Posts made by Deaths Head 420

I Think they should just cost more rather then limit the number, because sooner or later there will be a thousand different pieces out there, all original 1 of a kinds,  i think i need scratch paper to keep them all straight. The Iowa Class is cool Idea  I like it better then the Essex  NA although that is an interesting Idea. 14 is to low for what it is 15 is About right. especially if they can buy it every turn.

I’m not sure if it is ever been posted before, but what about Fletcher destroyers, I mean If where throwing Specific unit types around,
Fletcher destroyer- US may Decide to purchase for x amount of IPC value above normal cost of a destroyer to recieve a 2-3 destroyer with all the same abilities as a normal one.
sorry for the alien talk but I’m not sure what the going rate is, 12?

I like the Idea of getting China in on this one but the wall idea needs some tweaking.
Realisticaly The wall would not stop at that time a Modern Army With Airsupport.

Well played another game, and I still have to say this map is GREAT! It ended this time as an allied victory, mostly in part to my opponents timing of a major Push into Russia and the fact he delayed on pushing on Moscow. ( he took Stalingrad instead). 
We have yet used NA’s  but we do use a tech tree 12 techs large. Any one still working on this. besides me.

Ok responding to the mech infantry. In my opionon I think that " Mechanized Inf." should be as it is as a U.S.,  N.A. If you are looking at it as a tech so every one could possibly have a mechanized army. Insert,tried and true Tank Rider rules, Each tank may transport 1 Inf.  Call it something else if the name don’t fit right. yo could get real creative and allow a tank to pull an Arty. or Inf. one or other or maybe both.  The US should honestly have the only True Mechanized army as per OOB revised

Well thanks allot . I appreciate it but you don’t have 2,  :-D but cool. anything else I can help with?  :evil:

Also I have tried to access these rules and my puter won’t download them or it doesn’t recognize the program or maybe I am just plain dumb at computers. please help Interested in these new rules. :roll:

Beautiful I love it. I didn’t realize you guys were using a diff set of rules then me, my bad. Other then that part of confusion on my part. These rules work good@Imperious:

Partrooper (PARA) / Airbone Assault Infantry / Assault Infantry
Cost: 4 IPC
Combat: 2/2
Move: 1

Transport Plane / Cargo Plane
Cost: 8 IPC
Combat: 0/1 (in AARHE, combat 0/0 dogfight 0/1)
Move: 4
Carry 1 paratrooper in combat move. Carry 2 paratrooper/infantry in non-combat move.
(in AARHE, possibly carry 6 IPC)

Wow I feel like i actually helped with something people on the site might actually use in a game.
Don’t forget that the trry has too leave after Def. AA fires or before first round of combat if there is none. This is to prevent the Air fodder Problem. And a few other stipulations that need to be agreed on that have been previously posted earlier on this thread, Although I think we are all pretty much on the same page with this one now.

Cool a couple of great twists I like some of these ideas.

Lets see Here,

@Imperious:

OK here is another refined idea:
Paratroopers:

attack 3 (first round) on all other rounds or types of combat it attacks at 2
defend at 2
moves 1 space ( only if used as regular infantry) otherwise it cannot move ( it fights to the death)
One paratrooper can be carried by transport plane and dropped into enemy territory
each paratrooper costs 5 IP

Definitely Attack 2* Def. 2.
I feel a first round three is to strong and makes the unit too powerful, Now they are a of destroyer and tank strength. Too strong on the board for what they are. I see where your going with the confusion factor so how bout this–
*Movement of one space is good but if they don’t para drop they attack at 1 like normal Inf. that is how you are using them.
If para dropped attack on 2.
Transport part is cool
Cost should be 4. They have the potential of being a 2-2 like arty. It’s harder to produce a Tiger 1 then a Fallschirmjager  so 5 is too high. Also the extra dollar goes to the extra training and equipment they require.

@Imperious:

Transport plane:
no attack
no defence value
cost is 8 IP
can carry one paratrooper for drop into enemy territory (done only in combat move) moves 4 in this case
or carry 2 regular infantry as friendly transport (done only in non-combat move) moves 6 in this case

I like em Except 2 things.  Why no Def. value? I understand why the plane itself should have no def. value, it makes sense. But the only time the plane will ever roll a die is defending while it’s on the ground. But I bet That the Airbase they are parked on has something there that can shoot. So I think a def. of a 1 is appropriate, and  Since the trry departs after AA shoots they will never engage enemy units.
The extra NC movement is way too much and is a huge tactical advantage for the allies.

Tekkyy, why defend at 1? They’ll be just as stubborn as any other Grunt with what ever they have. They already have to fight to the death.

Whats this Defender retreats default stuff. Crazyness, Airplanes maybe but nothing else. Any way whole other topic.

Ok how bout this.

Paratroopers- cost 4, attack 2, defend 2, move 1.
Arty’s. by themselves, have no effect on Paratroopers at all.
If attacking like normal Inf. and there are two reg. Inf. and 1 Arty. Paratrooper may attack at a 3. (Like Marines).
If para dropped they must fight to the death, no retreat.

Transport planes- cost 6, 0/1 move 4. 6 w/ LRA.
May Deploy 1 Paratrooper. Movement stops after deployment, applicable AA fires. If trry is casualty, paratrooper is lost also. Transport departs after AA fires. Still must follow normal flight rules.
May noncombat 1 Reg. Inf.  In both cases the “cargo” must start in same space as trny.
Airtrans.  may do 1 or the other above not both.
If heavy bombers becomes available you may pull a glider, otherwise no benifit. both passengers must deploy in same space.
Airtrans cannot make a combat move without paratroopers aboard.

Optional- Gliders. If there is an arty or Inf. in the same space as a friendly atrny. you may choose to pay 2 IPC. If you do you may air drop with paratroopers. Arty does not shoot for first cycle of combat, ( it’s assumed that it’s being set up), may still be a casualty though. Inf. from gliders fight as normal. Inf do not get a Arty bonus first round of combat if the arty was glider borne.

I don’t like 2/2 because I was thinking besides the initial surprise element, why should they fight BETTER than normal infantry? Are we saying they are elite troops or something?

I am saying Yes. Paratroopers are defanitly Elite Troops! :-D :evil: And all countries should have an opportunity to get them.

If people want only 1 paratrooper per plane the cost should be 6 per transport, 8 is too much then.

What do you mean “if stuck in Aerial Combat” The only way I can see them being stuck in Aerial combat is on the defensive or the Paratroopers owner decided not to drop on first turn.

@Imperious:

so what we have is paratroopers costing 4 each attacks at 2 defends at 3… zero movement?
transport plane costs 8 carries 2 men… moves 6 defends only at 1

is that correct?

No they have movement of 4, 6 with LR Aircraft.
everything else Yes

@Imperious:

question why do they defend at 3? They really have no supplies to keep fighting once they spend the wad overcoming the defenders… I guess its compensation for 0 movement?

Thats what Paratroopers did, take and hold. " We’re Paratroopers Lieutenant, Were supposed to be Surrounded"
Thats why they defend on 3. And in that, that is why they can’t move. Plus it would mean Fortress Europe was worth crap in the sense of a 2-3 piece if they could move like conventional Inf.

I find that A one round ability is not enough to really matter, unless a miracle is rolled. plus is one round of 3 really worth 16 IPC’s, No I think not.

We have tried it that way 1 round, it’s how we originally started them doesn’t benefit them much at all, so we switched.

@Imperious:

So if they win the battle how do they move out of the territory?

They have to be picked up by transport plane.

During the non combat phase a transport may move two Inf. that start in same space as transport a max of 4 away, the transport does not need to return because it’s a friendly space, It however may use all of it’s movement if any left, after dropping off it’s Inf. cargo. Call it a Touch and Go.
If the Air tranny did not make a combat move it may retrieve 2 paratroopers as long as the paratroopers themselves did not act during the combat phase, and are within the movement limitations of the transport.
Reg. Inf. Must start in same space as tranny, to even board the transport.

Paratroopers must be in same space as Air transport to perform a combat move.

Definitely the fight is to the death for the paratroopers

I don’t think there should be a limit on how many are dropped, more along the lines of how many are produced a turn should be more appropriate if you want to limit them. Personally I don’t think that there should be a limit on them. If a player wants to use their para troopers in the numbers you are thinking thats alot of money. Too drop just 4 paratroopers, it costs 32 IPC’ to produce it. so to do the massive airdrops that you or any one else could be afraid of, won’t happen until late game and that player will have nothing else, they spent all or most of their cash on Airborne… So you could Plan for it.

Also, Paratroopers should be able to land anywhere providing that the Air tranny has a Friendly space to land in. What if you wanted them to support your main thrust with a blocking maneuver, you should be able to.

No it’s 16 IPC’s 8 for air trane and 4 apiece for the paratroopers.
Remember the rule above Airtranes canoot make a combat move without paratroopers aboard, otherwise it could Non Combat 2 regular grunts to afrika

Now this is what I am talking about, people throwing in Ideas for this I love it. I understand that the “Airborne Arm” of these militaries was relativly small in comparison to the rest of the military strengths of each nation of that time, so a cap on how many are able to be on the board is a good Idea, but it should also be of a size that in it’s own right should be able to do semi sizable operations on there own. Ex. the germans took Crete with almost nothing but paratroopers, yes they had horrific losses, but most of that was do to there organization of there paratroopers.  What I mean is, When the Fallschirmjager jumped into combat unlike their allied counterparts, they were not combat ready. They jumped with no weapon or ammo aside from maybe a luger, when they landed they had to run to ammo and weapon crates that jumped with them, then they could fight. Anyway Do you think the Allied landings would have been successful at Normandy with out Para troopers? Probably not.  Personally I think that they were the reason the landings were succesful was because of them, all of the confusion that they had caused, and disrupting german artillery fire on the beaches.
IMP Leader, Ilike that there is no retreat but that is why I decided that they should not move.
As far as the transport planes are concerned, I think they should be represented by a piece on the board with stats comparible to regular sea borne transports.

As for them being abused, I can kinda see were you are going. Although Germany has had it and they haven’t found themselves in a position to abuse it because they are so expensive and can’t move on their own. An Air Tranny is like a water tranny, expensive, but with the combat limitations and def. of 1

My friends and I have all used Paratroopers in the way I have described them below
@Deaths:

Paratroopers cost 4 ipc’s they are a 2-3. Paratroopers cannot be moved except by transport plane.

Transport plane Cost 8 move 4, They are a 0-1- May transport or deploy 2 paratroopers or transport 2 reg inf.
During non combat if there is a paratrooper in range and has done nothing as well with a available transport, the transport may fly out and pick up the trooper for later deployment. Long range aircraft applies to air transports also move 6. Bombers Can carry 0 paratrooper’s because they were not built for that. Imagine the 101’st jumping en masse into normandy in B-17 flying fortress ,LOL, or even a JU 88’s dumping a load of Fallschirmjaeger all over crete, that Poo is funny! AA shoots as normal and if transportplane is a casualty the paratroopers die also

Put this in as a tech roll or something they go as a package

Now the piece that has everyone concerned, The Air transport. AA shoot normally at them with the exception that you roll 2 different colors of die. White dice figs and Boms.  Red dice Airtransports.

1.Def. AA fires. Take casualties from appropriate colors. If any airtrans are hit, remove as casualty with cargo aboard them.
2.paratroopers may deploy
3.as soon as paratroopers are deployed transport departs
4.If attacking player chooses not to drop on first round of combat, they may choose to take the airtrane as a casualty at the cost of the plane and paratroopers still aboard.
5 Air tranes may not make a combat move without paratroopers aboard them.= 16 IPC- heres you fodder problem, fixed

@Micoom:

Does this also mean, that no more then 1 transport plane at a time is allowed? Or is it OK to buy extra planes, even if the first one is not shot down yet??

Yes you can, folowing the rules for airtranes.

Why? Just cause the piece didn’t come OOB from Avalon Hill. I do not understand why everyone is so hesitant on new pieces, It makes a whole new way to play the game if you are lucky enough to get it.

Like I said paratroopers do not jump out of bombers, It makes no sense, Should we jump out of the middle gunners position or maybe the ball turret what do you think?

thanks for that tid bit.

@ezto:

well done then. Im talking about LL btw.

What is LL? all the acronyms are confusing sometimes.

the best way to do OP. sea lion is to get your allied friends high then tell them you want 32 IPC to place on board b4 game starts. JK

Our game went 4 days between work and off time

I hear what you are saying, but if you delay your major thrust 1 turn it will do you more good then harm Like I said Withou Collonial garrison the allies have a hard time  getting troops or equipment there so there is no real need for all of the troops right away. After turn two, Japan builds nothing but men and tanks with a occasional fighter or ship. If you play with bids and are conerned for the lack of troops, give your whole bid to JPN, Germany’s got enough. the only perimiter you need to go for is the liberatin of china, and russia

You are right if you want to make heavy pushes early, but if all you want to do is make sure your new IC is secure. You can send your trry crews on RR. so what if they are not all used for 1 turn  not that big of a deal yes it’s pretty and expensive and not doing anything, think of it as a refit for the trnny, it’s getting new deck chairs. You do not always need to be pushing forward. sometimes it’s better to wait, (not real long though) then going balls out right away.

AS much fun as pearl is unles you attack the ships off of west coast and pearl, Pearl is a waste of time, 9 out of 10 times the American navy runs and hides in Atlantic like Jen has stated. When this happens,. what is left for japan 2 deal with––NOTHING, a couple of Occupied spaces that can’t be reiinforced heavily, So you do not need all the grunts right away, build your Needs first two turns, and then your wants. Japan Needs Trrny’s. Japan Needs atleast 1 IC on mainland. Japan needs 2nd Bomber. Buy it You will use it a ton. Acouple of fighter and 2 bombers following Russian-Japanese Front all the way to moscow. The front will move fast this way.

You see Japan Can go the first 2 rounds with minimal Ground troops cause all they have to do is secure Mancuria for there IC Kick US out of first chinese space and hold till turn 3. That is when you  go grunt and tank city on russia till they fall. The second bomber is to give your already respectable airforce a little more power. I use this Strategy quit a bit and it seems to work well. Germany uasually doesn’t start really pushing on USSR until turn 3 or 4 and thats when u send in japan to pull resources out of eastern russia to deal with it. Unless GB sinks the lone tranny in turn 1 you put 3 tanks and 8 or 6 grunts every turn into russia couple that with Germany’s push and russia won’t last long, garanteed. If you need too pull men off of islands first turn or two, by all means do it, by the time US or Britain come and take it it will be too late to matter. I love Japan it is my Favorite country to use, They make or break axis power. Go Japanese tankettes,T-34 is no match,LOL.
And your right about build cost first turn I meant 2 tanks
Yes Japan will be short a few men and tanks but that is irrelevant because who has an IC near them that they would have to fear a large scale invasion of any of there territories. Unl ess Collonial Garrison is in India this strategy should work well. If there is a garrison, Don’t invade russia until the garrison is gone, buy 3 tanks instead of bomber thats all, still get IC and still Manchuria is the place to go you should be able to take India by turn two if you focus most of your attention there.
I have tried many different Strategy’s with Japan, with none being more succesful then ones similar to this