Can Subs only be hit when attacker has a destroyer?

@general-LD Rulebook says:
"Submersible: A submarine has the option of submerging. It can do this anytime it would otherwise make a Surprise Strike (see below). The decision is made before any dice are rolled by either side (the attacker decides first) and takes effect immediately. When a submarine submerges, it’s immediately removed from the battle board and placed back on the map. As a result, it can no longer fire or take hits in that combat. "

@rookeries Welcome to the forum :slightly_smiling_face:

Moving the UK plane to SZ 5 to attack the German transports there indeed is a valid combat move. The battle will be resolved according to the “defenseless transports”-rules on page 19 of the rulebook, sometimes referred to as “autodestruction”.

Scramble is not part of the ruleset here (you might mix that up with the rules for Global 1940).
Also there is nothing in the rules saying that planes must be accompanied by attacking ships.
So never leave your transports unprotected :smile:

@s.farresque:

Hi,
I too have been searching for answers but in a simple sub vs. sub context. Manual, pg 18,“Step 2, General Combat…both attacking and defending submarines can choose to either make a Surprise Strike or Submerge…”,pg 30,“Submarines, Special Abilities, Submersible:…The decision is made before any dice are rolled by either side (the attacker decides first) and takes effect immediately.”, this is reasserted on pg 4 of the March 2009 FAQ, “Submarines Q. Exactly when is the decision made whether or not to submerge submarines? A. The decision whether to submerge submarines is made before any dice are rolled by either side in an exchange of fire , and the subs submerge immediately. The attacker decides before the defender.”. “Decides” does not equate to “attacks”.
BGG Axis and Allies Anniversary Edition, Forum, Rules, Sept, 2009, “Can a submarine ever be attacked without a destroyer present because of the ability to submerge first”. Kevin Chapman ( Patron) answers,“…so a sub can only attack another sub if the defender chooses to fight (or there is an attacking destroyer)”.
BGG (as above), in " subs vs other naval units", has other useful comments by Kevin Chapman and Don Moody on this subject.
I like the imagery of this implementation. A lone sub,or two causing isolated mayhem before sinking into the depths or just driving for their pens, until, at the slightest indication of an attack,“Dive, dive dive”. What is wrong with that…until a destroyer turns them from buccaneers of the sea into desperate survivors hoping only to escape!.
Cheers.

Was there a question in there somewhere?  You initially said you were searching for answers but never really asked any question(s).  Just trying to end your search for answers

Absolutely it can be invaded from SZ4

Thank you Krieg!

Jumping into this, here was a proposal to a bomb Italy strategy I used against my buddy.

He toyed with the ideal of buying a factory in the Balkans, I would choose Poland for Germany.( He did build a factory in Libya, which could only be bomber for 2 dollars.)

While expensive, Italy or Germany could then build the 1st infantry for 7 dollars , the second and third ones for 4 dollars. (since the max damage on a territory worth 3 is 6).

It still works out to +2 per unit built , but your “start up costs” are cheaper (3 vs 10) If Germany had heavy bombers, using a 3ipc factory would allow you to build 2 heavy bombers a turn for 29 ipcs. (with 3-5 heavy bombers and 2-4 planes on the board, the Atlantic will be empty near your coastlines, and with your starting infantry placed right, Russia will be afraid to move next to them. If the allies do land on your coast, use your next turn to clear their fleet from the board.

You could save “excess” money after you build 3 units, to repair Germany every other turn, or every third turn, for more units.

If you are saving for a big build, then with the little factory, you can place 3 inf a turn for 15 dollars (vs 21 in Germany)  and use the excess money every second or third turn in Germany itself. 21 minus 15 equals 6 dollars saved, paying for the cost of the factory in 3 turns. Just move the AA gun from the damaged German factory to the Poland one during noncombat.

They can bomb you, but you don’t lose any money until you make the repairs, so just think outside the box a bit.
Its not ideal, but it is a work around for an SBR strat.

makes sense, thanks kreig.

@claborne:

So…. when you have a fleet of mixed subs/surface warships being attacked by only planes, you CANNOT take the subs as casualties?

No, they can not be taken as casualties.  Only if the attacker sends a destroyer with his planes can your subs be removed by air attacks.