@board-3659 I wish i had that file. I would be making changes however
Airbase needed for interception? V3
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Hi
Do you need an airbase to intercept for a strategic or carpet bombing attack?
I think not, but I want to be entirely sure.
I can only find that you need an airbase to scramble from the adjacent territorie.Thanks in advance
Jan -
Hello,
Good question. I first thought that the answer would be obvious, but when looking at the rules, it’s not so clear.
If your aircraft is in an adjacent territory, then yes you do need an airbase to scramble to defend the facility or the attacked territory (Rule 8.6) .
However, if your aircraft is already in the territory, the table for air combat mentions :
« 2. The Defender decides if he wants to scramble Fighters.
3. If the Defender has scrambled Defending Fighters, there is one round of interception combat […] »The use of « Scramble » takes us back to rule 8.6 which requires an airbase. It does not say anything about scrambling planes without an airbase in the same territory.
It feels a bit wrong that your territory can be better defended by placing aircraft in an adjacent territory with an airbase rather than where you think the attack will happen.
I have always played with the ability to use on-site aircraft to intercept, but I now find that the rules do not say that you can do so.
Maybe one for the FAQ/Errata ?
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@noneshallpass not only fighters have defending interception values. Also strategic and heavy bombers have a defending interception value. That makes me think it is not necessary, but as you say I to find the rules not explecit enough.
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I think the rule should be interpreted as, fighters can always scramble to their territory they are in, but need an undamaged airbase to scramble to adjacent territories.
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@insanehoshi @Noneshallpass
I’ve read the rules over and over again and I think it is clear to me now.*Table 9-9 Strategic bombing (p.43)
- The Attacker decides if he wants to send escorting Fighters
- The Defender decides if he wants to scramble Fighters.
- If Defender has scrambled Defending Fighters, there is one round of interception combat where all aircraft participate at reduced values. Any casualties are removed at the end of the Interception combat.
- Any surviving bombers continue to their target and roll for Strategic Damage.
- Defender rolls for inherent Facility Anti-Aircraft Artillery. One die per bomber, up to an unlimited number (not up to 3 like a normal AA unit).
- Damage is marked and eliminated bombers removed.
- The Attacker lands his aircraft in the Non-Combat Phase.*
Point 3 says that ALL aircraft participate (also defending bombers). So I assume the airbase is only necessary for fighters who scramble/intercept from the adjacent territorie. Wat made sence to me. Otherwise you need to build a lot of airbases.
Greetings
Jan -
General 6 Stars '22 '21 '20 '19 '18 '17 '16 '15 '14 '13 Customizerlast edited by Jun 10, 2021, 12:22 PM
Number 3 should have intercepting planes and scrambled fig or figs from a adjacent territory with an airbase.
To me it’s saying 2 things but not Pacification enough. -
General 6 Stars '22 '21 '20 '19 '18 '17 '16 '15 '14 '13 Customizerlast edited by General 6 Stars Jun 10, 2021, 12:39 PM Jun 10, 2021, 12:29 PM
Also I’m assuming the reduced values on intercepting planes in the territory being attacked is based on not enough planes getting in air or a late warning.
Also if fig scrambled from an adjacent territory from an airbase it’s value is reduced ? I’d think not.But if fig coming from another territory then it had ample time to know attacking planes coming. So then why the reduced values ?
Besides I’m not sending up bombers to intercept. -
@gen-manstein I think the reduced values are kind of a translation from AAA? (maybe a bad habit to compare to AAA). In AAA interception values from planes are lowered to 1 instead of normal attack/defend values.
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General 6 Stars '22 '21 '20 '19 '18 '17 '16 '15 '14 '13 Customizerlast edited by General 6 Stars Jun 10, 2021, 12:42 PM Jun 10, 2021, 12:41 PM
@jan-aerts said in Airbase needed for interception? V3:
@gen-manstein I think the reduced values are kind of a translation from AAA? (maybe a bad habit to compare to AAA). In AAA interception values from planes are lowered to 1 instead of normal attack/defend values.
Could be. I do know they made the aaa guns weaker from previous versions.
So then why reduce values on planes and making aaa gun weaker. It’s like 2 steps down for defending -
General 6 Stars '22 '21 '20 '19 '18 '17 '16 '15 '14 '13 Customizerlast edited by General 6 Stars Jun 10, 2021, 12:55 PM Jun 10, 2021, 12:51 PM
I can see the reduced values for interceptors and aaa guns based on aaa only shot down like 5-10 % bombers and you have to take a bomber as a casualty in the one round of dog fighting.
Heck you could even make bombers 2 hitters and if damaged has a reduced sbr attack.
Also loses one space movement on return. -
@gen-manstein Escorting fighters also have a reduced attack and the bombers don’t have an attack value (only the bombing run). So I think it is well balanced that way.
“Heck you could even make bombers 2 hitters and if damaged has a reduced sbr attack.
Also loses one space movement on return.”You lost me here :grin:
What is sbr attack and what do you mean by “loses one space movement”? -
General 6 Stars '22 '21 '20 '19 '18 '17 '16 '15 '14 '13 Customizerlast edited by Jun 10, 2021, 1:20 PM
@jan-aerts said in Airbase needed for interception? V3:
@gen-manstein Escorting fighters also have a reduced attack and the bombers don’t have an attack value (only the bombing run). So I think it is well balanced that way.
“Heck you could even make bombers 2 hitters and if damaged has a reduced sbr attack.
Also loses one space movement on return.”You lost me here :grin:
What is sbr attack and what do you mean by “loses one space movement”?SBR = strategic bombing raid.
And when bomber has to land on non combat, it moves -1 based on being damaged and represents a bomber crashing on way home due to damage. -
@gen-manstein Are those optional rules, because I never saw them in the book. Can you giver me a page?
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General 6 Stars '22 '21 '20 '19 '18 '17 '16 '15 '14 '13 Customizerlast edited by Jun 10, 2021, 1:29 PM
@jan-aerts said in Airbase needed for interception? V3:
@gen-manstein Are those optional rules, because I never saw them in the book. Can you giver me a page?
No. That was just a house rule thought if somebody wanted to add.
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@jan-aerts
@Noneshallpass
@insaneHoshi
To me, the use of the word “scramble” implies that scrambling is the mechanic used. Since scramble needs an airbase, I would assume that when scrambling for interception combat, one would need an airbase. This includes the same or adjacent territories.
That is my reasoning. I do think an FAQ would be useful. -
As a V3 designer take it from me you don’t need an airbase to intercept in the same land zone.
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@delaja
The use of the terminology is ambiguous here. -
This was clarified in the FAQ :
Q: As Defender, do you need an Airbase for your Fighters to intercept a Strategic Bombing raid?
A: No. Not if your units are in the same zone as the facility being attacked.
If from an adjacent land zone, they need an Airbase to Scramble.Case closed.
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