@F_alk:

Yup, your forefathers murdered native americans and black slaves. Seems like that is less sick.

as my name clearly suggests, im russian so i dont know wtf you are talking about ( native americans?)

as to the second, more sensical comment made by guerrila guy:

the “killing” that you speak of was done by The N.K.V.D, not “the russian people”, and i should add that the statistics about this killing are greatly greatly exagerated in west (particularly in the usa)

heres a good paper on the topic: http://www.soviet-empire.com/ussr/viewtopic.php?t=75http://www.soviet-empire.com/ussr/viewtopic.php?t=75

Soviet Union : a country whose secret police sent people to hard labor centers for long periods of time, many of them innocent of any crime.

Nazi Germany: a Fascist, Rascist state, who’s ideology called for brutal repression and ensavment of all peoples deemed inferior “Untermenschen” (Slavs, jews, roma, gypsies) and implemented Mobile killing squads (EinsatzGruppen) to commit mass murder in occupied eastern europe directed at jews, Russian officers and intellectuals. ( these units were filled not only by Gestapo and SS, but by commen wehrmact soldiers, picked out from their divisions)

The germans policy towards Soviet Prisoners of war was inhuman, and not fit even for farm cattle. Barbaric treatment of all “Untermenchen” was taught and encouraged.

The Third reich is the only Modern state to have completly devoted its self to the systematic extermination of whole races and ethnic groups.

the germans of today are normal people, but i cant help but disgusted at the fact that their forefathers were sick murderers.

glad im not a german :D ^^

@marine36:

back on topic. we would have won without russia,but it would have been much harder. what would have happened if hitler hadnt double crossed his “partner” and russia had fought with the germans?

in 1940 the germans attacked france. France fell in weeks.
in 1944 the germans were in full retreat on the eastern front, they had lost most of their military to the russians. Their ranks were now bieng filled with men to old for regular service in the VolkSturm and boys as young as 12 in the Hitler youth.

The allies landed on june the 6th and outnumbered the germans at least five to one on every beach and in every concentrated effort, as well as having total domination in the sky.

despite these alarming figures, the western allies had tremendous difficulties advancing through france and it took them several months to punch through the demoralised, outnumbered, and beaten germans and liberate north western france.

Hitler lost more than 80% of The Wehrmacht in the Soviet Union.
if there had been no war with russia do you really think that the allies could even withstand such might in England, much less try to land in Normandy??.

Thats not nessisarily true. Hitler hated Communists, and wanted to invade the U.S.S.R but that has little to do with why he invaded it.
1940, while the Germans and Russians were at peace Russia had a war with finland which went very badly for the red army. This, along with the Officer Purges of 1937 gave the Germans the impression that Soviet Union was weak and could be easily defeated. Hitler attacked the U.S.S.R because he thought he could win. Had he realised in 1941(as he had in late 1942), that an attack on the Soviet Union even if maby possible to win, would result in such tremendous losses of German manpower he never would have started the war in the east. And neither would Stalin.

In short, Hitlers decision to attack the U.S.S.R came mainly from military power, his political reasons were obvios, but he never would have acted on them if he hadnt had the means.

The above is a fact, if you dont belive me look in any history book or WW2 website. The Credit of defeating the germans must go mainly to the soviets and the british. in 1940 the britsh fought the germans alone and withstood crippling city bombardments as well as staggaring losses in the atlantic dealt by german U-boats. The British were close to collapse on June 22 1941 when the bulk of the Luftwaffe transfered to Poland For Operation Barbarossa: the invasion of the Soviet union. The Soviets Halted the German offensive in front of moscow in december 1941 and began to push the Germans back. The Soviets fought the war Virtually on their own until june 6th 1944 when the allies landed in Normandy.

Now if you look at the numbers youll see what im getting at.
D-Day Was successfull only because the germans were on the verge of collapse and had lost any hope of winning the war in the east.
When the Allies hit the coast of France in 1944, the German defenders were understrength, outnumbered and totaly demoralised.
The Nazis had already lost the war when Tom Hanks got off of his landing craft in Saving private Ryan. :)

The total amount of geman divsions created throughout the war was 247

Roughly 15 Occupied Europe, 4 fought in north africa and 30-35 were stationed in france from 1944-45. That leaves the rest, about 190-195 divisions, Fighting on the Russian Front.
if The Western Allies had as much trouble as they did in 1944 with 30-35 divisions, what could they have done against all the other 200 from 1941 onward ?

i should also point out that while American war-supplies were much appretiated, the amount sent in the crucial first years of 1941-42 was tiny, for the first half of the war the American economic aid added up to about 0.05% of Soviet Industruial Capacity.

Could the allies win the war withought russia? not bloody likley.