Lets Talk Paratroopers!

Unfortunately I’ve been too busy to reply to this thread recently.

For the most part I am about 95% in agreement with IL.

Paratrooper were shock troops and not commando.  I agreed with a 2 or 3 attack value for the first round only to represent suprise/shock value and possibly reduce those units before a counter attack like a sub.  After that they operate as standard infantry.

Sorry ET, an attack value of “0” is simply a non-starter with me.  I appreciate your passionate argument but I feel it simply would not make the unit playable in A&A.  I think IL has made several excellent arguments as to why this won’t work.

One idea that I might entertain is that when AB units operate on their own, they have a defense value of 1 against armor.  But when operating with standard infantry unit, they operate as normal infantry.  However, this means creating a way to be able to identify AB units through out the game, such as a marker or a special AB piece.

I also like Lucky Days idea of reducing the enemy’s ability to counter attack (for the first round only)

I do not agree with paratroopers being able to selectively eliminate any particular unit.  This would disrupt the balance of play in AA.

I strongly disagree with using any aircraft pieces to transport AB unit.  In my opinion, the extra cost for AB units is so that they use an airborne attack without using other aircraft.  Ideally, if we had a transport aircraft that could be purchase.  This would solve all movement issue and prevent over buying of such unit.

@Black:

I appreciate your passionate argument

your welcome

and yes the main thing is the quiet obvious fact that airborne soldiers are not transported by bombers.

Out of curiosity.  If there were an air transport aircraft what do you think the value and stats should be?

Here is my idea.

IPC  10
Att  0
Def  0
Range 4 (maybe 6?)

Can carry 1 infantry or 1 artillery.

Can deliver 1 infantry for airborne assault.

i dont like units that dont kill things, you should just pay to do airborne attacks, then put a little chip under paratoopers to show they are equipped for an airborne assault

You can only drop as many Airborne as you have bombers and follow all OOB rules.

IL are you also implying that they have to be delivered by Bombers or you can only buy as many as bombers as you have?

Also, what are OOB rules?

Thanks

NO BOMBERS TRANSPORTING SOLDIERS! THAT IS JUST STUPID!

whats wrong with just paying ipcs

when my friends and I play, our rule is a bomber can drop one infantry as a paratrooper, and if you have heavy bombers you can drop 2 INF or 1 ART or 1 ARM. if you use a bomber as a carrier, it can’t bomb that turn. I’ve used this to capture Stalingrad, Iceland, and India on different occasions. It also helps you get behind enemy lines and break defenses

MadMc, I have thought about using the heavy bomber as extra cargo capacity. A regular bomber drops 1 bomb & 1 para oob rules. HB drops 2 bombs & para, or 1 bomb & 2 para.Maybe only allow bombs to drop 1st wave of battle when carrying ground units or paratroopers. You can also load up to 6 ipc worth of ground units, 2 inf,1art,1arm,or 1AA gun. The bomber/ air transport would have to land and unload on friendly soil. Only inf can paratroop. Not sure if you should allow bomber to attack (1 bomb dice) when it is carrying ground units other then paratroopers. Also thought about allowing bomber/ air transport to be used to lend lease ipc’s to Russia or China. I’m not sure if I like using a bomber this way or if we really need an air transport unit as talked about before. How did the games you played work out. Was it used a lot. Did it affect the out come, and balance.  WB

i don’t have a problem with bombers (HB or otherwise) also representing transport aircraft for paratroopers, provided they are not allowed to bomb ALSO.  without a specific transport piece they just have to represent more than bombers, like current armor units represents more than just tanks…

limits, whether per turn or per number of bombers sounds fine.  I’m sure someone would buy 30 at once, but at least if you saw the buildup you had some balance of warning.

i would think air transports of ART could not drop with paratroops, but could certainly move to friendly territories…

Getting back to the new inf units, or special forces(SF). Cost $4. Maybe allow upgrade of inf for $1 call it training. Pay for upgrades in purch units phase get them during mob units phase @ IC. Give them +1 on attack for the 1st round of battle only. Could be preempt so enemy casualties don’t fire back. I think selective hits would be to much for $4. This could symbolize Commandos, Marines, or Imperial banzai etc. You could also extend +1 to defense for 1st round only to represent Atlantic wall, dug in defenders or just boost the def of a capital. These units could still get support from art oob rules. Could limit SF to the amount given to us (no chips). These SF could be used as paratroopers w/ bombers oob. You could however buy fly tokens instead. Tokens would be $1 each. Think of the SF unit as you would any other air unit when it flies. The further you want to go the more $ it costs with a max of 3 tokens per SF unit. You could attach fly tokens to the SF unit in order to use it or keep them @ your capital. If stored @ capital you could use them for any SF unit giving it the element of surprise. Once you use a fly token its done you must re-buy them. You could also use fly tokens to move regular inf or SF in non combat, but only SF unit can be used as a paratrooper in an attack. Maybe allow movement of other ground units @ 2x cost?
Example 1: Say Germany has 5 SF on East Poland through purchases or upgrades (cost $20).
It wants to attack Moscow 2 spaces away. To fly them in would cost $2 each ($10). If those SF were on Warsaw cost to fly them in would be $3. each ($15)

Example 2: Say Germany has 5 SF on France through purchases or upgrades($20 invested). It wants to attack the UK 2 spaces away across English Chanel. To fly them in would be $2 each ($10). Total spent for attack =30 ipc’s.
Cost of an air transport would be around $8 (IL) with limited cargo, but you could use it over & over again. Air tokens could limit themselves depending on where you wanted to go because of cost. You could also place a limit on them, or link them to the # of air units you have as discussed earlier. Island hopping would be expensive at $3 per guy. Maybe you could base them off an AC.

The best way to represent Air tranports in with a chip you put under a paratooper unit to show it is ready to be paradroped up to 2 spaces away. After the paradrop you can save the air transport chip and put it next to your tech tokens and equip it to an infantry unit or paratooper unit. If it is equiped to an infatry unit it can only be transported 3 spaces to a friendly territory and with research you can get heavy tranports which can transport an artillery or tank.
transport chips are also subject to AA fire.

I dont like having a tranport peice because they are really big and take up space but they dont even kill anything. If I were to add a new air unit it would something that kills stuf like a Heavey Bomber/Jet fighter/ light bomber/torpedo bomber

The reason I said air transports should be subject to AA fire is that I remember reading that the Germans lost alot at Crete and that ended up hurt them in Russia.