the extra unit or units Russia lost in WR gives the German player an opportunity to counterattack WR with a good deal of firepower. Even if it costs you a lost fighter to AA, smashing the Russian vanguard might be the right play to make. And if you don’t counterattack WR, at the very least it will give you Caucasus for a turn.
So now that you’ve admitted it M36, will you be changing the statement under your avatar to “My Katz”?
Just to keep this partially on topic, the U-505 was a WWII sub that was captured and is currently on display at the Museum of Science and Industry in Chicago. I was born and raised in Chicago and my grandparents(all German) emmigrated to the US in between the world wars so my screenname is a loose connection between me, my heritage, my hometown, my preferred A&A country, and my favorite museum. My avatar is now THE U-505.
I actually remember travelling to Chicago as a kid, visiting the Museum of Science & Industry and seeing the U-505 and walking inside it. Pretty cool! The other cool thing I remember (or, at least, it was memorable) was they had one inch cross-sections of a human (a female as I recall) between panes of plexiglass so you could see all the organs and stuff. Pretty macabre actually now that I think about it. But it was one kick-a** museum (in one kick-a** town, I might add). :-) The only thing I wouldn’t trade Chicago for is the weather! I’ll keep my Florida sunshine, thank you very much! :-D
I agree. I’ve already paid my dues with the Chicago winters. The only thing wrong with Chicago is that it isn’t in Hawaii. Or Illinois isn’t in the south pacific.
Did you see the huge electric train layout? Or the coal mine? The Shedd Aquarium, Art Institute, and Field Museum are world class but the Museum of Science and Industry has all of the coolest toys. And you can’t visit Chicago without seeing the U-505. It’s a landmark. Plus, now it’s got a new building all to itself to protect it from deterioration with some added interactive stuff to play with. I think I’m going to plan a summer vacation just to go up and see it.
So now that you’ve admitted it M36, will you be changing the statement under your avatar to “My Katz”?
Just to keep this partially on topic, the U-505 was a WWII sub that was captured and is currently on display at the Museum of Science and Industry in Chicago. I was born and raised in Chicago and my grandparents(all German) emmigrated to the US in between the world wars so my screenname is a loose connection between me, my heritage, my hometown, my preferred A&A country, and my favorite museum. My avatar is now THE U-505.
I’d say it has potential. It could encourage aggressive players to do something unwise like attacking Ukraine and the more conservative players might be pushed into only attacking WR as discussed before. If you know your opponent, it could definitely pay off, though.
The best counter would probably be for Russia to attack Belo and crush West Russia. Even then it isn’t a guarantee for success since the Belo attack is never for sure unless you bring the Arch armor and those 2 extra inf in WR could really slow down the Russian offensive on a good day of defense. But that’s probably how I would do it since all of Germany’s aircraft would be used in attacking the sz13 BB and Egypt, the German player might have to hang an armor in a Belo counterattack. Unless, of course, he gambles in sz13 or Egypt, or abandons the attack on Egypt altogether. If you are the type of German player that likes to build a fleet in the Med, like me, not attacking Egypt might not hurt your feelings so that would free up some aircraft for Europe. In that case, placing 2 bid inf in WR is definitely viable.
I tell ya, this has to be the most contentious issue on these boards bar none…well, maybe aside from whatever’s going on in the “general discussion” thread. But here, it probably has to be this: a) what/should Germany buy navy? b) should it attempt a unification c) my written paper is better than your paper.
Well that’s because MY paper is better than yours. What were you thinking, Fox? Â :evil:
It’s mainly because everybody goes with what works for them and since they are more familiar with their opening they will argue more adamantly for it’s defense. The options for Germany’s opening build’s are endless and the Allied responses to those openings are endless squared. I say try every one you see and if a few win for you, try them again. And if a few lose for you, try them again anyway. What the hell, it’s only a game. Except when you play ME. Then it’s the ultimate battle of wits which will end up in me proving my clear superiority to whoever I’m playing. Even if I lose. Â :-P :mrgreen:
@CrazyStraw:
Actually I’d do the same thing short or long term. Â The game I play is FTF domination; tournaments do happen from time to time, but the majority of the time I play as close to box rules domination as possible (meaning bid and a couple of minor fixes).
The reason the German buy is the same for short and long term is the cost/benefit analysis of a Baltic purchase. Â If you buy nothing, then UK should sink Germany on the cheap, build transports in Z02, and be landing signficant troops in Europe R2. Â If you build even a single transport in the Baltic the UK strategy changes quite significantly.
Good posts from Darth, Frood and others. Â Couple more notes:
Darth, in the long term the Unified German fleet DOES die. Â But if you don’t at least threaten the move, the Allies go into ground-production mode immediately. Â By spending a few IPCs in the water you force a significant upgrade of Allied boats/planes, and you delay the landing of ground troops.
Again, I will try to take my own advice. Â :-D
I was speaking, in particular, about the argument between you guys of buying a fleet worth combining in sz7 on G2. I don’t dispute that Germany should buy some sort of navy on G1 in most cases( a really bad R1 or a heavy Russian push toward Japan being the main exceptions).
I’m just still skeptical about combining the German navies in a long term game. As I haven’t seen it or done it very often, I can’t say exactly what I would do but I get the feeling I would probably be willing to take the IPC hit by attacking it with the US/UK on round 2 at least to knock out the TP’s if anything. I place a pretty high value on taking early African IPC’s when I’m Germany(possibly more than most) so taking steps to eliminate Germany’s ability to do it would be a high priority for me as the Allies.
I might even just let it go. I would obviously build to prevent it from sinking the combined Allied fleet, advancing into the Atlantic, or invading UK(situational depending on the composition of the fleet) so it would eventually retreat to either the Baltic or the Med. In that case, I would probably try to work around it in the area it operates in and take advantage of it’s absence in the other.
It’s hard for me to get into specifics since the fleet compositions are nearly endless, but an exclusive TP build would probably draw an attack while a CV would mean trying to work around it. Until I could challenge it in force, at my leisure if possible.
Yes. Face to face tournaments are limited by time in hours. Online tournaments are limited by time usually in months so, in that case, not really limited at all. I’m sorry about that. I should have taken my own advice and been more specific.
It has a good strategic value since it’s within range of Eastern US.
It is definitely worth taking back for the same reason. And it’s worth 3 IPC’s.
It’s only worth capturing by the Axis if you can get to it cheaply. Trying to bullrush your way through the UK and US navies just to get the income will lose you the game.
Are you guys done with your petty bickering?
Clearly IL and Switch are talking about the long term while Squirecam and Crazystraw are talking about the tournament setting where the games typically last between 5 and 7 rounds.
My analysis is that in the short term, such as a tourney, it can be a good strategy since it forces the Allies, and the US in particular, to build an attack navy and aircraft to remove the German naval threat as opposed to a mixed build of ground units, TPs, and capital ships to begin immediate landings. However, in the long term, being away from Africa and it’s income for such a long time or worse, for good, can be dangerous to Germany’s ability to hold off the Allied hordes that come down once the German navy has been neutralized.
For the people who come here for help or insight, it would much more helpful if you were specific about whether you were speaking in terms of the short game or the long game.
You could always place limits on the NA’s to make them more palatable. Like 2 superfortresses max on the board at one time.
The best solution I could think of was to assign a point value to each NA and then when you play each Country gets so many points to spend and with maybe a community point pool for each side to use as well. That way, if your side wants only a couple of the more powerful ones the other side can bulk up on a bunch of cheaper ones to even it out. Just a thought.
It can land in Bury. E Can-W Can-sz63-sz62-sz60-Bury.
Wow, I totally missed the small connection between WCan and SZ63 at the top of the map. That almost seems unfair to bypass Alaska! 8-) Thanks, U-505. Off topic, your moniker implies you like playing Germany. With NA I saw a guy take U-Boat Interdiction and buy subs, taking away something like 16IPCs per turn from the Allies. Have you tried that?
I have yet to play with NA’s. Nobody here really uses them and some are more powerful than others so it can unbalance the game.
And yes, I do prefer to play Germany, or Japan. Each for different reasons.
As far as UK goes, I think it’s wasteful to go KJF simply because you can’t focus all of UK’s income to Asia. Unless England is exclusively used to build aircraft to support KJF once it has been fortified enough to prevent a German invasion.
It can land in Bury. E Can-W Can-sz63-sz62-sz60-Bury.
I would have to say that you should be careful about advancing heavy Russian forces too far into Europe. Drawing Russian ground units away from Russia is a trap I frequently like to set with Germany. It gets really had to resist trading a bunch of advanced territories with Germany because the prospect of Russia making 30+ IPC’s a turn puts dollar signs in the Russian player’s eyes. With the Axis outnumbering Russia by 5 to 1 with air units, trading a lot of territories and ground units with Russia almost always favors the Axis, even if the unit trade is 1 for 1. No matter how much Russia makes, Japan always outproduces them by up to twice as many units and that point will get hammered home when a large number of Russian forces are aimed at Germany and their reinforcements going west dry up instantly because they are desperately trying to hold back the flood of Japanese units coming at them. Japan has a tendence to look benign one turn and the next turn be all over the map, in force, and Russia can quickly get into trouble by being too aggressive toward Germany. Especially if the eastern defensive structure is poorly maintained.
Personally, I prefer the 5 inf, 1 art, 1 arm build on the first turn. It gives you a small offensive capability and still adds a good amound of defensive potential. I also like to add another fighter or two later, within reason, to be more fluid with my defenses and also be able to preserve the few offensive ground units available. I am selective with my trading, as opposed to taking everything in range, in order to keep my units concentrated. I try to delay Germany until the other Allies can pick up the European slack so I can rotate my forces to face Japan. I rarely advance past Belo, preferring to let Germany spread itself thin so the UK/US can pick a few of them off when they finally land in force.
For super heroes, I would have to say Silver Surfer. Or the Thing. But, I did like Moon Knight and the more obscure Vigilante for the same reasons that you guys like The Batman, because there were relatively believable.
For super villains, Dr. Doom is head and shoulders above the rest. It takes 4 super heroes to kick his ass and he’s relentless.
But if you want to talk about super villains, why not go big and pick Galactus? You can’t go wrong with a dude who eats planets.