Posts made by Genghis Khan

@generalTrible:

I really wish this would die out I’m sick of seeing it pasted everywhere

contribute to the discussion or just leave the thread.

Ok i understand it but I don’t get how you got your 1.61 factor for the baron formula with hits.

don’t get me wrong I like the victory token system better than OOB because OOB promotes throwing everything at a single theater and abandonning the other one (usually the one USA attacks). The only disadvnatage I see with victory token system is that you can never lose the token so you just need to claim Africa once with the Allies and then you can abandon it. Same with philipines, retake it once and then abandon, no need to keep it. No incentive to hold on to the territory.

I also have doubts on how we can use these formulas because they state that two infantry are better than a tank (both on offense OOB), not taking into account movement which is wrong according to AACALC

Also I have a question, how come for combined units you take the average value for example your carrier example, I would make the power value 10 on defense (8 for fighters +2 for carrier), but instead you took the average (8+2)/2=5. Same with the cost, you went with avg between 16 and 20 (18) but I would calculate hte value for a unit like this:

OOB CV with double fighters
Cost: 36
Power (defense): 10
Hits: 4

I get value of 1.63 which makes sense, it’s better than the DD.

I have used the baron formulas that take into account the hits in order to come to the following conclusions:

Taking the benchmark DD value of 1.125 as the basic ship: Cruiser should cost 9.79 IPCs and BB should cost 18.28 IPCs. Alternatively a BB with 5/5 stats should cost 20.43 IPCs. (Assuming special abilities of ships are equal)

aircraft carriers defend better than a cruiser and the planes on the carrier can attack the land in an amphibious assault…EVERY ROUND, so obsolete.

Baron, how did you get the 1.61 factor in your formula that takes into account number of hits?

cruisers have been proven by AAcalc to be obsolete because they are inferior in combat and their ability is worse than the DD’s ability.

Ok so I’m confused how am I supposed to apply the Vann-Baron-LArrynx formula? What do I do with the 1.454 number? And where is the derivation  for the formula? Or is it just made-up?

with philippines being only a 2 on difficulty scale, my idea was to never take it with japan and just convoy it with subs. Has anyone ever done this with success?

to be honest, all I do to get an idea of how good a unit is at offense or defense is calculate the offense power divided by the cost and the defensive power divided by the cost. So tank is 3/6=0.5. Infantry is 2/3=0.66. I also consider hits per cost so tank would be 1/6 = 0.17 and infantry is 1/3=0.33. This shows that infantry is better than tanks at defending on a one to one basis.

I did that for every unit and I found that the air force is by far much more powerful than navy when it comes to what you get for your money. The reason is that bombers can compete with loaded carriers (Bombers on offense is 0.25 and loaded carrier on defense 0.28, bombers hit/cost is 0.08 and CVs 0.11). But air force has versatility. Bombers can hit any boats, strategic raid, attack big stacks with a huge range of 7. However navy has the advantage of being able to tip carriers and BBs so in the case of carrier spam next to an adjacent controlled territory where the defending planes can land, the defender can simply tip all the carriers and destroy any attacker. And the ability to heal is another factor to consider outside of the math.

The ability to tip carriers and BBs neuters the submarine first strike ability (So no need for DDs) and I have yet to play a game where a sub first strike actually worked (i think it happened once). And most of the time you don’t want to attack with air force as well because then his fighters can defend at 4 and hit your planes and you arent allowed to use subs as casualties. Meaning it’s most of the time beneficial to not put a DD in your fleet, just spam loaded carriers.

If you look at the math you will see there is no offensive tool to deal with spam of loaded carriers. that’s why you usually see two big fleets in the pacific and nobody wants to attack because the attacker will lose. Similar to AandA Classic when both sides had huge stacks of infantry (there were no artillery back then and tanks defended on 2s) and this resulted in a stalemate. Here it’s the same: nobody wants to attack a fleet unless they have a big stack of bombers that outnumber the carriers.

I don’t understand why using a calculator is considered cheating. If I used an abacus would that be cheating? How about using dice to count up my attacking power? How are you going to justify preventing me from doing that? How about using my fingers to count…where do you draw the line?

@GeneralHandGrenade:

@larrymarx:

I will never play A&A against a person with a calculator in their hands. If the player doesn’t have the guts to play the game without a crutch, then they should go back to playing Risk or Checkers.

That’s a very silly proposition to be honest. You’re willing to add up the numbers in your head but refuse to pull out a calculator for large battles? Why? You have a tool, so use it. It’s like saying I cheated on my differential equations homework because I used a calculator. It’s a tool that helps you but you still need to use your brainpower and judgement/experience to make decisions in the game. The calculator is not a magic wand that will win the game for you.

the US can just take a battleship and hide it in iceland for the whole game. You might as well give the axis a victory token for capturing washington.

Yes I agree there are many factors that calculators do not help us with like the ability to move an extra space with a tank or combined arms or what the defender chooses to remove as casualties in some cases, there are many more examples of this. However it can help us predict the outcome of a battle and how many units we are left with if we decided to do a big stack battle. How many units we have left is important to determine if we retreat before the end of the battle or if we take the territory (based on potential of counter attack)

it’s tricky because if you don’t bring enough into 111, he scrambles and you lose too much. bring in too much and you lose your BB

I don’t understand your reply to my post shadowhawk. My point I was trying to make was that it is not worth defending coastal territories in this game unless you have no choice (don’t want to lose your capital for example).

Example: In anniversary edition if the allies take France, they receive 6 IPCs for invading it. In this version, they take normandy and get 2 or southern france and get 3, but get destroyed on the counter attack. So it’s not worth defending a territory worth so little money PLUS you have to defend against the AIR FORCE and BOMBARDMENTS. When you counter attack you can bring in your own planes and don’t have to suffer hits from bombardments.

what? no way 6 MI is better than 4T on offense…I don’t need AAcalc to know that. Look: 6MI have 6 combat punch but 4T have 4x3=12 combat punch.

YG have you also changed the cruiser to 4/4? It seems like it reading your example. Also why do the cruiser and BB get a bonus when fighting air and sea but not only air? Don’t we want to reduce the effectiveness of dark skies against sea units? Seems like this idea would force germany to buy only bombers and not attack with subs as support.