Various house rule pieces ( and where to find them)

Revolt in Ireland
No non-British Allied land or air units are permitted in Ireland. The German player may invest a total of 3 IPCs during each Purchase Units phase in hopes of fomenting an Irish rebellion – similar to the technology tables in early edition A&A, 3 IPCs spent buys ONE immediate die roll THAT TURN only (i.e., the spent IPCs are not retained or carried over to succeeding turns).  Having any German ship adjacent to Ireland at this time provides a +1 to the die roll for this check. If a modified roll of 6 is rolled on a die, Irish nationalist republicans revolt.  Irish rebellion is also automatically triggered by any German land unit present in Ireland at the end of a German turn.+

If Ireland rebels, immediately place two infantry figures in Ireland under the control of the German player; these represent Irish rebel forces hostile to Great Britain.  If Great Britain loses control of Ireland or Ireland is contested, at the start of each British player Purchase Units phase the British player forfeits as many IPCs as there are enemy units in Ireland directly to the German player, up to a maximum of 8.  If Great Britain loses control of Ireland and Ireland is not contested Ireland becomes controlled by Germany and Germany receives its IPC value. At the start of each German turn that Ireland is controlled by Germany or contested, another Irish rebel infantry figure is placed in Ireland, up to a maximum of four rebel infantry units. Only infantry units are raised as Irish rebel units but there is no limit to other nation’s units that can be moved to Ireland.  Irish rebel units may not leave Ireland. Ireland will only revolt once in a game.

This rule simulates the complicated political situation existing in Ireland during WWI and the historical “Easter Uprising” of 1916. Because German submarines were often used to smuggle weapons and personnel to Ireland during this time, and German invasion prospects encouraged the Fenians,  the presence of German naval units increases the chances of rebellion.  The USA and France traditionally sympathized with Irish republicanism and their governments were not likely to agree to their militaries forsaking the war against Germany to suppress Irish nationalism.

Thanks, we might give it a go not to change anything.

Off topic: I’ve thought about Europe 1940, but it’s so many rules and exceptions. I’d rather underwhelm than overwhelm them  :-) If they like Spring '42, they can always ‘upgrade’ to Global/Europe 1940 later on. If they think Spring 42 is too complicated, then the game series just isn’t for them. If they think it’s too simple, I can spring my Global-1940-monstersized-board-trap  :lol: I just want them to have a good time, get used to the flow of the game and see what happens.

@Ichabod:

YG,

1. Did you update your house rules in this thread (modify your original post), if so, what are the HR’s that are no longer being used?

2. Heavy Bombers Tech…I think you and your team got the right happy medium there! The classic edit. of 3 dice was over kill. Even 2 dice is overkill. But rolling 2 dice, but only selecting the “1” dice with the best results ensures the concept of the “heavy bombers” tech as an almost more than likely good hit, but still not overkill.

I’m going to be playing in a table top tournament (42 setup) soon that’s a 3 day event. But for a side table game with no time rush where we can leave the table setup over night…ect, I’d like to try to get a G40 game with your house rules (if I can get people to go along with it). Anything really out of the ordinary that I should expect? Also, are your house rules designed to make it a balanced game, as in no bid for the allies?

Cheers!
Ichabod

Hey Ichabod,

I decided to unstick the thread with just my ideas, and leave up the thread which have my ideas that our group actually plays with. Here it is… http://www.axisandallies.org/forums/index.php?topic=38351.0

BTW… the R&D Heavy Bomber rule is an oob rule, and I agree that it’s better than the past editions. In the link I provided, all my changes to R&D breakthroughs are highlighted in red.

There are many things to talk about when it comes to how my rules change the game… but balance was the main driving force so yes, no bid required. The VOs give clear ways to win the game, the NOs just make sense, and the modified facilities clearly favor the Allies.

If you are planning a game, you can email me cliffsidebunker@outlook.com and we can find a way to talk over the phone.

1942.2 SBR Black Elk hypothesis

Strategic Bomber
Attack 0
Damage 1D6, 1D6+2
Cost 5

Fighter
Attack 1
Defense 2
Cost 10

Break even point StB A0 C5, 1D6+2 damage vs Fg A1 D2:  21 StBs vs 30 Fgs: 0.700 StB/Fg
1StB D6+2 vs 1Fg D2: + 3.056 - 2.222= + 0.834 IPC damage/SBR12= +10.008
1StB D6+2 vs 2Fgs D2: +2.037 - 3.148 = -1.111 IPC damage/SBR9= -9.999 (Diff.: +0.009)
21 StB vs 30 Fgs:   0.700 StB/Fg
No FIT (Fighter Interception Threshold), always beneficial to Intercept.

Break even point StB A0 C5, 1D6 damage vs Fg A1 D2: 17 StBs vs 15 Fgs: 1.133 StBs/Fg
1 StB D6  vs 1Fg D2: + 1.944 - 2.222 = -0.278 IPC damage/SBR13 = -3.614
2 StBs D6 vs 1Fg D2: +4.861 - 3.056= +1.805 IPCs damage/SBR2= +3.610 (Diff.: -0.004)
17 StBs vs 15 Fgs: 1.133 StBs/Fgs
No FIT (Fighter Interception Threshold), always beneficial to Intercept.

Down below here is a different values doing SBR for 1942.2 and G40

Strategic Bomber in air-to-air combat SBR:
Attack 0
Bombard IC damage: D6 or 1D6+2

Fighter in air-to-air combat SBR:
Attack 1
Defend 2

IC’s AAA: @1 against each Strategic Bomber

1942.2 SBR HRules with StB A0 and Fg A1 D1 : damage 1D6 or 1D6+2

1 Strategic Bomber doing SBR against no interceptor

AAA roll = odds casualties

5/6 StB survived * 5.5 IPCs = +4.583 IPCs *3.5= +2.917
1/6 StB killed *5 IPCs = -0.833 IPCs

D6: +2.917-0.833= +2.084 IPCs
D6+2: + 4.583 - 0.833 = +3.750 IPCs damage/SBR

1 Strategic Bomber Att 0 doing SBR against 1 interceptor Def 2

Interceptor Fg roll/ AAA roll = odds casualties

2/66/6 = 12/36 1 StB killed by Fg
4/61/6 = 4/36 1 StB killed by AAA
4/6*5/6 = 20/36 No casualty at all.

Results:
Bombard on IC 20/36* ((1+2)+(6+2) IPCs)/2= +5.5 IPCs) = + 3.056 IPCs *3.5=+1.944
StB killed 16/36 *-5 IPCs = - 2.222 IPCs
1D6 vs 1D2: + 1.944 - 2.222 = -0.278
1D6+2 vs 1D2: + 3.056 - 2.222= + 0.834 IPC damage/SBR

D6 vs Fg D1: + 2.431 - 1.528 = +0.903
D6+2 vs Fg D1: + 3.819 - 1.528= + 2.291 IPC damage/SBR

1 Strategic Bomber Att 0 doing SBR against 2 interceptors Def 2

Interceptors Fgs roll/ AAA roll = odds casualties

20/366/6 = 120/216 1 StB killed by Fg
16/361/6 = 16/216 1 StB killed by AAA
16/36*5/6 = 80/216 No casualty at all.

Results:
Bombard on IC 80/216* ((1+2)+(6+2) IPCs)/2= +5.5 IPCs) = +2.037 IPCs *3.5= +1.296
StB killed 136/216 *- 5 IPCs = -3.148 IPCs
D6 vs D2: +1.296 - 3.148 =-1.852 IPCs
D6+2 vs D2: +2.037 - 3.148 = -1.111 IPC damage/SBR

D6 vs Fg D1: + 2.025 - 2.106 = -0.081 IPCs
D6+2 vs Fg D1 : + 3.183 - 2.106 = +1.077 IPC damage/SBR

1 Fighter Att 1 and 1 Strategic Bomber Att 0 doing SBR against 2 interceptors Def 2

Fighter roll/interceptors Fgs roll/ AAA roll = odds casualties

1/64/366/6 = 24/1296 1 Fg and 1 StB killed by Fgs vs 1 Fg
1/616/361/6= 16/1296 1 Fg killed by Fg and 1 StB killed by AAA vs 1 Fg
1/616/365/6= 80/1296 1 Fg killed by Fg vs 1 Fg
1/616/361/6 = 16/1296 1 StB killed by AAA vs 1 Fg
1/616/365/6 = 80/1296 No casualty vs 1 Fg

5/64/366/6 = 120/1296 1 Fg and 1 StB killed by Fg vs no casualty
5/616/361/6 = 80/1296 1 Fg killed by Fg and 1 StB killed by AAA vs no casualty
5/616/365/6= 400/1296 1 Fg killed by Fg vs no casualty
5/616/361/6 = 80/1296 1 StB killed by AAA vs no casualty
5/616/365/6 = 400/1296 no casualty at all

Results:
Bombard on IC: 960/1296 * ((1+2)+(6+2) IPCs)/2= +5.5 IPCs) = + 4.074 IPCs 3.5= +2.593
Killing 1 Fg: 216/1296 +10 IPCs = + 1.667 IPCs
Fg killed: 480/1296-10 IPCs = - 3.704 IPCs
StB killed: 96/1296 -5 IPCs = - 0.370 IPCs
StB & Fg killed: 240/1296* -15 IPCs = - 2.778 IPCs

D6 vs 2Fgs D2: +4.260 - 6.852 = -2.592 IPCs
D6+2 vs 2Fgs D2: + 5.741 - 6.852 = -1.111 IPCs damage/SBR

D6 vs D1: +4.503 - 1.690 = +2.813 IPCs
D6+2 vs D1: + 6.123 - 1.690 = + 4.433 IPCs damage/SBR

1 Fighter Att 1 and 1 Strategic Bomber Att 0 doing SBR against 1 interceptor Def 2
Fighter escort taking the casualty.
Fighter roll/interceptor Fg roll/ AAA roll = odds casualties

1/62/61/6= 2/216 1 Fg killed by Fg and 1 StB killed by AAA vs 1 Fg
1/62/65/6= 10/216 1 Fg killed by Fg vs 1 Fg
1/64/61/6 = 4/216 1 StB killed by AAA vs 1 Fg
1/64/65/6 = 20/216 No casualty vs 1 Fg

5/62/61/6 = 10/216 1 Fg killed by Fg and 1 StB killed by AAA vs no casualty
5/62/65/6 = 50/216 1 Fg killed by Fg vs no casualty
5/64/61/6 = 20/216 1 StB killed by AAA vs no casualty
5/64/65/6 = 100/216 no casualty at all

Results:
Bombard on IC: 180/216 * ((1+2)+(6+2) IPCs)/2= +5.5 IPCs) = + 4.583 IPCs 3.5= +2.917
Killing 1 Fg: 36/216 +10 IPCs = + 1.667 IPCs
Fg killed:60/216-10 IPCs = -2.778 IPCs
StB killed: 24/216 -5 IPCs = - 0.555 IPCs
StB & Fg killed: 12/216* -15 IPCs = -0.833 IPC

1Fg A1 1StB D6 vs 1 Fg D2: +4.583 - 4.166 = +0.418 IPCs
1Fg A1 1StB D6+2 vs 1 Fg D2: + 6.250 - 4.166 = + 2.084 IPCs damage/SBR

1Fg A1 1StB D6: +2.500 - 1.111 = +1.389 IPCs
1Fg A1 1StB D6+2: + 6.250 - 1.111 = + 5.139 IPCs damage/SBR

2 Strategic Bombers Att 0 doing SBR against 2 interceptors Def 2

Interceptor Fgs roll/ AAA roll = odds casualties

4/3636/36= 144/1296 2 StBs killed by Fgs
16/366/36 = 96/1296 1 StB killed by Fg and 1 StB killed by AAA
16/36*30/36= 480/1296 1 StB killed by Fg

16/361/36 = 16/1296 2 StBs killed by AAA
16/3610/36 = 160/1296 1 StB killed by AAA
16/36*25/36 = 400/1296 No casualty at all.

Results:
2x Bombard on IC 400/1296* ((2+4)+(12+4) IPCs)/2= +11 IPCs) = +3.395 IPCs 7=+2.160
1x Bombard on IC 640/1296 ((1+2)+(6+2) IPCs)/2= +5.5 IPCs) = + 2.716 IPCs 3.5=+1.728
2 StBs killed 256/1296 -10 IPCs = -1.975 IPCs
1 StB killed 640/1296* -5 IPCs = -2.469 IPCs
D6 vs 2 Fgs D2: +3.888 - 4.444 =-0.556 IPCs
D6+2 vs 2Fgs D2: +6.111 - 4.444 = +1.667 IPCs damage/SBR

D6 vs 2 Fgs D1: +4.863 - 3.056 = +1.807 IPCs
D6+2 vs 2Fgs D1: + 7.639 - 3.056 = + 4.583 IPCs damage/SBR

2 Strategic Bombers Att 0 doing SBR against 1 interceptor Def 2

Interceptor Fg roll/ AAA roll = odds casualties

2/66/36 = 12/216 1 StB killed by Fg and 1 StB killed by AAA
2/630/36= 60/216 1 StB killed by Fg
4/61/36 = 4/216 2 StBs killed by AAA
4/610/36 = 40/216 1 StB killed by AAA
4/6*25/36 = 100/216 No casualty at all.

Results:
2x Bombard on IC 100/216* ((2+4)+(12+4) IPCs)/2= +11 IPCs) = +5.093 IPCs 7=+3.241
1x Bombard on IC 100/216 ((1+2)+(6+2) IPCs)/2= +5.5 IPCs) = + 2.546 IPCs 3.5=+1.620
2 StBs killed 16/216 -10 IPCs = -0.741 IPC
1 StB killed 100/216* -5 IPCs = -2.315 IPCs

2 StBs D6 vs 1 Fg D2: +4.861 - 3.056= +1.805 IPCs
2 StBs D6+2 vs 1 Fg D2: +7.639 - 3.056 = +4.583 IPCs damage/SBR

2 StBs D6 vs 1 Fg D1: +5.347 - 2.361= +2.986 IPCs
2 StBs D6+2 vs 1 Fg D1: +8.403 - 2.361 = +6.042 IPCs damage/SBR

@Baron:

Summary:
StB A0 C12 vs Fg A1 C10
1 Strategic Bomber doing SBR against no interceptor
D6+2: + 4.583 - 2 = +2.583 IPCs damage/SBR run
D6: +2.917-2= 0.917 IPCs

1 Strategic Bomber A0 doing SBR against 1 interceptor D1
D6+2: + 3.819 - 3.667 = + 0.152 IPC damage/SBR run
D6: + 2.431 - 3.667 = -1.236

1 Strategic Bomber A0 doing SBR against 2 interceptors D1
D6+2: + 3.183 - 5.056 = - 1.873 IPCs damage/SBR run
D6: + 2.025 - 5.056 = -3.031 IPCs

1 Fighter A1 and 1 Strategic Bomber A0 doing SBR against 2 interceptors D1
D6+2: + 6.123 - 5.334 = + 0.789 IPC damage/SBR run
D6: +4.503 - 5.334 = -0.831 IPCs

2 Strategic Bombers A0 doing SBR against 2 interceptors D1
D6+2: + 7.639 - 7.334 = + 0.305 IPC damage/SBR run
D6: +4.863 - 7.334= -2.471 IPCs

1 Fighter A1 and 1 Strategic Bomber A0 doing SBR against 1 interceptor D1
D6+2: + 6.250 - 3.667 = + 2.583 IPCs damage/SBR run
D6: +2.500 - 3.667 = -1.167 IPCs

2 Strategic Bombers A0 doing SBR against 1 interceptor D1
D6+2: + 8.403 - 5.666 = + 2.737 IPCs damage/SBR
D6: + 5.347 -5.666= -0.319 IPCs

Comparison of this HR with Triple A SBR for 1942.2

1942.2 SBR HRules with StB A0 and Fg A1 D1 : damage 1D6+2   Triple A SBR for 1942.2: damage 1D6

1 Strategic Bomber doing SBR against no interceptor             1 StB doing SBR without interceptor
Sum: + 4.583 - 2 = +2.583 IPCs damage/SBR run                Sum: +2.917 - 2 = +0.917 IPC damage/SBR run

1 Strategic Bomber A0 doing SBR against 1 interceptor D1     1 StB A1 against 1 Fg D1
Sum: + 3.819 - 3.667 = + 0.152 IPC. damage/SBR run        Sum: +3.69 - 3.667 = + 0.023 IPC damage/SBR run

1 Strategic Bomber A0 doing SBR against 2 interceptors D1       1 StB A1 doing SBR against 2 intercepting Fgs D1
Sum: + 3.183 - 5.056 = - 1.873 IPC. damage/SBR run              Sum: + 2.025 - 5.056 = - 3.031 IPCs damage/SBR run

1 Fighter A1 and 1 Strategic Bomber A0 doing SBR against 2 interceptors D1       1 StB & 1 Fg A1 doing SBR against 2 intercepting Fgs D1
Sum: + 6.123 - 5.334 = + 0.789 IPC damage/SBR run              Sum: +6.155 - 5.33 = + 0.825 IPC damage/SBR run

2 Strategic Bombers A0 doing SBR against 2 interceptors D1         2 StBs A1 doing SBR against 2 intercepting Fgs D1
Sum: + 7.639 - 7.334 = + 0.305 IPCs damage/SBR run              Sum: +8.195 - 7.334 = + 0.861 IPC damage/SBR run

1 Fighter A1 and 1 Strategic Bomber A0 doing SBR against 1 interceptor D1       1 StB & 1 Fg A1 doing SBR against 1 intercepting Fg D1
Sum: + 6.250 - 3.667 = + 2.583 IPC damage/SBR run         Sum: + 5.973 - 3.667 = + 2.306 IPCs damage/SBR run

2 Strategic Bombers A0 doing SBR against 1 interceptor D1         2 StBs A1 doing SBR against 1 intercepting Fg D1
Sum: + 8.403 - 5.666 = + 2.737 IPCs damage/SBR run         Sum: +8.403 - 5.666 = + 2.737 IPCs damage/StB

What about giving it the ability to fire first in battle, defender removes casualties, then normal combat begins. Or what about being able to fire from adjacent territory. Also can it be used as AA and land combat at the same time or do you have to designate in defense.

But doing that does not model the capabilities of these units. The game OOB permits the preemptive firing because it is against just air units that are flying over to attack. It is marginally acceptable to allow this, but realistically these are just basic artillery.

Since they were made as a new unit it stands to bring it fully into the fold as a normal combat unit.

To allow preemptive fire every round is too strong for a 5 IPC unit IMO.

Plus this unit needs to be 3-2-5 as the other units took the other values, so the value of a 5 IPC unit must balance out and preemptive is worth more.

For any game with tech research in it, I like the tech being more likely to be discovered the more money you put into it. Instead of needing to roll a 6 on one die to discover the tech, you roll two dice and need to roll a 12, but for each previous roll, you get +1 to your current roll. So on the second roll you would succeed on an 11, on the third roll on a 10, etc. The average number of rolls needed to get the tech is about the same, but the variation is much lower. You’re much less likely to get it on your first attempt, but also much less likely to need 10+ attempts. To keep track of how many rolls you’ve made, place a die (or an airplane movement marker from Revised) on the tech chart where the control marker would go.

@Krieghund:

@Gallo:

@Romulus:

I would say use the LHTR rules for Heavy Bomber…  :-D

which are?

Whether attacking or defending, roll two dice for each bomber and pick the best result.  In an SBR, add one to the resulting number.

thanks  :-)

oh wow that will be helpful…