Posts made by Chompers2

My opponent went for Austrailia as Japan first and then sent Germany after India to try and win the game for the Axis.  It didn’t work for him but there was a window of time I was feeling the pressure.

Well if it at least focues the USA to focus on heading to Europe instead of Japan then that would give the Axis an opening to win the game in the Pacifc.

I think if USA just decided to head for Japan anyway that the Axis would win the game in Europe under this scenario.

7. Collect 2 IPCs per turn for each of the following three territories that Germany controls: Iraq, Persia and Northwest Persia. Theme: Access to strategic oil reserves.

These bonuses make the middle east account for 10 points rather than 4.

It is possible to take Turkey G2 if Italy takes Greece but probably too costly because it would have to be done with tanks and the Air Force.  That is what my opponent did in the game we played.  So Turkey probably falls G3 then instead.

I think Germany could still build the Baltic Fleet G1 and keep Britan in check after the Air Force is used with subs to waste most of the Royal Navy.  After that UK will be not be bothering Germany any time soon with the US engaged with Japan early game.  Remember my theory was really to use this to counter a 100% Japan maim by USA.  I wouldn’t want to use it in a game where US is heading to Europe first.

I think Italy would be doing rather well with Germany able to help them out in the Middle East by going through Turkey.  Also it would expand the German Economy.

I just played a game where my opponent did a true neutral crush to try and win the game.  He went after Australia and the money islands with Japan and went through Turkey with Germany in an attempt to sack India.  I was able to stop him before he got the needed victory cities and he conceded but it did get me thinking.

My idea was to try the true neutral crush as Germany next time but remove the going for India gimmick and instead head for Russia as well as boosting my economy.  When Germany does a true neutral crush G2 taking out Sweden, Turkey and Spain not only does it boost their IPCS right away but puts them in position to go for 3 five point bonuses fairly quickly.  The Causcus, German in Egypt, and Stalingrad are all double very quickly if the Germans move their Army south into Russia as well as send fast units through Turkey.  Also the Germans can get quick access to another 10 IPCs by taking Iraq, Persia, and Northwest Persia.  If all these realistic objectives are acomplished Germany will have over 80 IPCS if not more to spend when USA is done maiming Japan.  Not to mention Eqypt will all ready be in Axis hands and Italy should at least be in the 30’s.

Russia may take a little longer to kill with Germany committing a small force to lock up points in the middle east. Yet with the huge Germany Economy shouldn’t they be able to then finish Moscow, while Italy starts pumping Infantry in Europe to defend it for when America is done with Japan?

What do you think?

@shadowguidex:

If you can’t take VCs with Japan, then of course any American strategy will seem uber.

Here is my generic Japan Strategy, which I heavily modify depending on the flavor of the day…nothing special.

Build 3 Transports with Japan on J1.  Attack into China with planes and infantry, leave all your Artillery on the coastal territories since these Artillery will be used for all your Amphibious assaults - don’t bring Artillery into China it’s a waste, use aircraft or just dont go far into China (defined at more than two zones inside China).  Move your bombarding ships south with your transports, keep the carriers and about 4 aircraft at Carolines - always have the replacement planes ready for each carrier.  Build 4 transports on J2.  J3 you attack with fleet and 10 transports each loaded with inf and art.  Attack Hong Kong by land, Phillipines and all 4 DEI by amphibious assault.  USA will have their fleet at Western or you just attack Hawaii since you’ll win in J3 no problem since their builds are largely on the East Coast and take two turns to unite at Hawaii.  J4 take Malaya or crush towards Sydney if most of your infantry survived.  Don’t leave any transports undefended since those 10 need to last the remainder of the game.  Your fleets should be at Japan, Carolines, or Phillipines at this point.  Now it’s too far out to game plan, but next step is either Calcutta or Sydney - you have 10 TRN to get the job done and plenty of aircraft.  As long as you use Naval Bases, Japan can whip around the Pacific quickly and efficiently.

The problem I see with that is you are not replacing your land forces in China and you will be losing some every turn to Chinese attacks.  Also UK Calcutta will also be able to help kill your land forces out of China.  And then the US will show up with it’s super mega fleet.  That will force Japan to spend almost all on fleet and that will most likely result in you being kicked out of the 2 victory cities in China. Especially if the 18 Russian Infantry attacked which I think is a very good idea if US is going Pacific first.  Japan is just facing too many opponents and it is around this time that it’s back begins to break.

Once Japan is locked out of the 2 victory cities in China it is very hard to get back in.  China can really fortify each turn with the rules that allow them to place units anywhere in China.  Even if Japan manages to cap Sydney it won’t mean much with Asia on lockdown by the Allies.  At that point US can cruise to Europe and save the day.

I am not sure the all Pacific Strategy breaks the game though.  I am still trying to make up my mind but I actually think it is harder to counter when USA ruins the economy of Italy first with the help of the UK.  In the last 10 or so games of Alpha I have played the Allies are hovering at about an 80-90 win percent ratio.  It does not seem to matter who is controlling which side as the results are coming out the same.  So my current thinking is leaning towards the idea that the Axis still need some minor buffs.

Every game I have played that someone did not at least threaten Sea Lion turned into a loss for the Axis.  The UK can just get up too much no good is they feel zero pressure.  The consequences for Italy are too severe.  Funny thing is almost every game where Sea Lion was pulled off successfully by Germany resulted in an Axis loss also.

The only time I won a game in which I Sea Lioned was when I also pulled off a J3 India crush as well.  My opponent who is normally pretty good and probably a little better player than me played a poor game that day.  By knocking out both UK’s I was able to put enough victory city pressure on both sides of the board, combined with swining the IPC advantage to Axis.

@Gargantua:

I’ve improved my German/Italian strategy to the point that if the US doesn’t committ anything to Europe, the allies will lose - and lose bad.

Even if Japan is wiped off the board by US8, which, isn’t likely to happen.  Without intervention of somekind by the US, into the mediterranean or otherwise, the Axis will win in Europe - nye guarunteed.

This can be compounded with a micro Japanese campaign against the Russians in the east - eroding the red income.

Try it on the Europe board.  Take the U.S. right out of the game.  The Allies don’t stand a chance.  Thats also considering Germany gets 2 less IPC’s from the Paris capture, and the reds give a full committment against germany, with no troop draws to japan, and no chance of income erosion in the east.

All theories of a 100% American committment to Japan are hereby debunked.

And just think of the Japanese counter options, if you know the yanks are coming, and you only have to play a delay game…

I Axis have lost some games and won others when the US went Japan first in the games I play with my friend.  We have averaged about a game every 2 weeks since Alpha 2 came out.  The tactic we are having more trouble overcoming is when the USA reduces Italy to no longer being relevant first while flying fighters to Hawaii.  Japan can still take Hawaii but it seems to cost too many resources with a bunch of Infantry and Fighters sitting there.  Once Italy has been wrecked and their are US subs sitting in the Med, it seems very hard for the Axis to win in Europe so the US then bounces to the Pacific.

I am starting to think the game might still favor the Allies a bit.  Not saying it is anything like OBB but there are some hard Allied warplans to beat.  I have seen stomp Italy first be very effective while the US then bounces back over to Japan to make sure they can’t win the game.  At that point the Axis are playing with 2 strong countries but 1 next to broken one.  At that point it is hard to win the game on either side of the board victory city wise.  I have also seen reel in Japan first work really well as also.

That being said I may have been playing with too much of a focus on winning victory cities and not the economic advantage.  Maybe it would be better to focus on economics first and victory cities second.

@JimmyHat:

I think Frank has also learned why the Romanian IC is bad.  It telegraphs your moves so that UK knows it doesn’t have to worry about a sealion and can hit Italy hard.

You might have been okay Frank if you had bought fleet G1 and perhaps pushed your offensive on Russia back a turn.

You might be right about that but I wanted to give the Romanian Factory a try for myself.  I was amazed at how much it allowed me to just own Russia.  That being said it was too much for Italy to overcome after losing half their Navy and then have the UK building troops in the SA complex all on UK1.  The Baltic Fleet would have changed all that.

@Cmdr Jennifter,

I just played a game where my opponent went all in after Japan first with the first 5 or 6 turns of US spending.  I lost the game though I was able to sack Moscow with Germany.  The problem was Italy got beat in Africa because I never built the Baltic fleet as I choose the Romanian complext G1.  Since my opponent knew I was not going to Sea Lion he sank half of the Italian Navy UK1 and built troops to fight in Africa from UK1.

Japan and America did Naval dances in the Pacifc and I eventually ran away from him to try and help out in Cairo but it was too late as at the point America could spend 100% of its points in the Atlantic.

The highlight for me was the Romanian Complex helped me blast Moscow to the ground even though he had over 70 units sitting in Moscow when the final battle took place.

So I got beat like you said would happen :( I am not sure I played as good as I could of but does appear that attacking Japan first as the Allies is a good way too go.  I was probably too focused on getting Victory cities and not focused enough on winning the economic advantage.  Though I would also argue that stomping Italy to the ground is also a good way to good for the Allies :)

Gargantua,

This tactic does sound like it can hurt the Russians.  I have been able to sack Moscow as Germany in the games I played but it is very hard and I don’t always succeed.  There have been other games where I died in the Russian Winter.

I don’t think I could use the Italian aircraft against the opponent I play because he is usually pretty adamnent about reducing Italy to next to nothing before he strikes anything else.  On UK1 he sinks half of my Italian fleet.  Which hurts a lot but the main problem is the US fleet he pulls out of the Pacific and sends into the Med along with some subs and transports to end Italy’s war efforts in Africa.  Meanwhile he flys fighters to Hawaii and transports Infantry there.  It would still be possible to take out Hawaii as Japan but would take a lot of resources for very little economic gain.

I have countered by trying to win the game as Japan and I have killed India J3 with the purchase of the Hainan Naval base.  Yet even then by the time I set my sights on the last victory city Italy has been stomped to irrelevant and the US is back in the Pacific.

@Young:

I have seen 2 games where the UK spent all their resources trying to defend sea lion and when they eventually lost it, they were left with zero money and very little units on the Europe board. Needless to say that their game experience for the next 7 hours wasn’t much fun, I don’t want that to be me.

They may be true but I believe that if the UK can really bleed Germany enough in Sea Lion that it increases the chance greatly that the Allies will win the Game.  If the UK just does fully defend itself then Germany will win Sea Lion will the Air Force intact and with a ton of troops sitting in the London.  This makes taking London back for the US a very tough job.

I have a question involving Japan.  When they are not at war with the USA can they move ships through sea zones with American Ships and end their turn in the same sea zone as US ships?  Also can Japan move off the coast of USA terriority when not at war with the US?

@Krieghund:

@Cmdr:

Keep in mind, if Germany goes Barbarrossa over Sea Lion it’s abilities to stop the British fleet drop to near zero and it’s abilities to maintain its own fleet likewise drop to zero.

@Cmdr:

And if Germany decides NOT to go 100% against Russia, then what’s the point?  You don’t have the strength to do both which means you won’t accomplish either.  All that changes, really, is the rate in which Russia retreats in front of you, laughing at your tanks as you get stuck in the mud and run out of fuel.

I disagree.  I have taken down Russia without a 100% commitment from Germany.  Germany can spare enough resources to keep UK contained for a few rounds without sacrificing its efforts on the eastern front.

I think the game is pretty darn balanced from my experience.

I have also taken Moscow without a 100% commitment from Germany.  I have also lost Moscow to an opponent who did not give a 100% German commitment.  Russia just does not have the starting units or economy to go toe to toe with Germany alone.  If I am attacking Russia as Germany I build Artillery first to go with my huge starting Infantry force.  Then as the march goes in I reinforce by spamming tanks with Germany’s large economy at that point and then as the fall of Moscow becomes imminent I seal the deal with some bomber purchases that can also be brought back to help keep the other Allies in check.

I have found that if the US goes in the Pacific first with all it’s resources it might be able to maim Japan first but the situation in Europe will just get out of hand if the Axis players on that side of the board have done their job.

@Gargantua:

The question is raised, is it worth giving up 10 of your own infantry, to get a 1 - up move on Mother Russia in terms of front line logisitcal replacement?

My answer is no.

I would probably agree if the Romanian complex is used for only attacking Russia.  I also think the Baltic Fleet G1 provides the most bang for its buck.

That said I think you can do some funny things with that Romanian complex late game once Russia’s fate is sealed.  One idea I mentioned was to attack Turkey and drive Tanks to Cairo.  Another would be to attack Turkey, build 10 subs from the Romanian Complex and then use the Air Force with the subs to sink the US fleet in Med.

I know it is considered a No No to attack strict neutrals but I think the consequences are not as severe late game and it can be worth it to achieve an important objective.

I think the Romanian complex could be useful in late game to help the Axis gain the final victory city when time is of the essence, as US is working to deny Axis victory.

In a game I recently played I did go Pacific first as US and was successful in maiming Japan.  The problem I faced was my opponent was kicking down the door to Moscow when I got the US in major force in the Atlantic.  By that time Germany had grown too large IPC wise for me to have any hopes of taking Berlin.  So I basically was using the US to deny his 8th victory city by locking down Cario and London.  After I locked down Cairo my opponent conceded because we have been playing the game for 15+ hours over two days and he figured it would take another 8 hours to get back to Cairo.

Had my opponent built the Romanian complex once Russia’s demise was certain and starting producing ten tanks a turn he could have invaded Turkey and drove to Cairo.  His line of supply with Mega Germany would have been quicker than my line of supply with Mega US.  I thnk that would have allowed him to smash through and win the game.  There was no way I going to be able to revive Russia.

Also I think someone mentioned on here somewhere about using Germany to take India at the cost of even letting Berlin fall if need be as long as Japan took Australia first.  If that was the tactic than I think the early Romanian Complex might prove quite useful.

I agree for the Allies the game is more about not losing than winning.  Gargantua made a thread awhile back about bypassing the money islands and doing a turn four India crush.  My opponent did this to me in a game and I had managed to smash Germany and Italy pretty good with the US while UK London got a fleet up and Russia grew some teeth.  The problem was I was too focused on crushing two Axis Capitals that I did not make it back to Hawaii in time for the crucial battle and lost the game.  Since then I have a won a couple of games as the Allies as I have been focused on denying necessary victory cities on both sides of the board.

My opponent Chompers almost always builds a naval base in Hainan J1 and sends his whole fleet to Sea Zone 36.  From there I have seen him crush India turn 3 by building an Airbase in Siam J2, landing the Air Force there, making sure he has either Yunnan or Shan State on lock down for Japan so the planes can land there after attacking India J3.  He attacks the Allies J2 to insure he holds the necessary territories and also to clear any potential blockers.  Then on J3 India is a done deal because the entire Japan Air force can hit it as well the 3 starting transports and the transport that is built J1.  India only has 2 turns of building to prepare for this.  Even all Infantry builds the first 2 turns is not enough to save India.

It is also possible to land in Australia J2 with the Hainan Naval and land the Air Force there J3 and then on J4 take Sydney if the Allies do not put blockers in place right after J1.

The craziest thing I have seen the Hainan Naval base used for is to punish US for going to Europe first 100%.  On J2 he sent the Navy from Hainan to Caroline’s and then from there took Hawaii from me J3 and on J4 was putting pressure on America.  Yes I could have prevented this if I had built in both theaters US1 but I had decided before hand to reel in Italy and Germany first and stop Japan from winning the game after.  This game is currently in progress and the outcome is uncertain.

So my thoughts so far is the game is pretty balanced but this thread has giving me a lot to think about.

I usually build a carrier and 2 transports G1.  I prefer trying to take Moscow over London but I think it is good to put pressurre on UK to focus on London defense first rather than winning in Africa.

If I am going for Russia I usually will spend 40 points on Artillery G2 at the Germany Complex.

Okay that will give me time to research how to play by forum.

Jen I have never played a forum game before but I have probably played at least 20 games of Alpha +2 by playing my friend Chompers in person.  We play sometimes twice a week and we drink lots of Red Bull as we play for 12 hours at a time when I am not working.  We also played about 20 games of OBB and I certainly agree OBB is broken in the Allies favor.  I also played Spring 1942 for about a year before Alpha came out.  I have learned a lot playing him but probably don’t have your level of experience yet.

That being said I would be interested in playing as the Axis against you in a forum game with you being the Allies. You could show me what you think is broken by ganging up in the Pacific against me early and then I would have a chance to test my counter moves.

I am having trouble figuring out how to play by forum.  I am so used to looking at the board for all possible moves and counter moves and I am afraid I will miss things playing by forum with out the board to look at.

That being said if you are interested in a game by forum and would be able to help out in what I need to play I would like to test our difference of opinion out.