The UnBaltic - CSub paper #18

I knew there was something off about you. :P

Actually, I don’t think it is reasonable to assume someone who has never seen a CSub paper will look for a CSub only rule set.  They’ll probably look around the same forum that they saw the paper in and determine that is the rule set.

Since LHTR seems to be the standard around here (rare to find a game where they say OOB rules or something like that) then people will naturally assume that LHTR is what that paper goes with.

Also, for those who wish to play an enlightened game, however, can play a LHTR game with about 10 seconds of reading the rules.  There are NOT that many differences between LHTR and Box rules.  The reason you think LHTR is so huge is because all the box rules that were NOT changed were printed in LHTR.  Unlike CSUB which requires you read both the box rules and then the CSUB rules, so it really takes about 20 minutes to read the CSUB rules, if you had never read the rules.  (Same with LHTR, except you don’t have to read it one way, then read the contradiction/correction after; you just read the LHTR.)

That said, the idea does work out nicely in LHTR.  The only change I would make is Submarine from SZ 8 to SZ 13 instead of SZ 7.  You don’t need it in SZ 7.  But having it in SZ 13 can save a fighter, and thus, make a counter attack on SZ 7 much more fruitful.

Is there a nit that either of you will not pick with the other?
:wink:

@ncscswitch:

Is there a nit that either of you will not pick with the other?
:wink:

Yup.  I won’t argue who has the bigger penis. I’ll just re-iterate that women are genetically superior to men because God had to practice first to find the flaws, then created the perfect being.  :evil:

@Cmdr:

I’ll just re-iterate that women are genetically superior to men because God had to practice first to find the flaws, then created the perfect being.  :evil:

Then Why was Man made in Gods image?

and a woman was made from the rib of man.

She’s a copy of a copy… and we all know how poor THAT quality is!  :evil:

Pals, better end the sex-war debate  :-P All wars are bad (saving wars with plastic pieces , of course), but war of the sexes (spelling?) is the worst war of all  :cry:

@Mazer:

The problem is, this isn’t quite how it works in reality.  While it’s true the attacker can’t retreat from submerged subs, they can retreat before the subs submerge.

Now, I do see your worry and wonder whether CSub papers are built from TripleA playtesting data.

Guys, this is just silly.

Don’t you think that a CSub paper would be written under CSub rules?

We don’t write for LHTR, or TripleA, or DAAK, etc.  We write for our own system because it is the simplest and most coherent.

CSub rules are only one page long, and half of that is explaining the bid.  It is completely logical that we would use our own system, not someone else’s.

If you haven’t taken the time to understand the shortest rules around, then don’t be so quick to criticize.

Rules (last link):
http://games.groups.yahoo.com/group/Caspian_Sub/files/

Peace

Hmmm… didn’t know you had a rule set.  Sorry to have offended you.

I don’t intend to play by them, but they your comment in the paper makes much more sense given those terms.

@Funcioneta:

Pals, better end the sex-war debate  :-P All wars are bad (saving wars with plastic pieces , of course), but war of the sexes (spelling?) is the worst war of all :cry:

not if you wage it correctly  :-o :wink:

Oh, and allow me to add:

Fricking subs!

Oh crap.
I knew I should have taken the effect to see what CSub is.

Its famous enough. I know of it when I first researched about Axis and Allies (before I bought the game) but didn’t go into the site.

So I just thought CSub is all about policy papers.

1 page ruleset? Nows that amazing. I am going to check it out.

Ah. I just googled caspian sub and its all coming back to me.
I never found out about CSub because it requires joining.

Would nice if Mazer could post the ruleset here.

Did you notice NOTHING is downloadable without joining the CSub yahoo group?
Would be nice if CORE things were downloadable without joining.

I wonder why its like this.

LHTR, AARe and AARHE files are all avaliable to the general public without joining anything.

Also, you should note, that it’s a one page summary of CHANGES to the rules.  It is NOT a rules set like LHTR.  There’s a significant difference.

For one, someone who has never read the Revised Rules from the Box can play with the LHTR rules.  You cannot play with the CSUB rules under the same circumstances.

Man was the first made in God’s image.  Then God realized he made a mistake and fixed it on Human 1.1 (as we know, beta testing is always hard on the creator, there are all these bugs that have to be fixed.  That’s why we go with release after beta testing.  Women are the released version, men are the beta version. :P).

Two questions:

TripleA has an edit function? Is there a newer version that 0.9.0.2?

How come CSub rules say subs submerge before the attacker can retreat, when – as has been said – LHTR rules say attacker first?

Even under LHTR, I still think UnBaltic, fleet unification, whatever you want to call it is still one of Germany’s best openings. For one, if the UK does retreat to sz8, then the US strafe of sz7 will only have a bmb. The EUS ftr can only hit sz7 if there’s a UK ac there.

A bid of 1sub in sz8 can wipe out both UK bbs – though likely at the cost of a ftr – and sorta prevents a US1 landing in Alg, but Germany doesn’t make it very far in Africa. A Baltic ac forces a smart UK player to build ftrs and can still go north or sit in the Baltic, but it doesn’t slow down Africa landings.

Another result of UK retreating to sz7 could be that G1 doesn’t involve an air purchase. If UK’s not gonna bring the fight, then this could free up money for a G1 Med ac (and trn?) purchase to meet up in sz13 on G2, or other G2 air/sea purchases.

@Craig:

The LHTR are here.  And further more, they are the basis for everything moving forward.  (Yes, I have an inside line on things.  8-) )

Oooh more insider hints.
Still doesn’t fix the disappointment of LHTR 2.0 being a bit “LHTR 1.4”, yet.

Did you notice NOTHING is downloadable without joining the CSub yahoo group?
Would be nice if CORE things were downloadable without joining.

I wonder why its like this.

Because Mazer likes to review the posts so that things don’t turn into a “monkey dung fight”.  (His words, not mine.)

Thats just posting.
Is it not possible with yahoo groups to set public access to “files” and “photos”?

@hyogoetophile:

TripleA has an edit function? Is there a newer version that 0.9.0.2?

Yeah 0.9.1.0 unstable and 0.9.3.0 unstable.
I don’t use TripleA though.
But I try to keep up with things after I make a tiny contribution a long time ago, last year.  :lol:

I also want to speak regarding Yahell Groups.

I have run a pretty large number of them going back over the past 8 or 9 years (actually including the precursor sites that Yahell bought to create “Yahoo Groups”

Y-Groups are spam targets.  The only way to block spam is to restrict posting to members.

And as far as not being able to download papers, etc…
Even on THIS open site, guests cannot download files.  You have to join to be able to upload game files or to post, and you have to join to download.

If you want to hammer CSub about an issue, please do not make it access to their files, etc.  Joining is free and easy, and serves mostly to protect the members from being spam targets, and from spider harvesting.

@ncscswitch:

spider harvesting.

Spider Harvesting is having programs that scan the web looking for e-mail addresses, especially in places like web page guest books on on forums like this one an Yahell Groups.

The “spiders” go out and hunt down e-mail addys that are then sold to spammers.

@Cmdr:

Then God realized he made a mistake …

God makes mistakes?

That would make him…human…?