Posts made by simon33

I don’t really understand why the above is superior to YG’s approach for a J1 DOW. I only see 3 inf who can attack Yunnan J2 and maybe a Mec - is that all the ground that goes in there? Putting a max land based attack (4inf + 8ftr + 5tb + 2sb) vs max defence (13inf + 1mec + 2tb + 1ftr + 1tank - assuming all UK fighters are defending in India against strat bombing, one inf loss China1 and maximum USSR land help plus two planes) into the calculator I get the Japanese winning 92% but at the cost of 8 planes and that’s without insisting on taking the territory. If you would make that attack as Japan I’d be pretty excited. I don’t understand at all why you wouldn’t send a second inf to Hunnan to protect your planes from loss.

Unloading all your carriers reduces your plane losses to 5.3 if you are going to say that.

I struggle to see a good attack on Yunnan J2 with a J1 DOW.

Side discussion: I strongly advocate an active Calcutta. A turtling Calcutta is merely waiting to be killed off. They need to be making a contribution to slowing the Japanese advance.

@Spendo02:

UK can of course make it more expensive to take by sending units to Yunnan, but it really makes no sense when Japan can skip right around via TT due to the minor in FIC being in the same SZ as Malaya which you should be able to take on J4.

Different SZ - SZ37 off Malaya. SZ36 off FIC.

UK, ANZAC and US need to try hard to hold Malaya as long as possible. If it falls by J4 I would want to be able to take it back. ANZAC doesn’t lose its NO if Japan takes it and UK retakes it.

Note that USSR mobile units in Yunnan threaten Kwangtung as well as FIC. Mobile units in Yunnan are quite awesome against a lot of factories. None of them can be strongly defended and if India is threatened, they can get there in one turn.

One other point which I should have mentioned: US can move a fleet including a loaded transport to SZ8 depending on what is left in SZ6 and on Japan. These can land on Korea or Amur US2. Loses the Lend-Lease NO USSR3 if you land on Amur but that’s not a show stopper. If you can get Korea US owned, building an IC on it, that is awesome. If these troops take Korea US3 and are reinforced USSR4 there will be no stoping the allies in the Pacific. The question is if enough is being done to slow down Germany. EDIT: On that point, I note that an SB can be bought US1 and placed in Western US if not at war. It can still reach London US2 from there. /EDIT

Oh and if Germany does buy some transports G1, you can go via Vyborg and use the USSR cruiser in the Baltic as a blocker by advancing it up to SZ114. Unless Germany blocks that move, of course. If you are using a blocker though you can’t rely on that move a second time if the cruiser is sunk. You need to commit or withdraw.

Anyway, forcing the 7 German troops back to Norway is worthwhile IMO. Probably 2 more need to sit tight in Norway that would all otherwise be marching on Leningrad.

Takes a few turns for a minor IC to be able to produce enough to counter survivors of 18inf. That assumes no reinforcements from Europe also.

@Charles:

@simon33:

• Move Pac troops East.

Dangerous if Japan Dow1 and is at Phillipines Kr French Info China.

Well I wouldn’t recommend moving any troops into Shan State if the full weight of the Japanese land air force (8ftr, 5TB 2SB) would be applied against it. If it is a lot less it can be worth it. I certainly wouldn’t leave Japanese troops in Shan State unmolested though. In fact, the Malaya forces can join giving 6inf, 1TB & 1Ftr. Unlikely Japan will attack Malaya J2 and if they do with only 2-4 land troops you’ll be able to get it back. Japan will probably only have 2 inf but can afford to lose planes to take down a big allied force.

If the Japanese prevent moving into Shan State UK1, I reckon moving up to Yunnan via Burma is the go for sure with the land troops. UK2, you’ll have 9inf and an art + TB + ANZAC inf and ftrs which can move into Shan State, assuming two have been taken off with the transport. The Japanese will need a lot of air force to defend against that in FIC UK3, which means they can’t use many (any?) planes in Manchuria. Alternatively, these forces can just defend in Yunnan. The Japanese wouldn’t be able to take them down until a lot more forces arrive.

Am I missing something here?

Without the Japanese weakening Calcutta with strategic bombing, you can keep pumping out ground troops at a reasonable rate. No need to be excessively fearful of Calcutta falling, although you definitely need to keep an eye on the Japanese transports. To keep this going, I see a fair bit of importance in reinforcing Malaya for the production and ANZAC NO.

@Charles:

@simon33:

Note about G2: if Germany attacks SZ123 off Iceland, then they are not in a position to cause convoy disruption on the UK unless they’ve divided their forces. That helps to make the UK stronger.

Very poor Germany gameplay.

Pretty sure we’re saying the same thing here.

@Charles:

As for Finland/Leningrad I was saying that moving up to Karelia/Vyborg makes you vulnerable to German units in Finland as well as all their air units and some more units from transports. For example. You put 9 infantry 1 artillery and 2 Aa guns in Karelia. I attack you with 7 infantry + 2 to 6 units from amphibious assualts and with up to 4 fighters 4 T bombers and 2 strats.

Amphibious assault from the North? Interesting possibility. A couple of points:

• You can get 11 inf into Karelia R1.
• Ftrs and TBs from Holland can’t make it.
• If Germany is doing that, it isn’t harassing the UK. You know the outcome of G1 when you make this move so if it isn’t on, you can cancel it.
• You can also throw in a fighter if you want. 2ftrs and a TB if you don’t send them to China.

Thanks for your thoughts.

If you are coming via sea, it’s pretty important to keep those unit numbers in India (Calcutta) down. Once you have Yunnan secure you can escort the bombers. But what is USSR doing up north while you’re doing all this? I’m guessing they’re coming down in a fair bit of force and liberating Chinese territories.

J4 for Yunnan is about right, but in my last game my opponent evacuated to Burma with 20+ troops. I didn’t have the army to fight through that. Didn’t have the transports to sail around it.

J5/J6 attacks, are they on Calcutta? Are you bypassing the troops at Yunnan via land, and if so what stops them from blocking at Burma?

I don’t know why there is fear of flying the USSR fighters to China. They can easily be flown back and from Suiyan they are threatening Manchuria. German SBs will normally be harassing England for the first couple of turns.

Regarding Finland/Leningrad, they actually don’t border each other. That’s why there is a need to position in Karelia. You only need to worry about amphibious and blitzing tanks from Poland.

Re: Tobruk. You might be right. You can still take Persia with the transport from India. EDIT: After Tobruk your mobile troops will be out of position for assaulting Iraq. If you do this, you might want some sort of buy in Stalingrad to take that down as USSR and leave the Caucusus troops in place, unless you are happy to bring across a lot of Indian troops for it and/or rely on plane survivors from attacking the destroyer in 96. /EDIT

My general idea is to have USSR help out against Japan and US help out against Germany.

EDIT: Regarding China, the 6 production from Manchuria and Korea is a big deal to Japan. They need about 14 inf and a AAA to have an even chance of defending the territory. That’s a lot of troops that aren’t attacking territory. Sure, they can thin it down a bit if they leave a lot of planes in Manchuria but then that is a lot of planes tied up on defence. My last game as Axis I thinned down the Chahar attack to 1inf but my opponent still retreated from Suiyan. It was surprising how much of a difference this made to the Chinese conquest. My thinking is by having a northern force holding firm, they can’t bother Yunnan as much. If you get into Chahar, USSR mobile troops are threatening Manchuria and they may need to put up a blocker. Which China can take down BTW. /EDIT

From my games, I’ll offer my thoughts (can’t say wisdom) on what the Allies should do, mostly by doing the opposite of the below:
USSR1 (assuming peace with Germany):

• Buy Artillery for Leningrad and mix of Artillery and inf for the rest.
• Move to Karelia with everything that can reach to force back Norway/Finland troops to the former.
• Move most of the Soviet Eastern troops to Sakha
• Evacuate the border with Germany
• Position to strongly defend the southern route to Moscow. Make sure you hold Leningrad G2 though. My usual opponent builds an IC on Western Ukraine and takes Ukraine and this is pretty hard to stop once it gets entrenched. So stop it from becoming dangerous. Ukraine is only two spaces from Moscow, as is Western Ukraine but Leningrad is three. Leningrad is less valuable in spite of the NO for Germany, harbour and airbase. Even the lend lease NO for USSR doesn’t swing it IMO.
• Send 4 mobile units to China: 2 from Stalingrad to Sinkiang and 2 from Moscow towards Suiyan and perhaps include planes to Suiyan, AAA from Russia and men from Caucusus.

US1:
If J1 DOW: Buy 3 TT, DD, troops (for the transports) and a few ftr and SB all for the Atlantic side. Rest is obvious. Add more warships if not enough to defend against Germany in Iceland G3. Claim Brazil if possible to still have 3 loaded transports ready to go. Otherwise go into Gibraltar/Morocco unless it is unobtainable.
If not at war: Buy 2 TT, DD, inf and art plus * for the Atlantic. Fly western US fighter to Eastern US. Probably 2 subs for Pacific. Whether to defend Pearl Harbour depends on Japanese positioning.

• = DD or FTR. If DD, then the ftr needs to be replaced either with one from the Carrier in the pacific or a UK/French one.
  Note: Carrier in the Atlantic is strong in theory but not practice. Carriers exist only to defend sea zones. There is no need for this early on the Atlantic. Works out only if peace exists until US2, where planes can stage off a carrier in SZ102 to London US3 or US4. That is only of a certain amount of usefulness.

China1: Attack Yunnan. Attack Chahar if less then 3 units moved there, depending on how many troops in Yunnan you need to take down - that can swing the need to apply the Chinese fighter. You want Yunnan a lot for the National Objective of 6 IPC. Only with the strongest force ready to attack Suiyan J2 should you back off from this square. Generally work out what is necessary to hold it (including USSR help) and do that.

UK1:

• Buy to prevent sea lion
• Buy ftr and land units in Pac (Calcutta). Leave 3 UK fighters in India to prevent Strat bombing or at least endanger the bombers doing it significantly. Intercept the two bombers if they still try to bomb Calcutta.
• Taranto.
• Take Persia using the TT from the Med.
• Move Pac troops East.
• If J1 DOW: consider bulking up Malaya with a troop and AAA via transport + landing the Tac Bomber there.
• If no J1 DOW: Take a money island, either Java or Sumatra. Use two inf to make it harder to take back. ANZAC can fly fighters there from Qld but they might just be lost.
• Leave one DD in SZ109 if it can survive an attack G2 otherwise leave it SZ106.

ANZAC1: usually need to buy second transport. You’ll need it. Fly Qld ftr to Malaya generally. Fly NZ fighters somewhere useful, usually Queensland. My next game I’m trying the Brazillian if not at war - landing troops on Brazil can’t be done by the US unless at war and UK can’t reach turn one anyway. ANZAC can reach turn two. That allows a minor IC to be built turn three.

Note about G2: if Germany attacks SZ123 off Iceland, then they are not in a position to cause convoy disruption on the UK unless they’ve divided their forces. That helps to make the UK stronger.

USSR2: Take Finland with your whole force if the US has a fighter on Iceland, otherwise consider a 1inf attack if Germany has retreated to Norway. Generally move Eastern troops to Amur. Move at least two mobile units to Suiyan, most likely keeping the planes there. If not at war with Japan probably can’t attack Manchuria quite yet as the US can’t reinforce if DOW is not done on J2. If Japan still holds Chahar this can be a necessity to attack depending on how many planes can be applied to Suiyan with/without the Chahar landing field. The rest you can work out.

US2:
If at war, take your 3 loaded transports to Iceland and land the 3 fighters there. Fly the Strat Bomber to London; if it is already there you can likely strat bomb West Germany or Germany (landing in Finland where it can also be defended by the US fighter flown to Iceland turn 1 and Soviet fighter(s) and troops. DD and Cruiser to defend the TTs (plus 3 plane scramble).
Strongest Naval buy G1 was 1 DD, 1 CV, 1 Sub. Assuming the German BB survived (and perhaps a sub), Iceland’s waters (SZ123) are only defensible with UK help, even with the airbase. If this is not possible, might have to consider holding off at Nova Scotia or London. The former possibility needs to be avoided quite strongly.

China2: Reclaim Yunnan if lost.

UK2:
May need to start buying navy in Quebec, troops in South Africa. Not likely to be useful to buy in London any more due to Strat Bombing, although can be considered.
Presume at war with Japan now. Hold Malaya as long as possible but Yunnan is more important. Stops the Japanese land route. Also threatens IC in FIC. Shan State is nice to have troops in to reinforce Malaya or retake it but these can’t be protected by Chinese troops so it’s a risky move.

ANZAC2:
Work to ensure NOs are collected.

No doubt many posters will disagree strongly with some of the above.

In fact, Brazil can be reached ANZAC2.

@Charles:

P.S. I think tacs are a bit overpriced. Maybe let them glhave 4 attack at all times  :-D

Or make them cheaper, like about 9. They’re pretty pricey for the capability they offer.

No. Needs to be worth 3.

You can build another minor complex in Queensland though. Not as good as building one on Asia but it is difficult to figure where. FIC, Persia or Iraq are the only real possibilities and they are distant possibilities.

@Charles:

Of course once Japan has Yunnan Or Shan or Burma intercepting is generally outgunning yourself.

Yes. But you can delay strat bombing until J4. Being able to invest in ground units tends to be enough to prevent Japan from being able to base fighters at Yunnan or Shan State; the best plan for strat bombing I think is buying 2 bombers J2 which can run with the two starting from China or FIC on J4. Or perhaps escorting the bombers with carrier based fighters.

Indeed, by J4 a fourth fighter could be obtained, either from Africa, ANZAC or purchased.

@Shin:

Who bothers to Strat bomb India?  I mean, why?  If Japan puts forth any effort at all, UKPacific is making about 6 a round.

As CDG said, if you have India down to 6 per round that is still nearly two inf per round you are reducing Calcutta by. Calcutta being a viable force makes it harder to take down Shan State and Malaya as well.

I’ve thought briefly about this idea but never really developed it. A few quick things:

I dislike attacking SZ109 - all those planes to take down 1 DD and 1 TT?
I dislike not attacking SZ91 - weakens Taranto or at least lets a DD and TT survive for Italy if SZ96 is not attacked with the Cruiser there.

If you modify it slightly to:
1BB, 1Sub, 1Ftr, 1Tac to SZ111 (even with a scramble)
1Ftr + 2SB to London
3Tac + 3Ftr to SZ110
2Sub to SZ91
2Sub to SZ106

This tends to promote scrambles in both SZ111 and SZ110 - therefore why not strip down the London raid to remove the fighter escort and bolster the SZ110 attack? Probability is that all three defending fighters will miss in the interception anyway (although the probability that both bombers survive is only 40%). Or you could send a sub to SZ110 and strip that from SZ91 (can’t strip it from SZ106). An interesting possibility is attacking SZ109 without fighter escort instead of SZ106. If any fighters join the combat they are then drawn off from defending against the SBR. That may indeed be the best way. You could even sink the DD. You really don’t want to retreat from SZ110 because the BB there is repaired UK1 without them having to react.

Attacking the naval base with a Tac doesn’t stop the BB in SZ110 from being repaired UK1 for a minimal expense.

@Spendo02:

I prefer sending Calcutta’s starting TT to Persia on UK1 with an INF and ART.

I use the one from the Med with an art only and leave the Indian one for claiming Sumatra, although a J1 DOW can cause a rethink to that. Perhaps go to Java instead and be reinforced by ANZAC? My normal opponent uses a J2 DOW.

I’m guessing you use the Med TT to take down the Ethopian troops.

I think you’ll find that this moves makes UK Pacific a much more viable power.

You’ll still no doubt get players that roll the dice for the 40% odds though. If that happens, I’d be thinking of flying the 3 ANZAC fighters to India. The one starting in Queensland can make Malaya on turn one, combined with the UK Tac Bomber might survive a J2 assault. I guess it depends a lot on what can be thrown at it though. 3 full carriers and 3 full transports would be enough to take down the 4inf and 2 planes.

I don’t reckon the transport is worth it. I used to do that but it is too easy for Japan to take the money islands back and also sink the transport. Unless you are thinking of doing something different with it?

In our games, we have taken to buying a third fighter in Calcutta. This seems to deter the Strategic Bombing raid on Calcutta J2; odds are 40% both bombers survive, 13% both bombers die, so mostly one gets through.

It is surprising how difficult this makes it for Japan to take down Calcutta. Do others out there feel that it is still worthwhile to roll the dice and attack Calcutta against the odds? Even if you buy a third bomber J1, it can’t join the attack until J3, where most likely it will be a replacement second bomber and still rolling against the odds. Do you then hold off bombing Calcutta until J4 when you can have 4 bombers and maybe deter the defending interceptors or at least be slightly ahead against them.