Let’s look at this a different way… how many non-muslim nations are we in -conflict- with?
How many governments of non-oil producing Muslim nations are we in conflict with? Are the conflicts actually about religion? Are the real motivations of the terrorists being obscured (both to them and us) to hide the class conflicts they are really rooted in?
Prometheus wasn’t a sequel.
At best it was a “prequel”… ;)
Prometheus kept crawling up its own backside. Best execution of a downright awful script I’ve ever seen.
I agree that drone strikes are simply another long range weapon and I am not saying that the pilots have no honor.
I am not going to open the other can of worms that you’ve correctly identified.
Fair enough- I am not trying to be combative, just debating. Thanks for your input.
We’re good. We’re in the same game and the same page of the rulebook. :-)
I agree that drone strikes are simply another long range weapon and I am not saying that the pilots have no honor.
I am not going to open the other can of worms that you’ve correctly identified.
The issue isn’t just about the method. Drones are merely a method. The thing is if the method is easy enough and removed enough and clean enough it is easy to do things you might not if you had to do it yourself and it becomes really easy not to worry about whether those things should be done, if you’re right to do them.
I’m thinking Stark in the very beginning of “A Game of Thrones” with the deserter. Or maybe Patton with his dislike of push button bombing, “Nothing is glorified, nothing is reaffirmed.” Star Trek, “A Taste of Armageddon.” Too much removal and you easily lose what it was you were after in the first place.
You are right, we should put away all our guns and fight with swords. Isn’t the point of modern warfare to preserve the lives of countries citizens? Why put people in harms way if you don’t have to? I do not advocate purely autonomous robot fighting like the Terminator- of course there has to be a human element to it, but it doesn’t mean we shouldn’t use modern technology.
No one is debating the efficacy of drones.
I have already addressed your points earlier in this thread. I’d point you to Garg’s earlier post pointing out the issue isn’t the drones. It is whether the use of drones constitutes war or murder and whether we’re executing criminals before they’ve committed a crime.
The question is whether or not what we’re doing with them is right, whether the powers that be are being honest with us and themselves.
My point about Stark is when a man who’d committed a capital crime needed to be put to death, the man with the power and responsibility for making that decision went out, looked the man in the eye, heard what he had to say for himself, and then swung the sword with his own hands. I don’t think any of the people making the decisions on drones have that kind of honor or even the concept of that kind of honor.
The question is not whether or not we are using the right tool but whether we should be doing the job at all.
Thats like saying Tanks are to overpowered, you cant use them.
That’s what they say about Nuclear, Biological, and Chemical weapons. So what’s the diff?
Anyways…
The issue being discussed here is the difference between war and murder.
Another side of that equation is the moral question from “Minority Report”, which is - “is pre-crime criminal indictable?” The problem being that everyday people are being sentenced to death, just because of who they associate with, regardless of if they have committed a crime or not; because the balance of probabilities suggest it’s only a matter of time before they “carry out an act”.
That is exactly the ethical question. Nicely, put.
:lol: :-P :-P :-P
My faith in Gargantua was well placedA would be conqueror of the world through visual terror has got to have more than 1 “bullet” to fire
Now you all know - OPEN UP THIS THREAD AT YOUR OWN RISK
Protective eyewear strongly recommendedFRIMMEL!
We need the antidote, and quickly
Just scroll back up and drink Christina in again. Breath deeply and mentally pat yourself on the back for the witty thing you said to put that smile on her face. Feel her grip on your arm as she uses you to support herself while she adjusts the strap on her high heel. Breathe deeply and realize how wonderful she smells and think of all the other ways you’re going to put smiles on her face.
Make that place real in your mind and heart and know the confidence and self-mastery that James Bond knows.
And say with the stone cold calm, the terrifying calm, of the man who has been to and seen darker places than villains who want to see the world burn for their own sadistic glee visit in their most horrid nightmares, “Is that the best you got?”
My poll has run to completion and this thread served its purpose many posts ago.
Does anybody here have the authority to close the thread??
I’m afraid after a thread has been posted it is no longer yours and your defined purpose in creating it not the most important consideration in its continued existence. You may have given it life but you immediately cease to control its destiny.
It is not wrong to see it ‘early.’ It has been out in many countries for some time already. Full spoilers are around and about on the internet.
You should see the BBC’s Sherlock, though.
“Sherlock” is awesome. Their riff on “A Scandal in Bohemia” is a must see.
@ABWorsham:
Star Wars 7, already know its gonna be horrible….
Do you believe that Disney will look at some of Lucas’ failures in the newest three films and not follow in those errors?
I hope for a good new series.
JJ is a hack. He is a barely competent purveyor of product cinema. His films are consistently underwhelming. He is however a terrific marketer and generates lots and lots of hype. Hype puts asses in seats. Hype makes people think things were better than they were to justify how much they bought into the hype.
Here’s a line from a review on the new Trek film which has released abroad already,
******Spoiler warning. ******
"That Into Darkness still has a tendency to warp its own logic is also a problem. While plot-holes can be forgiven when Abrams is hurtling his audience through space at breakneck speed, the final act descends into the sort of fan-service that throws the arbitrary nature of certain narrative decisions into much harsher relief. "
Really, doesn’t give me high hopes for Episode 7. Maybe that’s just Orci and Kurtzman who won’t be writing Episode 7. Judging from JJ’s Trek pics he does seem to have a good idea what makes for a good Star Wars movie. I really hope I’m wrong and JJ excels at Star Wars and that keeps him in a galaxy far far away from Star Trek.
Just couldn’t ignore this one, could I?
Nooooooo.
I just had to know why a thread about a lock of hair had gotten to three pages.
Couldn’t just leave it alone.
Here this should help with the horrible mental images this thread has produced.
Isn’t there a rule or a law against posting such atrocious pictures ?
I feel like i should sue your ass Garg for that last pic…
I think we should make him and IL double date them. 2 each. :mrgreen:
I’ve no problem from a military perspective, a getting it done perspective, with using missiles or drones or what have you. I agree with the points made in that regard so far. They are an efficient tool.
I merely point out (and think the survey is skirting around in hopes of remaining apolitical) that tools can be subtle traps and we need to be wary of them. I work in an engineering department. One summer we had an intern. He knew the CAD program. He understood that tool quite well. Didn’t really get how to make drawings that told machinists what they needed to know.
Spellcheck comes to mind. You still need to proofread. Anybody had a cashier that couldn’t make change without the cash register?
In the case of drones, much more so than Tomahawk missiles, I think we’re making efficient use of our tools to make drawings machinists can’t use.
The game is not “to far gone.” It is fun with OOB rules.
This game doesn’t have a reinforcement chart because there was so much complaining about and dislike the ones in D-Day and BOTB. If you did an actual survey the reinforcement charts would easily be a top five dislike.
House rule whatever you like but there isn’t a thing in this game that needs salvaging.
The issue isn’t just about the method. Drones are merely a method. The thing is if the method is easy enough and removed enough and clean enough it is easy to do things you might not if you had to do it yourself and it becomes really easy not to worry about whether those things should be done, if you’re right to do them.
I’m thinking Stark in the very beginning of “A Game of Thrones” with the deserter. Or maybe Patton with his dislike of push button bombing, “Nothing is glorified, nothing is reaffirmed.” Star Trek, “A Taste of Armageddon.” Too much removal and you easily lose what it was you were after in the first place.
I haven’t made time to brew of late and probably won’t this summer again. Hopefully I’ll do my knockoff of Old Fezziwig again this holiday season. Big fan of Kent Goldings as I like to brew a British Bitter.
Matrix Revolution.
Simply a bad movie irregardless of its place in the franchise while the other choices are simply not the best in their franchise but manage not to be travesties of cinema. i.e.– Indiana Jones and The Temple of Doom has its problems but it is a decent movie all on its own. But having to live up to Raiders of the Lost Ark it is a disaster.
@Cmdr:
BEER to me is Big Flats. Really helps bring out the yeast flavor in pan pizza too! (6 cans for $2.90 US is really a decent price, and it’s rated very high in Consumer Reports so it’s not bargain basement either!)
That price point is what teenagers drink and that is the definition of bargain basement. A beer costs that much even in a dive bar. There’s probably more unused hops in my freezer than hops in that swill. There’s probably more beer in my piss.
Yeah…even that kit isn’t as simple as you say. Too bad I don’t use that crap. I go all grain and in a much larger quantity (around 6-7 gallons). It typically takes about 6 hours to do, and is more or less cooking. But it’s probably Greek to you.
I would also advise anyone interested in brewing at home not to waste their time with The Beer Machine or Mr. Beer and so on. If you’re just going to go extract you can do much better than what you get with those things at a reasonable compromise on time and quality with all-grain homebrewing.