German buys turn one

squirecam

@Imperious:

If a fleet is bought in the med, then a dd, trans and 2 subs (36 IPC) are wasted in the baltic. They will die to the UK’s air, at perhaps a 20 IPC loss.

Germany has 6 fighters. For a mere 16 IPC, that adds 11 defense to that fleet. UK/USA must spend more than that 16 IPC to destroy it.

Going to the med may be a good or bad idea, but it does nothing to take advantage of the 36 IPC you have in the baltic.

Yes they are under direct threat of this, but you have to also accept that the allies will lose 2 fighters as well, which makes it 36 vs 20 ipcs lost and 16 net in germanys favor. Of course on uk 2 or uk 3 they may want to attack the baltic with fleet units.

Thus what about a carrier in baltic (and possible 1 tranny)?

and 2 tranny in medd.Â So now you got 3 tranny in medd shucking and 2 tranny in baltic shucking.

that method wont overload the factories in germany and units can flow from both factories.

I dont like the idea of trading my 36 IPc for Uk’s 20. If I got the bomber, its a wash, but this result does not always happen.

If you build AC in Baltic, and 2 trans in the med, what do you do with Egypt. Since the BB will be left behind to protect the new transports. You are left only with your 3-5 bid + lybia + air (and perhaps down a fighter). Not everyone will attack Egypt in this situation, correct?? You still need the UK BB, perhaps the DD, etc.

You attack in Round 1 as normal, then in G2 you smack the SNOT out of Egypt, and then raid Africa for keeps( at least for a few turns).

Imperious Leader

If you go the route of medd fleet then you do this on G2. On G1 you perform the usual moves and take egypt strong. G2 builds require the BB and tranny in central medd, for for that one turn your dumping land units in lybia.

One reason why i go bomber/3 fighters and sub on UK BB is so that i kill it in one turn. I have a 33% chance (something close) that the sub is also part of the medd fleet, giving me 3 tranny,sub and bb and 6 hit fleet!

I could even use one rouge tranny as a ‘trouble maker’ and get madagaskar and other otherwise closed territories. Of course this depends on the Uk fleet and japan.

Imperious Leader

So how bout these builds:

G1 CV in baltic, rest land

G2 3 trannys or 2 trannys in medd , rest land or 2 tranny in medd on G2 and 1 Tranny in Baltic G2

Baltic looks decent, the hole is covered, the sealion threat still exists, Africa is sound, you still get to shuck junk to russia, everything looks fine?

The only thing is a totally commited allied strong arm against one of your fleets… otherwise you got 2 axis lakes to swim laps in.

frood

You can build a tranny in the med if you also build a CV there.

Imperious Leader

If you attack egyps and build 2 trannies in south europe those 2 trannies are under attack from a lone bomber.

Chances are they will not survive that at all and the bomber can land on gibraltar or causasus. Im not an expert on chances but i think it is a acceptable risk to have 1 bomb vs 2 trannies.

Given that this will not enable me to destroy the baltic fleet but with an AC there i cant destroy it anyway.

Building trannies on G1 in the med is basicaly not an option unless you take both gibraltar + caucassus and thus forgo egypt.

The build of those two trannys is on G2, when your BB and transport have allready helped take egypt and now they stay in central medd and dump land units and protect those 2 trannys for one turn before moving on the better things on G3.

Again the CV is going in Baltic on turn one
the new trannys and the balance of german fleet stays one turn together. For this you do not need to worry about gibrater. Egypt was taken on G1 with 2 tanks and 1 infantry still remaining and backed up with 1 art and 1 inf moved over from algeria, plus the 2 more land units dumped in africa from southern europe.

frood

The only problem with that is that often on G2 I have other things for the med fleet to do - hit Ukraine, TJ, Cau or retake Egypt, which take it away from that seazone. So they are not around to babysit the new tranny.

Imperious Leader

Yes i suppose this may be an issue, but if you wait one turn instead of landing 2 units you can now land 6. This will give those ideas alot more punch in the long run.

caucasus would fall quickly if you got 6 infantry coming over every turn. Plus africa is a nice german backyard.

not waiting for one turn to get those 2 additional transports is like sitting in a chair before the paint drys.

frood

One other issue is simply production - can Germany fill 4 transports in the baltic and 3 transports in the Med every round? That’s 14 Inf (42 IPCs), leaving not much for heavier stuff. And is it efficient to be dividing your pressure between Karelia and Caucasus?

axis_roll

@froodster:

One other issue is simply production - can Germany fill 4 transports in the baltic and 3 transports in the Med every round? That’s 14 Inf (42 IPCs), leaving not much for heavier stuff. And is it efficient to be dividing your pressure between Karelia and Caucasus?

Heavier stuff???

How about just STUFF… Period.

Yes that’s alot of transport capability… and I know you won’t use it all in most cases, but can you afford to build less/few ground units on G1 and then turn around and take even more OUT if europe on the following turns?

That’s the smell of an Allied blood letting tickling my nose…

rjclayton

@Imperious:

Yes i suppose this may be an issue, but if you wait one turn instead of landing 2 units you can now land 6.

But if you don’t retake Egypt on G2 then you are potentially opening the suez for the british to come to the med on B3 (depending on their location). This could also create a problem.

frood

Well with those fleets the only immediate European landing zone for the allies is WE.

But yeah, 7 trns is too many for Germany to keep supplied. So if Germany were to build both fleets, I’d do 2 TRN Baltic, 1 TRN 1 CV Med.

Imperious Leader

One other issue is simply production - can Germany fill 4 transports in the baltic and 3 transports in the Med every round? That’s 14 Inf (42 IPCs), leaving not much for heavier stuff. And is it efficient to be dividing your pressure between Karelia and Caucasus?

OK the total investment is 40 IPC= 1 carrier and 3 transports total. In the baltic you will have 1 transport and 1 carrier more and in the medd you got 2 transports more by G2.

So the total is 5 transports which is 10 land pieces and not 14. You got 4 each turn landing in russia via baltic
and 6 landing from medd to africa/russia.

Also if UK decides to go hard against egypt with a fighter and 3 men against 2 tanks and and one infantry. I would think that would be an exchange and also India is totally weak. The german followup on G3 would be overwhelming beyond any hope. Plus on G2 the germans still have an infantry and artillery moved on turn G1 from algeria to lybia. The planes ans these 2 units would do the job IMO.

frood

Sorry, for some reason I was thinking you’d build 2 TRN in the Med and 3 in the Baltic.

Personally I’d rather put the AC in the Med though. Stay alive longer and enable the BB to be elsewhere when the TRN is built, and provides more fighter range into Africa.

Imperious Leader

Yes thats good. But the other idea is a balanced defensive fleet

in the baltic you got 1 cv, 2 fighters, 2 subs, 2 tranny, 1 destroyer= 20 points/8 hits ( except only 16 of these can hit planes)

in the medd you may have a BB, 3 tranny, and possible sub= 13 points/ 8 hits ( except that 11 of these can hit planes)

both fleets have 8 hits so in a way its balanced. If you dont build a CV in baltic that fleet is gonna die real soon.

frood

Well I feel like I’ve learned a lot in this little back and forth. I’ll be watching that game of JSP’s with interest, with the 2 AC 1 TRN build- not sure what I’ll do (and wouldn’t say anyway with another tournament game about to start).

By the way, you seem to refer to TRN as AP - what’s that from?

Baghdaddy

USN ship abbreviations

AP = Transport

http://www.valoratsea.com/shipdes.htm

Mind, it would probably be more accurate to describe the “Transport” in the game as a APA or AKA.

rjclayton

I’d put the AC in the med as well Frood. I think even with the AC in the Baltic, your Baltic fleet will not last beyond B3…if that long. Unless you are prepared to sink even more into your navy.

Imperious Leader

USN ship abbreviations

AP = Transport

http://www.valoratsea.com/shipdes.htm

Mind, it would probably be more accurate to describe the “Transport” in the game as a APA or AKA.

Thank you sweet duck.

I was hoping somebody would catch on to that.

But AKA is also something else.

BB=battleship
CA= cruiser
DD=destroyer
SS=sub
CV=carrier
AP= transport

You can go hardcore

CL= light cruiser
DE=destroyer escort
CVL=light carrier
CE= carrier escort
BBAV= battleship/ carrier hybrid ( the two japanese battleships that were retrofitted with catapult seaplanes following Midway)
BBB= Dreadnought
BC=battlecruiser

ezto

BEst German buy is a nuke :evil:

German buys turn one

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