Posts made by Amon-Sul

i saw in the news,  didnt saw the fell yet, i ll watch the next news, just hope the surviving people will be rescued soon

@ncscswitch:

Now I just have to take the time to play with it and learn to use TripleA…

Angel has given me a waiver on it (so that I don;t go and buy another game and take up more space in the study with another board… :-D )

its very simple and the map is reviewed, so there shouldn be any problem, this new version is really great, personally i like  the battle odds thing they added

@ncscswitch:

But seriously…
The problem, at least as I see it as a Neo-Pagan living in the Bible Belt, is that far too many of my neighbors have totally closed minds.  They will not see anyone beyond their own faith as anything more than either the “enemy” or as a target for conversion.  But MOST folks, when they are honest with themselves, actually ARE open to understanding others… if they can get past the dogma that precludes it.

It is my HOPE that people will eventually outstrip their religious leaders and move toward understanding and co-existence. 
It is my FEAR that they never will and a very small, radical and bitter few will retain control of the many who follow…

just two things i taugt its important to say

and i wont disloyal my religious leader( pope ) but that doesnt mean i dont try to live in co-existence, and that i dont live in co-existence with my compatriots, but sometimes the other side is reserved and i dont want to force anything

recently in  Europe we had a big event
Taize meeting, which is held every year
40 000 young christians from all over Europe gathered in one place and were put in families, neverthelles are they catholic, protestant, orthodox

Every day there was a prayer in each parish for all young people which came there and it was in ˝Taize spirit˝ so acceptable to both catholics, protestant and orthodox
Every day animators from the home perishes were dividing the guests into groups and then they were debating about religion, or some moral issues, mostly things connected with religion
Each day was also a chance for young guests to pick something to visit for in the town;   to go to mosque, to go convent, to visit some war veterans and to have a chance to speak to all the people they encounter

every day was several things in offer, concerts also so you could only have a chance to catch 1 or 2 activities
and neither this activities, nor the prayers in the Church,  and the debates in schools werent obligatory, people could look around the city whole day if they wanted

New year was celerated in every parish mostly at schools,  my exp is that it was something really great
personally i wanted to go to mosque, as in my country a majority of people is islamofobic, and since i respect muslims  a lot, but i wasnt able to
the muslim community in Zagreb invited all the christians(  catholic, protestant, orthodox ) to come to  mosque and they invited peple for a concert of their lady´s choir

all people had to take of theri shues, and women had to cover their hads, it was winter so i think there werent much problem with unproperly dressed women

and the reactions after this event in the mosque and after entire thing( which was 5 days ) was simply fantastic, whole 5 days passed without a single inciddent, well  it wasn perfect, but it was truly great

so what i am trying to say is that you dont have to resign your own faith to live in co-existence with others, if you live by your faith,   if its a ˝good˝ faith then you should the more you˝are in to it˝ be much better as a person, as human, you ll respect others more,

co-existence, that is it :-) 8-) :wink:

sorry i wasnt able to put in two colors correctly, but its pretty obvious who said what

Well Devil is evil total evil, pure evil, he was an Angel, but he has choosen death

Of course you have, as well as your faith.  I’m an atheist, by your admission, automatically resigning me to hell, according to your faith.

I put ˝ateist˝ like this. Beacuse i believe( and many people and teologists agree) that there simply are no ateists. Every man believes, the tendecies towards faiths is implanted in every human. And there is none which hadnt had supernatural experience, who hasnt feeled God´s love, neither he is aware of it or not.

Just if someone says he is an ateist it doesnt have to be so. He can lie, or he could be wrong

I force people of your or similar faiths to tell me to go to hell?

i  never said this, you can even die as an ˝ateist˝ and save maybe, God´s grace is boundless. Its just didnt all people receive the same, so all wouldnt be treated the same

i am not encouraging you to continue like this, afcorse but you are indeed condemning you with your own words, and it will turn you back in this world, hope not in the other for your sake

No sarcasm intended.
I was saying that the guilt is yours alone, brought upon your own expectations, and whether you actions met those expectations or not.
There is no God punishing you or forcing you to seek redemption - you do this on your own, from your own beliefs.  Had you been raised an atheist, reality would be the same way, just possibly your expectations, actions, and feelings about them might be different.
There is a God, because you think there is a God, but that doesn’t mean God exists universally.

yes i should thank God for puting me in a christian family, youre right
and i stand for my actions, i respond for what i ve done, for what i didnt believe, and for what i believed in

Actually, I don’t think you’ve really criticized me, I was meaning “you” in the sense of Catholics in general, as opposed to Switch, whose faith is non-Christian.  How do you know Switch isn’t an atheist?

i dont know, even if he is, that doesnt mean i am going to send him PM and tell him to convert, i could do that, but i dont see it as a good solution in my heart
i respect him, and if he is a beliver, or monoteist, or even christian than i am happy for him:)

I’ve hardly spit on anything.
Your view is that your belief is correct, normal, preferred.  Excuse me if I feel annoyed that I find this belief to be wrong & conceited.

no it isnt in that, you can disagree with me here, but the way in which you act is what matters,  you are trying to sotonize the Church and even dont believe that Satan exists, well , ididnt mean anything bad here so…

You are confusing snark with a desire to destroy.  I gladly will accept positive criticism, but if you are suggesting I convert, then no thanks.

what is snark? i dont suggest anything, i dont want to destroy you or anybody else, and when did i mentioned you to convert to christianity, so what if i say something about my faith ii immediately means i wont to convert you, man,  if your country has been 400 years under torture of Otoman rule you would know what means forcing to convert
this is simply ridiculous

Atheism isn’t a club.  In fact, it’s the default belief/nonbelief.
Belief is voluntary, not a requirement.  I just find the thought of organized religion absurd, some less than others though.  What really bothers me is when a religion that is supposed to be about love, tolerance, all of humankind, damns other religions that tolerate, or damns people not associated with the organization.

again you are acusing me for something i have never said, or even if i said earlier on this forum what i wihdrawn

i respect other religions, other people, and dont hate ateists

take the Holy Father´s words, and tell me what he damns, if you are refering to that speach about islam, it was put out of context, pope was in fact said several times what he thinks about islam and muslims, so…

and sorry, but i dont have more will for this beacuse it simply takes much time

i just hope the priests if they are guilty will be sentenced and that Church will strengtheen, and fight against pedofila and other evil with more decision

@Jermofoot:

I wish more people tried to live like Jesus, but it’s people that ruin the faith, not the faith itself.

well i dont totally agree with this one but its a start  :-) :-) :-)

@Jermofoot:

i see you have hatred for Church and for it stands for as you simply cant accept it, that the Church will never give up on protecting the values that mean something, we are not perfect, we are a ˝bark that leaks on all sides˝, but as our Lord said to Peter  the gates of hell want overpower us, who are you to think you can  :x

I don’t care either way for the church, I wish more people tried to live like Jesus, but it’s people that ruin the faith, not the faith itself.
Funny that you should mention hell, because I don’t necessarily believe in it, but you are damning me for no other reason than I’m not in your stupid club.
And before you react to my stupid club statement, let me say that all faiths are stupid clubs, I can just tolerate some faiths and their adherents (or even individual people of various faiths) more than others.  I don’t see Switch criticizing my life…

well, now you tryin to say you want to insult all religious communities, that it isnt just Catholic Church,  well you are an ˝ateist˝ and i wouldnt call your ˝ateist˝ club stupid unless your only goal is to fight the true moral values for what Church and some other stand for, and i still dont know you that much that i can say it for you, but even still i wouldn insult you, at least i would try not to as its in the tendencies of my faith, to respect the dignity of every man

and i didnt mentioned hell beacuse of you, nor trying to link you with it, it was a quotiation from The Bible

@Jermofoot:

@Amon-Sul:

and say what you want but beetwen protestant clergy and all other lay man, ateists…( besides muslims and some animalistic beliefs, so i dont affend them as i dont know them )  is much more in % number of pedofils, and deviant people than beetwen catholic clergy

It doesn’t matter - this is just distraction.
I don’t care who else does it, the Church needs to be responsible for their actions.  And they acted dishonorably for many years, so they pay.

i see you have hatred for Church and for it stands for as you simply cant accept it, that the Church will never give up on protecting the values that mean something, we are not perfect, we are a ˝bark that leaks on all sides˝, but as our Lord said to Peter  the gates of hell want overpower us, who are you to think you can  :x

I don’t care either way for the church, I wish more people tried to live like Jesus, but it’s people that ruin the faith, not the faith itself.
Funny that you should mention hell, because I don’t necessarily believe in it, but you are damning me for no other reason than I’m not in your stupid club.
And before you react to my stupid club statement, let me say that all faiths are stupid clubs, I can just tolerate some faiths and their adherents (or even individual people of various faiths) more than others.  I don’t see Switch criticizing my life…

if i criticise you it was in good intentions, there is something called positive criticism, with desire to help
but last time i looked i wasnt even criticising your life, just your statements,  switch is a liberal but that doesnt mean i have anything against you or him beacuse you are an ˝ateist˝ and he is a liberal. but if i renounce for what i stand for, than its better that i am gone

and i am trying to do it in a way of not hurting and insulting anybody,  if i crossed that line than i apologise

but that still doesnt mean you can spit on everything that means something to me in my life, and when i condemn your actions you will just stay, but switch doesnt insults me or something like that

you know very easily how to criticise with bad intensions, and arent willing to accept positive criticism, well sorry but it isnt right :?

@Jermofoot:

@Amon-Sul:

and yes, i ll pray to God that he helps me, i find myself a sinner, and a weak mean,

You do realize that you are doing this to yourself, don’t you?

well i can see through your sarcasm, if i get it right,   i apologise if its because of my poor english that i get it wrong

@Jermofoot:

Aren’t what I write, say, and stand for tantamount to me?

not quite, you see if you stand for something that is bad, or evil in its nature or if you support something that istn right and justice than i must condemn those actions and type of behaviour

what i tried to say is that i dont dislike you in a way that i would hatred is too strong word, i dont know the word

well, i could talk to you, and cooperate with you in some stuff even knowing your world view is opposite than my is,  afcorse only if/until you break the line and start insulting my God, faith, Country, family…

i didnt know how to quote paste everything you wrote so i just took this one

and neither me or my faith judges you, and you either said it from hatred towards the Church or from lack of knowledge, either way you should pair more attention to what you write

you have condemned yourself by yourself  :cry:

and if i get it right you arent for the idea that priests that made those crimes should be sentenced to jail sentences?

@ieatcrayons:

@Amon-Sul:

nobody still didnt told me why arent the accused priests accused for jail sentences, if they done something like these then there shouldn be any bargains, this is not theft, or something to do with money, the whole story doesnt have anthing with money, if they are guilty they should go to jail, and if Church failed to solve the problems then they can speak with the Chruch about  Church donating money to prevent this, or in some other charity

These holy men aren’t doing jail time because it’s far easier for the Catholic church to pay $660M than to have the broadcast media plastered with every Catholic diocese on TV for the length of the scandal and trial.

is it?

what kind of message is this, i think both conservatives and the libertarians wont be satisified with these, there is no victory if the responsible are not judged,

@ncscswitch:

So, up until about 5 years ago, child sexual abuse had to be charged within 2 to 3 years, after that charges could no longer be brought.

what kind of law is it?
God help us!

@ncscswitch:

Amon, the “peter” remark was not an insult, it was use of a slang term for the penis.

still, its on the verge of decent behaviour

i just didnt like the context
these debate has gone and is going in a wrong direction

if we are goin to do nothing than arguing than we are wastin our time

nobody still didnt told me why arent the accused priests accused for jail sentences, if they done something like these then there shouldn be any bargains, this is not theft, or something to do with money, the whole story doesnt have anthing with money, if they are guilty they should go to jail, and if Church failed to solve the problems then they can speak with the Chruch about  Church donating money to prevent this, or in some other charity

@balungaloaf:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_RMzA82H-Qo&mode=related&search=

the simpsons puts catholicism into perspective here.

well, the sound on my comp doesnt work so

@Jermofoot:

@balungaloaf:

no problem with the schism, we are still descendants of peter, while everyone else is not.  second, all the reasons people left have been fixed, except with the orthodox, but they are still cool.

My parents aren’t at all Catholic, and I’m definite peter was involved in my conception.  Just like everyone else.

well, i am not quite sure if i understand what you tried to say here but it seems to me you are insulting, big time

i dont judge you, but believe you in God or not, there is a line, and you have crossed way down it  :-(

and say what you want but beetwen protestant clergy and all other lay man, ateists…( besides muslims and some animalistic beliefs, so i dont affend them as i dont know them )  is much more in % number of pedofils, and deviant people than beetwen catholic clergy

i see you have hatred for Church and for it stands for as you simply cant accept it, that the Church will never give up on protecting the values that mean something, we are not perfect, we are a ˝bark that leaks on all sides˝, but as our Lord said to Peter  the gates of hell want overpower us, who are you to think you can  :x

the thing is that this priests should if they done anything wrong be sentenced to prison, to prison!!!

if not than all this thing is ridiculous, if its so, to insist on getting some money to ˝get even˝ something  and then not insisting on suing them, so they dont hurt nobody anymore, and that with strong punishments the number of these crime reduces

i would say its a pact with the devil
and the devil here is also in Churches lines, not just in USA, so you dont think i have anything against you

well, i am not supporter of death penalty, but ˝true˝ muslims countries dont have this problems, at least not as we do
thats why they grow and we decline, because they are the same as they used to be

and yes, i ll pray to God that he helps me, i find myself a sinner, and a weak mean,

and just one thing , i dont have anything against you, just against that what you ( sometimes, most of the time ) write and what you stand for, if you stand for something, indeed stand for something

Amon-Sul

and just to link to balungaloaf post, i am sure that pedofilia in protestant ˝clergy˝ is much more present than in catholic one, but never saw someone sued protestant community for 600 mil $. or Switch you want to say that they dont cover it…

but altough this whole money thing is questionable still if its only one case of this evil beetwen catholic clergy than it must be severely punished, i am a catholic, i want all the crimes be punished no matter is it catholic or protestant clergy, but its my Church and certaintly its a problem of enormous dimension,

hope all will learn something from these, dont know what more to say

@ncscswitch:

Amon, the reason the Church was sued and not the Priest is because those filing the charges claimed that the Church was responsible for failure to act on the transgressions by these priests over the years.

As has been shown in court filed documents in many of these cases already, there is a documented history of complaints against Priests over the years for these actions, and the response of the church was to RELOCATE the Priest to a new diocese.  This had the effect of FACILITATING the abuse instead of ending it (had the Priest been removed completely).

well considering the first part of your post, i asked this question earlier in my post ˝was it beacuse church was covering it?˝

if it is like you said, then i simply cant aprove those actions of the ones which failed to solve this problem, those priest had to be charged and sued by not only church, but state law. period.

but stil all this  money suing to ˝get even˝ thing is very questionable, if they really wanted to help, they could put money in some funds to help the victims, and to go to media with commercials… to prevent new cases,  making millionares wont help nobody

@balungaloaf:

indeed.

as i’ve already said, priests have lower cases of abuse of minors than anybody else around.

look at liberal judges giving child molestors probation for years of abuse.  look at child rapists getting 1 year of jail.  this is rediculous!

but then look at the priests, who the accusers have no proof,(in most other cases there is proof) and they get millions of dollars.

this has been going on for some time now.  and will continue to go on.  i wouldnt be suprised to see bigger settlements than $660 million!

has any other religious organization been targeted for these claims.  have the protestants, jews, muslims?..…no they havent.

and they have a bigger percentage of cases, but they dont have the cash!  cash that goes to feed the hungry, shelter homeless, and to combat diseases goes to line the pockets of liars.  i’m gonna say 50-60 % of these people are liers with no scruples.  and more will come.

indeed, GOD HELP US!

Maranatha, Marantha…

@balungaloaf:

its an orchastrated shakedown.  thats easy to see.

and it will continue.  they are trying to bankrupt the big diocese in big cities.  many people see this, but liberals are blinded like normal by their indoctinated hatred for catholics b/c of the church’s policies.

if you want to make a million, you know what to do now.  make something up about a priest.  thats so f’ing evident its not even funny any more.

well, when someone from USA speaks like that about these issue, i wont even ask are you a catholic or not, but what you re saying is pretty serious,   to accuse somebody( especially a priest ) for doing something like these, and not just that,  to try earn some money on it

God helps us!

hey, i would like to just ask you, since i dont get it, and it hasnt went to public in my country like in yours did

why did the Church payed that money, i mean the priest should respond for what he did, or was it beacuse the accusation said that Church was covering it

i mean, i know its not so simple, and Church in some things cant be compared to other organizations but every priest is (besides Churches) under state law, and he must respond for what he did

all this things, to pay money to ˝get even˝ something is simply questionable

Libyan case considering Bulgarian nurses is similar, if they so much wanted to help, they could take the money and put it in some fund for fighting AIDS, not trying to compensate it by making millionares of its population,  there is no money which can garantee that its even, or, i dont how to say better

Amon-Sul