Posts made by B.AnderssonGameMaster

@Dreadnaught:

Do I spell my name wrong? Ehh…

IMO any units that hit on 5 should be forbidden! I use 4 as a maximum and to give units more power I suggest one to use the opening fire! My vote is on variant 1!

By the way Mr. A, thank you for sharing your splending ideas! :wink:

If you ment Dreadnought, then you are wrong!

Well, since the battle board does not have a square for 5’s I agree about no 5 hits should be allowed! But then one does not use the hole register of the possible outcomes of the dice that will create a bigger variety in the rules! However, variant 1 is a good one! And if you vote in the Heavy Tank thread then I suggests that you go for No3! :wink:

@Raarrne:

The use of the original AH Panzerblitz which i don’t like.

I think this version could work well however-As, while a follow up attack is a huige advatage, you have to have a good first combat, having moved one, but also, all your losses in the second combat will be armor (Expensive!).

Well in combination with panzergrenadiers, we will have something else! The Germany may bring one matching infantry along! :wink:

@Raarrne:

-PANZERBLITZ-
When germany eliminates all enemy defenders in one territoty in the first round of combat, German armor can make a follow up attack on at neighboring territory, or may make a NCM. The armor must have at least 1 movement point left in order to make this second attack or move.

Very well done! I don’t think it is too powerful, it is balanced! I have not play tested it yet, but will! :wink:

By the way, what did you vote for?

@Kaladesh:

opening fire in every combat round is to powerful … give 'em a few inf as cannonfodder allong and they will kill everything.

and yes … us and russia did have heavy tanks … the pershing as an example was able to fight the tiger …
nevertheless during the war (until it’s very end) there was no tank that was able to take it one on one with a tiger tank.
and rockets … sure germany was the first nation to develop and use them but they did not have that much of a effect on the outcome of the war.
However for gamebalance it is just ok to let all nations have them. germany has the best use of it since it may reach two ic’s. Allthough in the game i played we usually won’t use rockets. We spent ipc everwhere else :roll:

Well, The IS-2 was a more powerful tank in many aspects, faster as well as better protected and a bigger gun!

Germany can reach three ICs not two, and as you said no one spend ICs on Rockets! Why not replace it with something worth some 30 IPCs on average??? Like Heavy Tanks! You think the opening fire variant is to powerful! It is realistic in our opinion if one take a look on the words we been writing in the last posts! Yes, it is powerful, I agree! It is supposed to be, cause it is a development not an advantage! I would be careful to say that this variant of Heavy Tanks is too powerful,! Explain in statistics, please!
:-?

On average 2 heavy tanks will score one hit each cycle of combat. If we suppose that the defender takes infantry units as cassualties, of which three are needed on average in order to score a hit in defense. Then one could say that:

In offense; For every sixth heavy tanks you bring into combat, you will spare one cassualty of your own!

In defense; For every twelfth heavy tanks you bring into combat, you will spare one cassualty of your own!

It is of cause in a small combat the opening fire will come in to play! But I would not agree it would be too powerful! To buy some 10 tanks and develop the Heavy Tank technology cost some 80 IPCs!!! You must be realistic when you make a statement, like “too powerful”!
:wink:

@Kaladesh:

….The Tiger was used very well in the normandy. But it was not a defensive tank in purpose. Every offensive action that took place involved tigers… where this tank (and even moreso the King Tiger) entered the battle, it dominated the the battelfield. offensive as well as defensive.

btw. i voted for number 5 the NA ;-)

Nice Kaladesh! How about No3, the opening fire variant! If one thinks about weapons development, it is quite obvious that Rockets is much more in favor to Germany than any other nation! And I do think a Heavy Tank development would be more useful for the Allies than Rockets! The original Rocket Technology in A&A Clasic is just like an advantage (compare it to one free infantry unit variant, Conscripts, BCT etc)! In the end of the war both US and Russia had heavy tanks that were as powerful as Germany’s! No nation had ballistic missiles, except Germany!

How ever I would like to know if you have play tested No5 yet and the reactions?

You are right Raarrne about the SS variant of Panzergrenadiers! So I revised it accoding to you since I use this variant my self! However It all went wrong when I made this thread/poll, Iused an old document of mine with SS Panzergrenadiers.

However I like Panzerblitz a bit, but I don’t really know how to capture the idea in a revised advantage! The Panzergrenadiers advantage was such a try! :wink:

1. U-Boat Program
During World War II, 1,162 U-Boats were built, and these U-Boats sank 14,687,231 tons of Allied shipping.
Your submarines now cost 6 IPC’s.

2. Atlantic Wall
The Germans fortified the European Atlantic coast with massive defensive systems from Norway to Spain.
During any amphibious assault against a gray territory, all your infantry defend on a 3 during the first cycle of combat.

3. Panzerblitz
The colossal Panzers rumbled across Europe and North Africa. They would breach enemy lines, then turn and wreak havoc on the defenders.
If your attacking forces destroy all defending units in a territory in one cycle of combat, any of your surviving tanks in the attacking forces may move 1 territory during the noncombat move phase.

4. Wolf Packs (revised)
Wolf packs of U-boats prowled the Atlantic, working together to down Allied convoys. The only sure thing about a U-boat was that there always was another nearby.
Your submarines attack on a 3 (4 if you have the Super Submarines development) if there is more than one of them at the start of the combat cycle. When there are less than two submarines at the start of a combat cycle, this ability is lost. Wolf Packs does not improve defending submarines. Enemy destroyers do not affect this National Advantage. The submarines may come from different sea zones, but they must attack the same sea zone.

5. Luftwaffe Dive-Bombers (revised)
Europe was blitzed and bombed. The Ju-87 Stuka dive-bomber, a small plane, played a big role. Its screaming siren generated terror on all battle fronts.
Your fighters may conduct first round tactical bombing runs. They are subject to antiaircraft fire as normal. In the first cycle of combat, if there are no defending fighters present, the fighters hit on a roll of 5 or less. In succeeding cycles of combat, the fighters hit normally. If defending fighters are present, this first cycle ability is cancelled.

6. Fortress Europe
The Gustav line in Italy was ordered to hold at all costs. Those costs included tens of thousands of men on both sides.
Your artillery in gray territories defends on a 3.

7. Panzergrenadiers
During World War II, the Germans had troops that were designed for fighting alongside tanks. These were fully motorized units, so that they could at all times keep up with the tanks.
Each of your tanks give one matching infantry one additional movement allowance. The tank and the infantry unit must leave from the same territory.

8. V2 Rockets
Guided missiles were one of Germany’s most important technical achievements during World War II.
Your have one free rocket attack per turn against an industrial complex, fired from one of your antiaircraft guns with a range of 3. Roll one die to determine how many IPCs the enemy must surrender to the bank.

9. Royal Tigers
The massively powerful Royal Tiger was virtually impervious to Allied tank guns and capable of dominating the battlefield. A single Royal Tiger tank could halt the advance of a complete armored division.
Every third tank you have in each combat cycle, attack or defend on a 4.

@Raarrne:

Giving it to Germany free turn one via Nat’l Adv may be a bit much as well. It mean Russia and England will ALWAYS be down a couple of IPC’s, automatically, from G1 on.

Not really since I use the rules for Rocket Technology that are used in A&A Classic. That means one rocket strike per turn that destroys 1D6 IPCs! Not that big advantage I guess! That is almost the same as one infantry unit for free, like Conscripts or BCT!

V2 Rockets (replace Luftwaffe Dive-Bombers)
Guided missiles were one of Germany’s most important technical achievements during World War II.
Your have one free rocket attack per turn against an industrial complex, fired from one of your antiaircraft guns with a range of 3. Roll one die to determine how many IPCs the enemy must surrender to the bank.

How about replacing the Rockets development with an advantage for Germany, since it is almost only Germany that strongly favours this development?

V2 Rockets
Guided missiles were one of Germany’s most important technical achievements during World War II.
Your antiaircraft guns are now rocket launchers. In addition to their normal combat function, they can reduce enemy industrial production. See Rocket Technology in A&A Classic.

@Raarrne:

Rockets is clearly the most inferior (and was in normal AH rules, except maybe Jet Fighters).

A quick fix-allow multiple rockets to fire at the same complex, but follow the same max damage rules as LHTR (ie: No more IPC dmg from SBR and Rockets combined, than the total value of the territory).

Not sure if this would be unbalanced or not, but it would definately get it out of the Sh*tty category (but maybe to far out).

Wouldn’t such a quick fix strongly favor Germany, only Germany can reach three IC’s with a damage equal to each territory’s value and it is almost only Germany and U.S. that can afford any development costs, but U.S. is not in a good position to get the full potential of such rockets!

Weapons Development

1.  Super Submarines (revised)
Your submarines are now super submarines. They attack on a 3 and may not be attacked by enemy aircraft when alone or in company with other submarines, unless an enemy destroyer is present.

2.  Combined Bombardment
Your destroyers are now super destroyers. They may like battleships, conduct shore bombardment during an amphibious assault at an attack roll of 3 or less.

3.  Jet Fighters (revised)
Your fighters are now jet fighters. Their defense increases to 5, and they may intercept bombers (including superfortresses) in a SBR.

Bomber Interception: This battle last for one cycle of combat only. The defender declares intercepting fighters before any defending AA guns fire. Intercepting fighters attack on a 3 were as the bomber defend on a 1 (2 if superfortresses), after any AA fire. Any fighters used in a interceptor role may not also defend in a regular land attack against that same territory on the same turn.

4.  Long-Range Aircraft
Your fighters are now long-range fighters, and your bombers are now long-range bombers. Your fighters? range increases to 6. Your bombers range increases to 8.

5.  Heavy Bombers
Your bombers are now heavy bombers. They roll two dice each in an attack or strategic bombing raid (see Special Combats in Phase 4: Conduct Combat), but still only a single die on defense.

6.  Rockets (revised)
Your antiaircraft guns are now rocket launchers. In addition to their normal combat function, they can reduce enemy industrial production. See Special Combats in Phase 4: Conduct Combat for more information.

7.  Heavy Artillery
Your artillery are now heavy artillery. They attack on a 3.

@Kaladesh:

… not a defense invention but it was designed for offense.

You are right about Tigers intentional purpose (offense), but their design were to be more useful for a defensive role! They were to be used to create breaktroughs, but Medium Tanks were found to be more apposite used to exploit such breakthroughs! Well, I give some history again, but in detail! :wink:

The German Army first used the Panzer I in 1933. The Panzer II was released in 1934. The original 1933 version weighed 7.2 tons, and had a 20 mm cannon and a machine gun in the turret. After many modifications, the Panzer II went into mass production in 1937. By that time the tank weighed 9.5 tons.
Both the Panzer III and Panzer IV were released in 1937. The IV became the backbone of Germany’s Panzer force and the power behind the Blitzkrieg. The Panzer IV was manufactured by Krupp. The armor protection ranged from 8 mm to 30 mm in thickness.

The Panzer IV continued to do well as Hitler over-ran Europe and Africa. But the tank met serious resistance during the invasion of Russia in 1942. This lead Germany to develop the Panther tank. Its 75mm gun could penetrate Soviet tanks. Other features included sloped armour to deflect shot, torsion-bar suspension, and interleaved road wheels. The armor was 80mm thick.

Another model released in 1942 was the Tiger Tank, produced by Henschel. It had armor between 25 mm and 100 mm in thickness. The Tiger tended to overheat in battle and suffered problems with the suspension. It was replaced by the Tiger II, also known as King Tiger in late 1943.

The Tiger Tanks was designed to create breakthroughs, as an armored spearhead. But it is in the exploitation of such breakthroughs Medium Tanks were found to be more apposite used to exploit such breakthroughs. The reason was its heavy weight made it slower than other tanks and that it was an incredibly thirsty beast. Tiger Tanks advancing into enemy territory had to frequently stop to wait for fuel trucks to reach them. Therefore the Tiger Tanks were more usual to find in Corps or Army controlled formations, mainly to be used in a defensive role to prevent the breakthrough of Russian armoured forces. The Panzer division usually used medium tanks with a greater range; Pz IVs and Panthers.

Also a big downside of the Tiger Tank was that it was a very complex for production and maintenance, unlike its American and Russian enemies that were mass produced in great numbers and were very reliable in the field.

However what variant did you vote for?

@Guerrilla:

Well I was thinking Super Destroyers! but the next one is rockets…

GG

Why not have another tech and make it eight!??? Do you have any suggestions for the 8th tech??? It has to be good (not an advantage) and historically correct to gain acceptance by the A&A community!

Or how about this one as the 8th technology?

TECHNOLOGICAL ESPIONAGE
Once a technology has been discovered, any player may use spies to steal that technology.

By using spies one will reduce the cost of develop a technology. Every third tech roll per turn is for free, for a technology that is developed by any other player.

@Guerrilla:

exactly…Tigers were more of defensive Artillery/Howitzer with a big AT Gun… Same as the US they started with the Sherman and Priest and in the End came out with the 90mm Pershing…

THe Germans neede to develop a defensive tank when it reached the point where its blitzkrieg collapsed…

GG

So which development of ours do you think it should replace? :wink: :o
OR should one just make a list of more techs? I still think that Coastal Bombardment need to be refreshed, like mine Super Destroyers with 3 in move!

@Guerrilla:

thanks… I think it will be a much more favorably bought tech and is not as complex… although the ones you have invented already are pretty sweet… :lol:

GG

You are right GG! And therefore our endeavour deserves a small history to bring some realism to it!

Germany began the war with LIGHT TO MEDIUM OFFENSIVE TANKS to perform the battlefield function of offensive breakthrough and were highly successful from 1939-1942 against WWI style opposition. The design of the offensive tank was driven by physical reality to have the maximum cross-country mobility to infiltrate through enemy lines to collapse them from the inside out . The thing that won the “lightning war” (blitzkrieg) battle according to German Panzer General Hans Guderians was TRACKS not tank dueling. The goal was to defeat Army units to win battles and wars not destroy other tanks to chalk up “kill marks” on your gun tubes. The heavy tanks like Tigers were made for tank dueling and hence of a defensive value, to make newly captured areas less susceptible for counter-attacks! :wink:

@Guerrilla:

another thing Mr Andersson… On variaant one your saying on attack and defense Tanks are better than Fighters… maybe you should reverse them from fighters (Attack 4 dfend 3)

GG

Well GG then they wouldn’t be worth it, some 30+ IPCs on average! Remember that an artillery and a infantry combination costs 7 IPCs and together are approximately as effective as a heavy tank (4/4). Maybe 3/4 and NO 6 IPC cost and additional cost for each tank you have before the development come in to play.

Why would a 3/4 tank be worth 5 IPCs?
Simply because that a 3/4 tank is more of defensive character, and as a defensive unit it would be cheaper to buy two infantries (can take two hits) at the same cost! Sure the 2 in movement and an approximately 50% better offensive capability would be a strong incentive over the 2-infantry combo, but not better than a artillery and infantry combo for 7 IPCs!

However the 3/4 appers to be a much more balanced variant since it now doesn’t favor Germany much more than any other nation. Imagine US with Chinese Divisions advantage and an IC in Asia that could bring two heavy tanks each turn! Or not to mention if US with Lend-Lease could support Russia with fighters so they could roll for the heavy tank development!

GG, You have been a true light in the darkness of heavy tank development! A 3/4 tank at regular 5 IPCs it is!

Germany began the war with LIGHT TO MEDIUM OFFENSIVE TANKS to perform the battlefield function of offensive breakthrough and were highly successful from 1939-1942 against WWI style opposition. The design of the offensive tank was driven by physical reality to have the maximum cross-country mobility to infiltrate through enemy lines to collapse them from the inside out . The thing that won the “lightning war” (blitzkrieg) battle according to German Panzer General Hans Guderians was TRACKS not tank dueling. The goal was to defeat Army units to win battles and wars not destroy other tanks to chalk up “kill marks” on your gun tubes. The heavy tanks like Tigers were made for tank dueling and hence of a defensive value, to make newly captured areas less susceptible for counter-attacks! :wink:

@prof_tc:

1: Are you sure the Superfortresses aren’t too strong? Then again, it is historically accurate.

2: what happens as you lose tanks with the Ger. heavy tanks?
I know you tested all these new rules, and I’m sure you made a decision. I assume that the first is a heavy tank, and then every 4th after that.

1. The superfortresses advantage is now counterable for the Axis, but cost a lot to develop Jet Fighters! However to old rule of mine that I have in these revised NAs may be a better choice since now the U.S. needs to develop heavy bombers as well. This variant with one additional die per bomber in a SBR is not really playtested! But compared to the original one, I am sure it wont be worse to the Axis as long as they can counter it with jets! :wink:

Damage caused by heavy superfortresses (Heavy Bombers development and Superfortresses advantage) against an IC protected by jets (Jet Fighter development):
5/63(1/61+1/62+1/63+1/64+1/65+1/66) + 5/61/610 IPCs = 10,1 IPCs

Damage caused by AA fire and intercepting jets (on a 1:1 ratio for fighters and bombers) on bombers in a SBR:
1/615 + 3/615 = 10 IPCs

This means that the German and Japanese player needs to develop Jet Fighters to an average cost of 30 IPCs and have as many fighters protecting each IC as there are U.S. heavy superfortresses within reach for a potential SBR! The allies would just have a slight advantage to the axis if conducting a SBR with heavy superfortresses, it is even less then for a regular bomber that conducts a SBR on an IC only protected by an AA gun!

2. this is from another thread about “Heavy Tanks”:

First cycle of combat:
Put the first 2 tanks on 3 and every third tank on 4. Repeat this until all tanks are on your battleboard. At the end of the combat remove casualties.

Second cycle of combat:
Remove all remaining tanks from battleboard and redeploy them by putting the first 2 on 3 and every third tank on 4. Repeat that until all your remaining tanks are on the battelboard… and so on!

I have made a lot of research about the B-29 superfortresses, and I found the optional rule that american bombers cannot be hit by AA fire very unrealistic!

B-29 Superfortress

The B-29 was the first pressurised bomber to enter service, and was therefore able to operate over vaste distances and at safe heights to deliver huge bombloads onto the enemy.

Originally designed to bomb Germany from America during World War II, the B-29 entered service only at the end of the European war. This massive, revolutionary bomber was transferred to the fight against Japan, where it devastated cities in huge firebomb raids. Enola Gay was the superfortress, which dropped the first atomic bomb on Japan, hitting the port city of Hiroshima on 6 August 1945.

The B-29 was a revelation when it first flew. Easily the biggest bomber of World War II, it flew faster than any of its predecessors, and at an altitude it could outpace most of the Japanese fighters that were its principal foes. The B-29’s had a standard load of over 9000 kg of bombs, compared to its counterparts that rarely flew combat missions with more than 3000 kg. The only exception would be Avro Lancaster, the RAF’s main bomber that had a normal combat load of about 6300 kg.

How to revise the Superfortresses advantage?

This background states that a Superfortresses advantage could imply the following:

• Extra damage caused in a SBR.
• Longer range.
• Harder to hit.
  I think it is more like a development than an advantage, but if one should stick to the advantage my suggestion would be:

6. Superfortresses (revised)
The B-29 Superfortress carried the biggest standard bomb load of any wartime bomber.
Your bombers each roll one additional die when conducting a strategic bombing raid.

This means that if the U.S. player want to have the true B-29 Superfortress, the U.S. player would have to develop Heavy Bombers and Long Range Aircraft. Then U.S. would get bombers that would be anything but lousy, especially in a SBR! To counter that I suggest my revised Superfortresses should be used in conjunction with the revised Jet Fighter development! Verry much more balanced and realistic as well!

Jet Fighters

About the special move as an interceptor – Jet fighters performed well in high altitudes much better than piston-engine-driven propellers (other high-altitude fighters). It is no surprise that the Me 262 (Germanys best jet fighter) was primarily designed as a bomber-destroyer! Me 262 was easily the fastest fighter in the world: with guns and unguided R4M rockets, this fighter of the future had the potential to knock down Flying Fortresses almost impunity. Too late and not always used in the best way, the ME 262 frightened the Allies but could not alter the outcome of the war!

1. Jet Fighters
Your fighters are now jet fighters. Their defense increases to 5, and they may intercept bombers (including superfortresses) in a SBR.

Bomber Interception. : This battle last for one cycle of combat only. The defender declares intercepting fighters before any defending AA guns fire. Intercepting fighters attack on a 3 were as the bomber defend on a 1, after any AA fire. Any fighters used in a interceptor role may not also defend in a regular land attack against that same territory on the same turn.

@Guerrilla:

The 3 option is awesome… but make it only for the first round, because of the obvious Russian Repercussion(recieved not given :wink: )

GG

How about giving it as an advantage and let German tanks attack and defend in the openingfire step during the first cycle of combat? This one would make it more simple, than every theird tank at 4/4!

I have tested both in a few games and my game friends land I like both variants!

@Kaladesh:

one thing i would change is for jet fighters … not in this articel, but in understanding the pocedure…

How about this, will that do? :D

1. Jet Fighters
Your fighters are now jet fighters. Their defense increases to 5, and they may intercept bombers (including superfortresses) in a SBR.

Bomber Interception: This battle last for one cycle of combat only. The defender declares intercepting fighters before any defending AA guns fire. Intercepting fighters attack on a 3 were as the bomber defend on a 1, after any AA fire. Any fighters used in a interceptor role may not also defend in a regular land attack against that same territory on the same turn.