Posts made by elevenjerk

I don’t know Cow but from reading his posts on this site I think he would hate being the Allies against you Stalingradski :-)

Does it help if the Japanese march everything straight across China?  They could be at Tsinghai/Kansu J4 with air units nearby to kill off the Siberians on J5.

It would certainly help except I believe Japan has a big enough task holding off the 5 countries.  I like taking China down to almost nothing before US gets involved, then take DEI’s, then try to withstand a full Pacific buy from the US.  In the meantime, Germany should be able to make its way through Russia and its all up to the oil fields after that.

Could you elaborate as to how you accomplish that?

Stalingradski touched on it a bit.  I always buy 6 inf and 1 fighter UK1 to help prevent Sea Lion.  After that I like 2 mech 1 tank in S Africa.  I always take the CV from India to bombard the Italians in ethiopia on UK1. Then use the transport available to get whatever I can back to cairo on UK 2 if anything is left in Ethiopia (leave one starting inf in S Africa to join up with a mech or armor to hit Cairo on UK 4 if necessary).  Rarely but sometimes will I take the transport from India to help. Â

This is all assuming Germany is not helping.  If they are helping it makes it much more difficult.  I actually prefer when the axis do that though because that means they are not spending the money to wipe out russia.  I buy the MIC in Persia most games but if Cairo is secure enough early I like to buy it there.  When I have 2 MIC’s I always have a hard time with money trying to get stuff to all three places (London,Cairo,Persia).  Just Inf in the two Minors is 18 of your 30 to 35 IPC’s.

When I am the axis I usually like to build a mech and tank I1.  Take over yugo,bulgaria.  T2 take over greece, build another tank and couple mechs and move the armies toward russia for some nasty can openers if available.

Of course you have to take care of the Med the best you can and make a push toward Cairo but it always seems like a hopeless cause for me even in the best scenarios.

Depending on when you let the US into the game is when you start building inf.  I like to give myself 1 turn in advance to start stocking up on inf and art once in awhile in order to have a little attack power.  As they stockpile you gradually move guys to France or Western Germany (wherever needed).  The longer you can allow Germany to spend in Russia and not have to fortify the homefront the better IMO.

Italy can normally take Egypt either round 2 or 3

Without German help I haven’t seen them be able to hold it for more than a turn.  I always buy infantry and a fighter UK1 (sea lion) and after that I make sure cairo isn’t taken or kept by the italian.  Even getting diced on my Toranto I was able to have it back by turn 4

I found it very tough.  UK only has so much to spend.  US has to have 12 tt’s available in order to get 6 units a turn to Cairo and still threaten Europe.  That is very expensive and requires very little spending in the Pacific.  If you US can’t give Japan problems then it is very tough to win if the Axis don’t make any major mistakes.  Once the Economic battle falls in the favor of the axis it is over.  The distance it takes for the allies (Mostly US since they are the big money) is too much to overcome when the axis make more than you.  Germany at 70+ (when russia falls) 80+ (with Volgograd as well), Italy around 12-15, Japan around 60 to 70 depending on DEI.  That is hard for US to fight on both sides with 70-80 IPCs.

Yea, the other problem is that it allows germany to build as many as 20 tanks to meet in Caucasus along with the already pressumably destructive force they had set to go into Russia.  In the end it boils down to my first response, slow them down as much as possible and say your prayers in Russian:)

I’m talking about is the mistake some newer players make of trying to maintain a northern and southern Russian army… it’s a cool concept, but it’s easy to isolate and kill one of them… and then Russia is most certainly doomed.

Agreed.  Whenever possible you have to combine troops and slow the main territories with bryansk being the most important IMO.

The map layout doesn’t favor getting from Moscow to Caucasus ahead of a German stack.  I don’t think Russia has any way to get to the Mid East without being attacked and wiped out long before they can arrive.

Thats what I thought when I first read that but they can get away if germany is in bryansk.  Move to Samara, Germany can only hit them with tanks and airplanes if Italy can opens.  No can opener means they can’t get to you.  Next turn move to Kazakhstan where germany still can’t reach you cause they will be in Tambov or Rostov.  Next move they can join up with UK/US forces in Caucausus.  Could work really well.  Would have to see it played out.

Splitting armies is typically a no-no

This is 100% true except that with a well executed G1 the North Armies have no choice but to retreat to Archangel/Vologda/Russia.  Depending on how much German army is left in Eastern poland and Baltic States, it is really hard to take back Eastern Poland and Baltic on R1 unless you got some good dice on G1.    If the Russians counter in those two territories, and win, than it is easy to wipe them out on G2.  If the russian forces move to Belarus and I have a chance to take them out I will every time even if it means losing some tanks and an airplane or two.

Someone mentioned a tactic of attacking as Russia to take out some of the forces in those two fronts and then retreating to Belarus.  That could be a beneficial move as there would be no ability to counter attack for Germany.  Of course you are banking on another factor of luck when it comes to the dice:)

BJCard -

Wasn’t trying to be a smart ass, just saying that with a dedicated G1 I don’t believe there is anything you can do.  I like the ideas of Russia giving up the capital if they have a chance to get south and help there.  I haven’t seen the opportunity for that in our games but will pay more attention next time. Â

There is nothing to do.  Slow them down best you can and say ur prayers in Russian.

I am going to post a J4 strat soon.  When I feel like typing out a novel:)

Take a peek at that.  There will be tons of what ifs… but it does show how you can knock china down by the end of turn 3.

The allies can really dictate a lot of it as well.
If Russia makes themselves available turn 2 or 3 then you probably take them out.  If US leaves navy available to take after turn 1 then the whole thing changes.  If Anzac doesn’t protect at all then on turn 3 you can make them pay.  If India attacks in order to restore yunnan to the allies then japan has a bunch of available transports to take islands with no fear of the US for another turn or 2.

Look for the thread and you can rip it apart on that one:)

I am not sure how you can have a transport or two sitting at Japan and have a large Navy at the Philippines

You only need one transport.  3 planes in japan.  A destroyer or 2 in sz 6 and 1 destroyer in sz 16.  If US wants to commit its navy to sz 16 and all its planes to take out sz 6 stuff thats fine.  As the Allies it has never been good for me to set up shop in sz 16.  Too limited on what you can do next.  With Japans fleet at phillipines and most other planes in Kwangsi if the US moves to sz 6 it will surely be death.

ANZAC would happily trade transports for islands.

With Japan fleet at phillipines it would only be a trade once, twice at most.  Japan could easily take the island back while wiping out whatever Anzac navy has built leaving guys on Java.  Anzac only making 19 ipcs at the most (assuming they have New Guinea and snag Java). Anzac buys another transport and a destroyer maybe with an inf.  2 guys won’t be enough to take back the only island they can get to (Java).  If you don’t buy a destroyer, all Japan has to do is leave a destroyer by Java so your transport can’t get there.  Say you had purchased a MIC in Queensland.  Any naval unit you placed there could get taken out easy by the navy at the phillipines.

All these options you bring up are very viable options for the Allies and they all work in certain situations.  I just disagree with the general notion that a J4 could never be successful.  I will work on a guide and try to make it half as good as the ones Cow puts out and maybe it will promote people trying it.  If not, no big deal:)

If you sent all of that to India (especially all 4 carriers), than ANZAC will be able to take some DEI and the US will be virtually unopposed in the Pacific (they will have 2-3 carriers of their own).

Also-The UK and France have a DD each in the Indian ocean that can block any attempt on India for at least a turn.

Thats fine.  Not even necessary to take Calcutta.  I’m just saying I have many options with all the transports.  With all the Islands.  I could hang out in the phillipine and pick of any anzac transports.  I could send guys to the mainland.  I could send guys back home.

knp7765

Glad to hear somebody else has seen this happen.  I think I have been misunderstood on the thread.  I never said that you do this move repeatedly.  I always like to have a transport at home with a couple guys ready.  US moves to queensland with no transports available at Hawaii or Western US than I plop a couple guys in Alaska or Aleutians depending on if they have units that can get to Alaska.  Another good time is if they have 2-3 transports in Hawaii poised to take over the carolines. It usually requires three transports cause I like to land a couple planes in there.  Thats when you put the guys in the islands or Alaska so they have to make a decision.  Carolines or 5 ipc bonus.  if they just send tt they won’t get Carolines for another couple turns.  If they leave it alone then they only make 65 -67 ipcs a turn.  This turned more into my J4 strat guide, which now I am thinking about putting in the time to make one.

ghr2

I think you were the one that wanted me to get on Triple A?  I have no idea how it works playing somebody else but I will see if it still comes up on my computer and if not I will reinstall it.  As long as you can be patient with my inexperience with the system I would be down for a game.

SO what if less guys in india?  japan will not have the manpower to take it, and contesting yunnan/shan state robs japan of a landing spot for planes.

You don’t think 8 loaded transports, maybe 10 if everything went perfect, along with 8 planes (due to the 4 AC I would have) and 2 bombers wouldn’t be enough if UK took most of their guys to Yunnan?

What is happening in China?  Normally people stack Szchewan and trade Yunnan every turn with Japan until they can’t trade it anymore or Japan can’t take it.

you push them back so they control only the last line of territories.  By turn three unless you get diced a whole bunch you can usually take out Szechwan.  Yunnan gets traded most every turn yes.

What if India stacks Burma on turns 1 and 2 and then turn 3 attacks Yunnan, Shan State, etc?

Thats great, more guys not in India.

What if Russia attacks turn 3 as well as the UK?  You already said most of your fleet is at Caroline turn 2 and presumably many of your transports/army are in the south ready to hit the DEI.

If they attack Manchuria then I will have 5 loaded transports available in sz 35.  If they attack Korea then they would have gotten really lucky on dice, plus if you put ten+ russians in Amur on turn 2, then I take whatever I need to on turn 3 to wipe out those russians.  Everything obviously changes after that.

Why does ANZAC need to worry again?  Not only could they block the Japanese fleet, but if Japan sent everything down there the US may have a free hand in the north (not to mention way out of position).

This is all very true.  It is 2 turns away from japan taking the capital.  They could though, so unless you are certain they won’t it seems like a bad idea to buy a bunch of navy that they could wipe out if they chose to.

Again… I didn’t want this post to be a J4 strategy guide.  I just wanted it to be about the diversion tactic.  Cow is the master of Strategy Guides.  I will let him take care of those for you.  I am sure if he found the patience he could come up with a bitchin guide for a J4 attack.  He just loves war so much that he can’t get himself to do it.

Turn 2, the US fleet can easily sit in hawaii without worry.

They could if they wanted to risk a fight against Japan.  All depends on the purchases of US.  If you leave a navy at Hawaii that I thought I could wipe out then I would probably take it.   Either way it doesn’t matter if Japan doesn’t attack till turn 4. Â

eleven I would really like to to see how this would turn out.  You should get on Triple A.

You can call me jerk since its my first initial and last name, I won’t take offense.  As far as Triple A.  I put it on my computer and played against the AI (which was a joke) and, long story short, have had some computer issues since.  I would be an awful Triple A person anyways since I can really only play a couple hrs a day.  It takes a week at least for me and my buddy to finish games due to our schedules.

Just keep in mind the island trick when you are the axis and see the problems it poses.  I didn’t mean for this thread to turn into a J4 strat guide.  I just wanted to tell people about this annoying axis move.

How does japan make 70 by turn 4 with out going to war by turn 2 or 3

To add to my last post.  You have 8 tt after turn 2 with 3 loaded transports and most all your navy at carolines.  This makes the US have to stay in sz 10 unless they want to get destroyed.  It also makes Anzac have to think about losing their capital.  It would be crazy to try and build transports at that point.  You have the one that probably went to Java to get the 4 ipcs on turn one but to buy more with Japan right there seems not smart to me.

J3  Should have around 45 ipcs to spend.  Buy 2 more loaded transports for 28 ipcs and spend the rest on whatever you want.  I tend to buy another AC.

Move half the caroline island navy down to phillipines and the other half (usually trying to include a couple of the AC’s in order to use planes on any islands that may have been stacked with more than 1 or 2 inf) down to Java with the 3 loaded transports.  You have to take into consideration where Anzac subs and navy may be, if any, and place navy accordingly.  You also have to account for the Combination of Anzac and India.  What can India send there?  BB, Cruiser, destroyer and some planes?  All of it can be accounted for.  Take the 5 loaded transports in sz 6 and send them to sz35 with half your navy.

At this point america will probably move into hawaii because why wouldn’t they.

Now your set up for a J4 attack.

3 loaded transports in sz 42 (Java) with at least 2 AC loaded. 
5 loaded transports in sz 35 (Phillipines).  Planes can come from Kwiangsi to fight the phillipines battle if necessary.  In our games its not usually necessary cause we fly the us fighter to Guam on turn one to get any stray transports.
2 loaded transports in sz 6.

2 in sz 6 can take out the Phillipines.  The 5 in sz 35 can go anywhere except sumatra (since you don’t own phillipines naval base yet).  The 3 in sz 42 can take Sumatra pretty easy unless Anzac/India put all available resources into it.  That would be pretty dumb since it would only stop japan 1 turn maybe from collecting the full DEI bonus.

With the freedom you have at that point I am sure most people on this forum could figure out a way to get……

Kwantung  3
Malaya      3
Sumatra    4
Java        4
Beorno    4
Celebs      3
Phillipines  2
FIC          2

25 ipc
5 ipc  NO bonus
26 ipc regular income
2 ipc from russia
8 if not more from china

Japan can be at just under 70 ipcs on turn 4

66 ipcs.  I didn’t say they would make 70.

Just realized after typing this novel we kind of got off topic:)  Oh well, its been fun.

This is all based off a J4 attack.

J1  3 tt 1 art.  Collect 42 in most cases taking Siberia, Far East, and the standard China territories.

J2  2 tt 2 Inf (you have 2 left over from taking the rest out to Carolines with your initial 3 tt purchase)  4 art.  6 left to spend.

that alone is 8 transports after turn 2.

China can be tough to take if you don’t commit serious troops to Asia

I didn’t say you take china out but you can close the road down and keep them at bay for a few turns pretty easy with what you have.

If you left significant troops in Manchuria to guard against Japan then you aren’t taking China out in 4 turns

Im not leaving troops in Manchuria.  If Russia wants to break the pact early, great, I take them out.  I keep guys in korea for the counter if they choose to do so.  If russia wants to put more than 6 inf in Amur, I break the pact and wipe them out and things may change a bit after that.  It is very easy to keep planes in range for that while just focusing on china.

You have to be aggressive as the Allies against Japan

US 4 is the first time they can do anything so its not really a consideration.

Isn’t ANZAC/India/US hitting any undefended ones?

US can’t do anything. If the UK/Anzac are able to take out maybe 1 unprotected transort to start the war and keep US out of the war till turn 4 no matter what, great.  Japan can take the islands even earlier along with kwantung and still collect the 10 ipc FIC bonus until the end of J3.

Well, with Japan putting troops in the Aleutians, they aren’t putting them in Asia, making things easier on India/China/ANZAC and the US

We are talking about 2 inf.  Well worth the headache for US

How do the US lose 3 turns if they send their whole fleet to the Aleutians?  They can hit Japan from there, Hawaii, and/or Carolines depending where they are

1 turn to take the islands back, 2 turns to get back to Hawaii because it is 3 spots away.

You say you can block them, but you only block combat movement, they can send planes/bombers to his the Japan SZ and then Noncombat their fleet there (again, depending on what Japan has to counter with).

The block allows you to not have your capital threatened.  If us wants to move the navy into sz 6 thats fine since most of my japan navy will be placed in the Phillipines if US decides to move the whole navy over there.  China is mostly gone by turn 4 and with 8 or so transports in the south the UK will be mostly in turtle mode with very little offensive available to them.  If they have spent their money on offensive units than it makes it even easier to take calcutta and US can hang out in sz 6 all they want.  I just place guys in the capital to counter anything us can bring with the limited transports available.  If they have lots of transports they don’t have lots of navy.  Also by turn 5 the US can’t possible have that much stuff to threaten unless they bring Europe resources over.

typically I never have enough Japanese land units in Asia to beat both China and India (and Russia if they attack me turn 2 or later).

If russia attacks turn 2 then you could easily wipe them out.  I would actually want them to do that.

If the Japanese took the Aleutians I would not bother fighting for it, but I would move a couple mechs/Inf to Alaska or Canada.  If Japan has its fleet in the south, than the US could go take the Aleutians if they wanted without fear of losing their fleet.

That would be perfect for Japan. You only make 67 ipcs.  The mech and inf in alaska do nothing since you have to have transports to get to the islands and thats 6 to 8 ipcs doing nothing.

They take their fleet to the islands, thats fine as well since they are 2 moves away from getting back to Hawaii to pose a threat.  Japan just blocks sz 7 so they can’t get to the capital.