L22 elche (x) vs Gamerman01 (+18) BM4

gamerman01

@elche said in L22 elche (x) vs Gamerman01 (+18) BM4:

Yes I read all posts. You break no rules and you get no advantage but me. I understand that my move with Japan was okay but I am not sure about the rule I send you. If I declare war to brit/Anzac in R3 USA can although declare war all Axis Power in R3 ? Mayby therefore you never saw this move because makes no sense if USA can attack.
But you have much more expierence with the game and so I have no problem to believe you and go on with the game.

Thanks for letting me know you did see the post!
I’ll try to make this as clear as possible so you are not confused.
YES Japan can declare war on UK/ANZAC round 3 and keep USA from doing anything on round 3, which is exactly what you did.

I haven’t seen this attack much because I think many players want to take the Philippines before J4 and use its bases and deny USA 7 IPC’s.

But there are several advantages to J3 DOW on UK but not USA and that’s what you did - good job. You denied USA several opportunities while attacking UK/ANZ holdings. And many players will probably not anticipate it which may give you more opportunities, like how I split the UK and ANZAC ships. About the only drawback to Japan is the Philippines and Guam can’t be attacked on J3.

gamerman01

F3.tsvg

elche

Thank you, I understand all and accept it. But for me is this a new rule and I will use it now. I think is good for the game this rule. Many other players like me didnt know or didnt use it. And the machine accept the US attack in R3. After 20 games you the first player use this rule. I remember games we played although with the US attack in R3 for the league.

gamerman01

Interesting!
I’m a little confused because I thought you made this J3 move knowing the USA could do nothing in response.
And you are saying in many other games players have declared war with USA on round 3 and were able to move as if at war, even though that’s against the rules? Because Triple A allowed it?
I’m the first player to follow the rule? I’m just really surprised!

Yes, USA cannot go to war until the END of its round 3 unless any Axis power has declared war on USA. USA gets the big money at the end of round 3, but still has to build on minor complexes at the end of round 3 (limit 3 each)

elche

I hoped so but I was not sure because first time I did the move and I just read once the notes and learn the rest in the games… But if you attack me I can only loose ac with fig and will cost you although units and I can attack again from sz6. Not so bad if you attack. Therefore I wrote the advantage for me that you didnt attack with USA and I looked for my old games and there are some without the rule.
If i played the Allies instead of you I had declare war because I did not know that it is not allowed. And yes, you are first player use this rule, in my games and doing politics against the machine I think. But I am new with the game and maybe complete wrong. So i am surprised too. But the rule is good for the game.

gamerman01

You also kept USA frozen in the Atlantic, and the 2 planes from the carrier could not go to London. And more.

Again, USA cannot be at war until the very end of USA3 (to collect the NO’s) unless one of the Axis powers declares war on the USA. So you played it right.

Not only can you hit the UK/ANZAC boats on J3, you also keep the USA from moving like she’s at war, and USA can only build 3 units per complex on USA3.

elche

I hoped it too because makes no scense if Japan declares no war to USA but USA can declare war at the beginning of R3.

gamerman01

Oh whoops. I forgot something. Triple A is right. I was looking at Europe only rules, not the combined world rules.

USA can declare war on any or all Axis powers if Japan makes an unprovoked attack on UK/ANZAC, which is what you did.

You can only keep USA out of the war and attack UK/ANZAC if UK/ANZAC provokes Japan by declaring war on Japan.

I’ve been speaking wrong this whole time - I am too rusty. Let’s not go back to USA3, we can leave it as I played it. USA could have gone to war at beginning of USA3 because Japan attacked UK/ANZAC without being provoked (UK/ANZAC never declared war on Japan) but I am willing to let it stand, especially because I didn’t catch it. I even thought Triple A was wrong. Embarrassing.

gamerman01

Page 37 of the Europe rulebook:

“The United States may not declare war on any Axis power
unless an Axis power either declares war on it first or captures London or any territory in North America, or Japan
makes an unprovoked declaration of war against the UK or ANZAC, after which it may declare war on any or all Axis
powers on its following turn.”

Your move still allowed you to single out and attack UK and ANZAC ships and the USA could not defend with them.
This is why I rarely see a J DOW on UK/ANZ and not the USA - because you can’t attack the Philipines or Guam or any other USA territory or unit, and the only advantage it gives you is that you can pick off ANZ and UK ships that would otherwise be protected by USA ships and planes, which is what you did.

Again, I’d rather not go back especially because of your lousy Italy dice, so game on with G4

gamerman01

And thanks for thoroughly discussing this with me. Maybe I won’t get confused about this rule for awhile.

elche

No problem. if you want you can start with USA R3 again. Better to destroy my ac and fig and attack Germany one round earlier. The Italian bomber is not really important.

elche

If Italian bomber and tank have at least 1 hit, there was good possibility to destroy russian fighters and make Novgorod free.

gamerman01

@elche said in L22 elche (x) vs Gamerman01 (+18) BM4:

If Italian bomber and tank have at least 1 hit, there was good possibility to destroy russian fighters and make Novgorod free.

That’s one of the reasons I won’t ask for a re-do. That and I should have known the rules, but thanks for your sportsmanship. I’ll let the Japs get away.

gamerman01

I may have caused a problem going local - it looks like the password and our e-mail addresses, etc are missing. I can just re-do the FRANZAC turn and post again

gamerman01

F3.tsvg

elche

Thats good. Than we have a fair game. Okay my italian Bomber is still alive but normally he will be destroyed in the next rounds and italians never buy it back.

gamerman01

@gamerman01 said in L22 elche (x) vs Gamerman01 (+18) BM4:

@elche said in L22 elche (x) vs Gamerman01 (+18) BM4:

If Italian bomber and tank have at least 1 hit, there was good possibility to destroy russian fighters and make Novgorod free.

That’s one of the reasons I won’t ask for a re-do. That and I should have known the rules, but thanks for your sportsmanship. I’ll let the Japs get away.

I’m sorry, I see I wasn’t very clear here. I thought not going back to USA3 also meant that I3 would stand as played, and that it’s time for G4.

If you want to re-do I3, then I want to re-do from US3, which I think is fair.

Do you want to continue with G4, where your Italian turn stands as played, or do you want to go back to USA3? Or do you have another proposal? I’m willing to talk and reason if you don’t like either of these 2 options. Sorry I screwed up the USA turn and thought it was a Triple A error.

So if we continue to G4, the USA is disadvantaged by not being at war, and Italy has poor dice. Or if we go back to USA3, then the USA can move freely as according to the rules, and you can re-do Italy’s turn then. Which do you want?

elche

Please start USA3 because its fair, You declare war and destroy jap. ac. and attack G. So the game continues like nothing happens and we play with right rules.

gamerman01

Agreed, that was easy, thank you

gamerman01

I’ve got a problem. I am trying to fix things with Triple A and I just uninstalled and re-installed it. Now I don’t have the password. Do you know it? I’ll ask Martin if he has it.

L22 elche (x) vs Gamerman01 (+18) BM4

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