Posts made by lnxduk

read my post at:
http://www.axisandallies.org/forums/viewtopic.php?t=1377
it start out about how germany wins no matter what with standard rules

i have been trying to figure out what to buy for the best land attack for aa europe (to attack russia) for your money.
in regular, usually the best build is 2x as many infantry as tanks (this is for attacking power only). of course there are cases when this ratio should be slightly modified.
With europe, they added artillary making it alot more complicated. For amphibious assult, infantry and artillary, but what about on land?
Inf + Art = 7 ipcs = 4/6’s hits/rnd
inf + tnk = 8 ipcs = 4/6’s hit’s/rnd

so it’s cheaper to buy art and inf, same hits, but cheaper
but what about the fact that in multiple round battles, infantry die first, and if you have tnk’s and inf, then those inf are not as great a loss since they only hit at 1, where as in the force with inf and art, the loss of each infantry means less hits the next round.
So this makes me try to figure it out. Sure you can just build some of each, but expert’s can’t do that, they need the most efficiant build. Tanks and art have their advantages and weaknesses, what’s the best combination? All tanks and infantry, all artillary and infantry, or some tanks, some artillary, some infantry. I know it varies from situation to situation, so what would be a situation where you would build tanks, artillary and infantry all to use in the same attack? This is using calculated odds, not just what you guess.
thanks, I think that the correct builds of these three units could potentially make a huge difference in the game. Maybe it will become more clear what the best builds are once europe can be played online. What do you think?

could always equalize it by taking away allies initial bid
that way, suppose they give the middle east to usa only. Then usa get’s 8 extra ipc’s a turn, but it will take awhile before 8 usa ipc’s can counter 12 german ipc’s attacking russia.
if they give some of it to the uk, it will take less time for the uk to help russia, but germany now get’s to take away money from uk when it takes that territory. If they give it to russia, then germany get’s to take directly from russia.
In any case, it will make the territories in the middle east key since they do a triple IPC swing instead of a double.

i might add that the allies almost always control the uk seazone for the entire game. This is standard, and doesn’t mean they automatically win. First of all, germany can put alot of infantry in western europe. Suppose it’s turn 3, and uk has 4 transports, and usa has five, and they can all hit western europe. Germany can easily have 12 infantry (or 8 infantry and 8 tanks) plus 2-4 fighters and the aa gun. If they try to invade, they will either lose, or barely take it at high losses. If the uk buys a ton of transports, it has better chances, but it will severly delay movement of troops to karelia.

what i like to do, is put 7-8 infantry in western, and my tanks, and retreat from eastern. This way, you are using your tanks for defence which is very important, since you have a whole stack of them. Then you can hit eastern, and retreat from western, and then hit western and retreat from eastern. All the while, japan is getting big since all 3 allies are attacking germany.
The game usually amounts to, allies kill germany before japan kills russia. So as germany you usually turtle. Japan get’s big, and rolls for tech.

i’m pretty sure you need a transport to move between islands
the 12 ipc’s is 1 time only, it can be saved and used later, but you don’t get 12 more ipc’s

@Ozone27:

You should be using whatever spare cash on hand to buy 1-2 ARM each turn in order to build & maintain a useable counterattacking force with an eye toward eventually going on the offensive against the Axis.
Ozone27

I don’t think russia should build 1-2 armor a turn. If they do, that’s 10 ipc’s if russia is earning 21 a turn, they can only build 2 armor and 3 infantry, it’s much better to build all iinfantry. Tanks are offencive but very expensive. If the allies can hold their ground, they will win since they have a better production. Using this logic, russia should go all defence. This is true since for a conventional win, axis has to kill russia. There are numerous explinations of why russia should not build many tanks. If you can hold eastern, and you still have your 4 tanks, and you want to take germany, AND japan doesn’t control the 3 territories around russia, then you can build tanks. Otherwise, 1-2 once might be ok (it might not be either) but 1-2 every turn is a waste of money. germany can just kill your expensive infantry. You can read don’s essay on purchacing. It does the math.

i’ll play, although i have no idea if the strategy will work or not. I haven’t done any pbem games yet, i’ve just played with my friends, and on the zone. I really should know, but what site tells you the rules and stuff? I know the basic idea of it, anyway, i need west canada bordering labrador, so i guess 2nd edition. i guess for the bid, 2 inf libya, and an industry on western
now i expect to be crushed, as there has to be some huge flaw with this strategy somewhere, if there is, i guess i’ll find out.
maybe we can post each round on this board so people can see what happens.
thanks

usually only japan builds ic’s
if uk builds in inda, japan will eventually crush it, and germany breaths easy, usa might build in western, but that is endgame.
As japan, i don’t usually like to build ic’s especially when us and uk bombers are sitting in russia, but japan is the only country that can usually benefit from ic’s
limiting the bombing would help axis, especially since an industry in western wouldn’t limit anything but heavies. industry in australia if almost point less, unless usa goes pacific…
industry in south africa seems silly too, if germany has africa really strong, they will take the complex. if they are weak in africa, you can take it with india infantry and fighter and bomber and stuff. uk starts with alot that can hit africa.

7 tanks, 9 infantry 5 planes vs 12 infantry 3 tanks and 2 fighters.
you will hit 7-8, russia hits 6-7, assuming bad dice,
7 tanks 2 infantry 5 planes, vs 5 infantry 3 tanks 2 fighters
you will hit 6-7, russia hits 4
5 tanks 4 planes vs 2 tanks 2 fighers
you hit 4-5 russia hits 2
you take it with 3 tanks, this is assuming bad dice.
this is horrible, you have no tanks at all on turn 1, europe is weak, etc… and russia, while it has no air (really good), and no tanks (good too) it’s not always the best thing to do.
what i would much rather do is, attack with everything, and after 1 or 2 rounds of combat, retreat to eastern. That way, you get to effectively use finland troops, and you don’t lose your offence, you actually help it alot by saving the tank. of course, if your dicing the other guy, you don’t need to retreat.

i know germany doesn’t have an industry there, but the game would be more realistic if they did. It stops germany from trading western europe, and it let’s them actually use subs to their advantage. anyway, maybe you could agree with your opponent that you can get an industry there for only 5-10 ipc’s of your bid or something, you can compromize, since for 15 ipc’s it’s not really worth it. Anyway, this would hurt germany later on anyway. otherwise, would be fun to play anyway, just only do it on a newbie, because otherwise, i would just stack uk and tech since i don’t need to defend russia anyway. usa could stack and tech too, or get a navy, in the gulf of mexico. in 2-4 turns they will most likely get heavys any other techs will help too, if it takes them more than that, they would lose i guess, but i would tech with both us and uk. once either has heavies, the fleet is history. russia can focus on japan, and leave germany for the most part. i doubt russia could take germany, if they move into eastern the fleet can hit karelia. with no tech though, the allies would be hurt.
any ideas, tell
if my reasoning is wrong, tell why because i haven’t played it out yet.

i read a post a while back that as a variation, the allies would get the extra money from the middle east, this way germany would be much more likely to attack the middle east, rather than the standard stack allowing for a more interesting game. At the beginning of the game, the allies would divide the middle east up among themselves placing the appropriate country chip on each of the middle east countries. If germany takes it, the former owner has to pay. That way you wouldn’t just let give them all to russia. It would certainly help the allies out, but germany has an advantage anyway. What do you guys think of this, has anyone ever tried this?

if i am germany, i will definately save the money. It’s a waste to put it anywhere else, and where ever i put it, the allies will just counter. If i save it, it forces the allies to give the money to either uk or russia. If they give it to russia, that’s really good, since i can sealion them, i think the odds are slightly in germany’s favor if done perfect. If they give it to uk, then it weakens russia, so you can probably get away with a standard win with a slightly weaker russia. In any case, saving it is the best option for germany.
if i am allies and germany saves, then it stinks, but i will also save it and give it to the uk. I will probably be forced to put 4 infantry on the uk that is if germany saves all their money on turn 1. Depending on how bad the fleet’s are defeated, i might go for a fighter mainly for russia later.

if germany buys stuff with the 12, i will just evenly counter it.

it’s unbalanced, germany should not get 12 more dollars, how much it get’s should be bidded on instead.

please see my post on “a good german strategy” or something like that, it’s the long one.

ok you win no matter what
save your initial 12
save you money for the first turn, don’t buy a thing. move artilllary to germany, and infantry to germany, if you lose territory, it’s ok. Take out uk fleet with uboats, and have them ready to take all uk convoys on turn 2 (don’t lose your uboat fleet by spreading it thin round one)
Get your med fleet in gibraltar.
Now on germany round 2
if uk didn’t buy lots of infantry turn one, you win, you should have 92 ipc’s, buy 8 transports and a destroyer. Take all the convoys (with subs) , and you can invade uk no matter what. may need an extra destroyer depending on if the uk has a large air force. you move all artillary to germany, and infantry to fill transports. Be ready to hit uk with everything (including med fleet) with as many artillary as possible. you can hit it with 20 land units, and 6 fighters+bomber+bombards of destroyers and battleship. he needs 16 +infantry and fighters (us and uk) to hold. even if they hold with a few infantry, have stuff ready for wave 2. This means that you buy artillary to hit uk with you can use tanks too. uk will have a production of about 12 or something, so it will fall if they down’t build infantry turn 1. (if they build a fleet, they lose)
now, suppose he sees this, and on uk turn one, buys infantry. No problem, ignore uk!!
now focus on taking the russian convoy as much as possible, and buy 30 infantry!!
now you have 50+ infantry on germany at the end of turn 2.
at the end of turn 3, you have 60 infantry, and tanks and fighters on poland remember to build only tanks for the remainder of the game so they can catch up with your stack.
at the end of turn 4 you sit on belorussia with your 60 infantry, some artillary, and 20+ tanks
moscow will fall, it is impossible to defend moscow unless both allies send tons of fighters to moscow (but remember, uk has to waste turn one on infantry), i think germany wins 90% of the time this way, so it’s not much fun, i am looking at historical rules, or splitting belorussia so it doesn’t border moscow (the additional turn would give russia time to build what it needs to hold)
now you may be thinking, what about the us and uk, surely they can invade and take france, and be ready to take germany with all this tanks building stuff. well, it doesn’t really matter, because so what if the allies take france, they are still 2 spaces from germany. You can have 6-8 infantry and air to counter an invasion, but i think it’s better to let them in. Plus, it takes forever for usa to get stuff to where it can invade the us, block the us fleet movement with subs, the uk fleets are damaged turn 1, and you can hurt uk income a lot with your subs for the first 3 turns. It takes 3 turnes before they can invade anyway. It’s practically impossible to take germany that fast.

ok, this is my crazy strategy, it would need a bid of 15 or more though, and west canada has to border the eastern canada seazone
you build an industry in western europe with the bid, and if it’s 18, you put an infantry on libya
G1: you buy a sub, maybe a few infantry(you shouldn’t need them since nothing can hit germany ) you kill all the british fleets, you move your med fleet west attacking the battleship. You take gibraltar, so the uk can’t counter your fleet, in africa, move your forces west, and you use your tanks for defence, maybe even leave eastern europe(have tanks ready to smack it next turn), depending on russia. Land all air in western with 2 infantry. Now, your fleet is in range of hitting britain, but you almost certainly can’t take it. Place the sub in the med with your battleship (industry in western)
japan does pearl harbor, with 2 fighters on their carrier.
G2: buy a carrier, and 2 transports and infantry. Attack the sea zone west of spain, if US sent it’s transport there(to block you from hitting uk fleet in north sea), if you can hit a uk fleet in the north sea, DO IT! Now, you might worry about uk hitting it with fighters, but you have 2 subs, 3 transports, a bb and a carrier.
J2: land fighters on carrier. Now you have a fortress!! keep buying subs and infantry. you threaten to take eusa and britain and canada at the same time. This might not work so well but would be fun to try. Also you could build the fleet off of gibraltar round 2, and take egypt round 1. Japan lands in egypt with a fighter, turn 2 you build the carrier, and it can land on it from egypt. the key is, you have to save money round 1 with germany, it doesn’t really hurt you, you can buy 4 infantry, and save the rest. That way, if it looks bad, you can just build up your army or whatever. The complex in western is great as you can stick subs in the north sea to block fleet movement, this can help alot, even if you don’t use the fleet idea. By saving money, you have 3x the options turn 2.

i do not intend to sell anything, it would get stolen anyways, and it would prevent some people from playing it. I basically want to kill hasblow.

this would work, even though the allies would have a larger gap in money, the axis would start with 20 fighters, i still think that it might help the allies a bit too much since big battles would turn out differently. Maybe with a bid for axis.
also i was thinking of a computer variation, where the units can be percentages. And no dice. For instance, a tank attacks an infantry, for the second round, there is .7 tanks attacking .5 infantry. then .67 tanks hit’s .33 infantry, and the .5 infantry hit’s .16 tanks leaving .5 tanks and .16 infantry. We can say that if there is less than 1/3 of a unit for the defender, they may retreat it. This would work on all levels, you could send .1 infantry to take an empty territory, and the other .9 to attack. Maybe only divide down to 6 parts. Any ideas?
Also, another idea for a computer variation, blind axis and allies. you would get recon planes to fly around, and let you see stuff, but otherwise it’s blind. maybe roll dice to see what type of units you see with each plane. also, you wouldn’t be able to attack with 1 infantry just to see what they defend with, you would have to survive one round of battle (live to tell)
i am seriously considering adding these to a computer version of axis and allies.

Yeah your right, they could do that, you can still use your transports to take archangel, or iceland i think the atlantic is too small, look at the med, maybe it’s cause i’m part german… And, ur right, germany can’t invade england, as long as us and uk work together for the first few turns. I think taking and holding the convoys are more important now, like destroying uk’s fleet, you can still build the transports, to waste uk’s money and later use them as fodder in the atlantic. if you get a battle ship and a transport on ever convoy, you win. or even just the uk ones. also i think that middle east looks good, because of the +8 and caucasus +4
if germany places a uboat on the coast of the us, can us not build there?
i think battle ships are key in this game.
anyway, i’ve changed my mind, allies can win.

I realized that, but i also saw that the russians need at least 2 turns to mobalize, if they attack poland at first, they will get it, but i can stack quite a few infantry on germany from surrounding regions
i only need half of my military power on the continent to overtak the uk if i use my navy just right. the rest can defend germany, i don’t need any money, i can get uk in 3 turns bu taking all it’s convoys, and invading, if i take all it’s convoys, it con only stack so many infantry on it’s capital (3+recaptured convoys) and if i get unlucky on the first attack, or second, i can do up to 3 invasions. and russia can’t take me by the third or 4th turn.

I just got the game, i played germany for the first time, and i found the perfect strategy. Trouble is, i think i’l missing a rule or something.
Anyway here goes:
First turn Germany buys 4 transports, and 2 destroyers
it attacks the english fleet with it’s subs and attacks the english fleet at strait of gibraltar with the battle ship and the destroyer and a transport loaded with 2 infantry from tyrrhenian sea.
germany also uses it’s air force in the first attack on the north sea english channel and celtic sea
german subs do not take any convoys.
Now that england effectively has no navy (except the one in canada and east med) it leaves england extremely vulnerable. Move infantry from the interior of the axis to germany and poland
place transportsin baltic sea.
2nd turn buy 4 more transports
and load 8 men onto the first 4 and attack england unloading 10 men, and bombard with 3 destroyers and 1 battle ship. Also use the air force in the attack. If england holds(most likely doesn’t not unless us and uk work together to put all their forces in uk and build all infantry there, then move more men in to netherland, and france.
3rd turn invade again, england will fall for sure, and you will be able to hold ityou can also put subs in mid atlantic and halifax and denwark strait, to slow the ship ment of american troops to england one turn.
It’s over how can allies win? uk starts with 4 infantry.