….Allweneed and I would like to see you add BOBCATT to your lexicon - Buyers of Battleships, Cruisers, Armor, Tacs, and Tech dice. (In other words, players who will buy anything, I guess)…
I edited the first page to include BOBCATT (v1.1) and release restrictions of the first game for data gathering.
……Sorry, I know this is not the thread for our tech disagreement, but it’s kind of related, because the whole BOBCAT vs. beancounter issue is about what is and is not a smart purchase.
I was thinking about tech and BOBCAT data on my way home.
Yes, tech is related but tech data needs to be kept separate from the BOBCAT data.
When analyzing the data, then both can be looked at.
Tech throws off the BOBCAT data.
Example: let’s say the BOBCAT player gets Jet fighter tech, which means there is no reason to buy Tacs.
Many of the techs alter purchases based on the tech obtained.
Tech is related in that money vs. value is the issue for debate, but it is like comparing grapefruits vs. oranges type of thing.
Tech should be discussed here as well, but thought of as different too.
v1.1
Calling all Beancounters and B.O.B.C.A.T. (Buyers Of Battleships, Cruisers, Armor, Tacs) team members to the games!
There have been many opinions and threads, for and against, the cost of some or all 4 of these units.
It is time to get some data.
I call on others to start BOBCAT vs. Beancounter games as well, please help add to the data pool. We can learn things from each other and all can become better players from what is learned.
-Please label your game as BOBCAT or BOBCATT somewhere
-next players to go Game 2, Game 3 Game 4, etc.
-Beancounters, label what units would feel would not purchase (1,2,3 or all 4 of these (or other things))
Maybe even list on this thread that you would like to try a game and are looking for an opponent.
General concept:
BOBCAT (Buyers Of Battleships, Cruisers, Armor, Tacs) team members agree to buy a certain amount of IPC per 1-3 rounds of this stuff. This is per side, not per country.EDIT: The first game played should not have these restrictions, but played with the idea of restrictions in mind. The first game is for data gathering purposes.
EDIT: As per request we will add BOBCATT (Buyers Of Battleships, Cruisers, Armor, Tacs,Tech). Tech is related to this, but the data should be kept separate because Techs affect the BOBCAT data in many ways.
Beancounters (may need a better name here) may not buy these 4 things; they may only use those types of units that they start with.
This challenge needs more data to make the challenge work. (Like how much IPC (or units) must be spent per round (or average in 1-3 rounds, or on round 2 thru 4, or whatever this will mold into to work) for the BOBCAT player on BOBCAT units).
Nice break-down Bad Spell. ;)
Especially the part where the Naval Base takes 4 damage instead of the factory :) I like it.
Opps I mixed up the bases!
The AAG hit was suppose to go to the bomber going after the MinorIC, a typo.
EDIT: I fixed my other post
In our G3 Sealion game, the Allies resigned.
http://www.axisandallies.org/forums/index.php?topic=20303.585
@special:
Do the rules literally say to skip the Purchase / repair phase? (i ask because i don’t have a rulebook at hand here)
If not, the purchase phase only has no effect because there is no cash to be spent, and the repair phase is still there.
Hes. In fact, it says skip all but combat move, conduct combat, and noncombat phases
Very good point, Calvin. Oh, the pain of losing a Capital.
Post Sealion, why does Germany have to stay in the UK and try and keep it?
G4…empty the UK and head for Russia with transports and leftover Sealion stuff.
Germany did much damage to UK (stole money, prevented buys). Say, “that’s good enough for now, I can’t afford to stay here” and turn it’s attention to the Russia problem.
“And if you act up again UK, Germany will take you over her knee and spank you again!”
I see Calvin like to give out a lot of wrong information before looking at a rulebook.
@calvinhobbesliker:
… You pick whether to resolve the territory attack or bombing raid first…
AAE40 rulebook>page16>Combat Sequence>
1. Strategic Bombing raids
2. Amphibious assaults
3. General combat
Notice that if one were to do a SBR AND try and take (or strafe) a territory, that the SBR happens first; while the territory is not yours. (Before the “why would you do that” clown peep up, most people would not. However, well-written rules allow for stupid play.)
Later Calvin shows that the AAG fires after the dogfight.
(AAE40 Rulebook>page 16>Strategic Bombing Raids)
Gargantua, in your example at the beginning…
You declare a SBR (I assume that you did not attack the territory with other units, just doing a SBR.)
Gargantua states “2 bombers and 2 fighter escorts” (You do NOT state the targets at this time i.e., Minor IC, Naval Base, Air Base.)
After combat movement, but before Conduct Combat the defending interceptors states how many interceptors (in this case 0-3 fighters) are committed to the SBR dogfight.
Let’s say the defender Bob says “3 interceptors”.
Gargantua rolls for his escorts 2@1 (1,6) 1 hit!
Bob rolls for his interceptors 3@2 (5,1,2) 2 hits!
Gargantua mumbles @$$*%/{
Bob removes 1 fighter.
Gargantua decides what to take casualties.(Clowns may peep again here saying “the only strategic choice is to take the 2 fighters”)
However many other things may change that decision. May he Gargantua needs one of those fighters for his Carrier, or other reasons may have him take 1fighter and 1bomber as casualties.
Gargantua removes 2 fighters.
NOW Gargantua decides what to SBR with his 2 remaining bombers. “1 to Minor IC, 1 to Naval Base”, he says.
AAG fire is rolled separately for each group of bombers (any surviving escorts are not fired apon, they await noncombat movement), in this case 2 groups and only 1 bomber in each group.
Bob rolls 1@1 (1) for the Minor IC 1 hit! (more %@&%) EDIT: the hit was supposed to go here
Bob rolls 1@1 (5) for the Naval Base
Gargantua removes 1 bomber SBRing the Minor IC
Gargantua roll 1@6 (4) for the damage on the Naval Base, places 4 chips under the Naval Base and the Naval Base doesn’t work until it is repaired.
1. attacker make combat moves
2. defender commits some or zero interceptors
3. escorts roll
4. interceptors roll
5. remove casualties
6. declare targets
7. roll facilities built-in AA gun at bombers only
8. remove casualties
9. roll for damage
10. apply damage chips
(Gargantua, mad at the dice: eyes up the Low Luck rules.)
Oh, I see. My bad, I typed the word ‘attack’ in my statement.
I meant to type ‘attack or defend’.
Correct, it is stuck. It can neither attack or defend, as per the rulebook on page 29, 1st paragraph.
Calvin, your question was about the fighter.
Why do you bring up “but a CV with an allied fighter can still attack”?
Fighter can’t attack per rule on page 29, 1st paragraph
@Weezer:
I believe CV stands for Carrier Vessel, and all U.S. carriers have a CV before their ship number.
CV does NOT stand for Carrier Vessel. There have been many discussions on this site as to why. I leave the reader to search out those answers, as it has come up about every 3 months, or so.
Interesting… wonder where all these comes from? Maybe naval terminology… I was Air Force :-D
In ABattleMap (about 1-3 years ago it stopped working with the new versions) under View>List Units, it would provide a text list of where everything is.
Helpful for sending by email at the time it was invented.
Some used this list for various reasons.
Many of the abbreviations came from that.
Many abbreviations have changed over the years.
Many people don’t want to type as much, lazy, or other reasons.
Thanks cal….
How about TT? transport as well?Yeah. People do that to maintain consistency of using double letters
People use TT to mean “territory”.
Air units have a unique set of movement rules, different from those of other units. …… Unlike other units, after retreating they remain in the contested space until the Noncombat Move phase, then they use their remaining movement to find a place to land. If they have already used up all of their movement (legal only at sea), they’re stuck in the hostile space, which most often means they’re destroyed.
May the air unit stay in the hostile space if it is to be on a mobilized Aircraft Carrier in that space?
(AAE40>page 22>Restritions on Placement>allows mobilized fighters onto moblized AC while in a hostile space)
What French units have you purchase? and why?
I am looking for stuff like:
-purchased an AA gun for France (or Fic) for the large air units about to take it back.
-bought an art for can opener move.
-bought a tank for FIC to blitz empty China territories.
This game can take many twist and turns (pun intended) that French builds in late game can be anything.
(NOTE: this thread is not about what you did with the starting French units. This is about AFTER France is liberated, gets IPCs, THEN has a turn WITH $ to buy stuff. If you have not progressed that far in a game, please just read and do not clutter the thread.)
The question is irrelevant. There are so many other factors to look at when purchasing that the ‘which is more efficient’ debate is not the primary issue. Different for each power. Look at limits for 1 example. Limits in transport capacity, Minor IC, how many turns to the front, what round is it. This is just one thing, there are so many others to look at also.
IL, it is high time you step up to the plate and put your game where your mouth is. Start playing here with ABattleMap, so we can see how good or bad your play style is. No excuses about not playing outside your play group of face to face games. You are here plenty to play by forum.