Don’t misunderstand this strategy for what it actually does
The name of the strategy says it all. “Countering the Russian Fallback line.” This by no means is a full complete guide on how to win the Eastern Front but merely a way to get past the so called “unstoppable wall that is the Redy Army.” Blitzkrieg, or as we know it to be called Flash War or Lightning War. Such a tactic is used in this scenario to take advantage of the Soviet positioning.
And you’re right, im against blobbing units together. Hence how I said it as a disclaimer at the end of the thread not to just keep a huge blob of units together that just March on Moscow.
Now that we’re on that. By the time the Germans take Moscow the game may as well be over. With national objective money and the steady campaign in the Middle East the Germans are capable of making over 100 IPCs a turn, and that’s without Sub Saharan Africa (i playtested this and saw it happen). And an player in charge of the Allies that thinks the game isn’t technically over yet after Moscow has fallen needs to smell the pavement because the reality of it all is that Germany has won the war having done this.
If you truly don’t believe that the enemy won’t send everything they have at you in the weak joint of your line up than thats fine. Charles de Gaulle didn’t believe this either and look how that turned out for France.
This strategy for the most part is still a prototype having that I didnt go into exact builds on as to what Germany should do and what they should build to make Blitzkrieg work and I might or might not state the terms of what should be done since ultimatly its up to the player to determine how to go about the Eastern Front. Touching on the topic of the Luftwaffe, if the Germanys luftwaffe is sitting in Western Europe inactive until the Americans make a landing then the Axis ought to find themselves a new player to play Germany
Like I said before, an effective German player will find use for all of his units, in terms of the size of the German airforce Germany should consistently be building up planes to make up for the loss planes in the event a battle doesn’t go your way and ultimately increasing the size of the airforce all together being able to have a full starting sized German airforce on the Eastern Front with some planes leftover to defend Europe. And last, these are planes for crying out loud. They can move 4 spaces at the least, so idk why you’re saying the Luftwaffe will be out of position
Just out of curiosity when Moscow falls ain’t the Allies pretty much liberating Paris ?
So there is no way Russia can take back Moscow ?
If Russia holds Stalingrad don’t you guys feel like Allies still can or should win ?
@gen-manstein
Exactly. See the thing is for a standard G3 attack, since I dont know a single soul that attacks on G1 let alone G2, would like to be getting at Moscow by around turn 6 at the earliest since a direct path to Moscow would take exactly 4 spaces from the original German-Soviet border.
As for what the Allies are doing, that really depends. The Allies or atleast the Soviets would hope that the Allies would be liberating Paris or at the very least close to liberating Paris, and if they aren’t then it’s game over.
As for Stalingrad, it’s one of the other priorities I feel Germany should inevitably have in the event the conflict is drawn out further than usual. It’s hard to explain how to exactly go about doing the Eastern Front since many people have many different ways of going about doing it. As for myself, I see less importance in Leningrad and more in Kiev and the southern portion of the Soviet Union since that’s where all the money is. As well as the fact that having taking Stalingrad and the Caucasus will qutie literally give you a bonus 10 IPC’s for the national objective of each these territories allowing the Germans to be able to pump out 70+ IPC’s a turn since they should be making roughly 50 if they’ve done their turn properly.
All it really comes down to is if the Soviets are willing to defend Stalingrad and if the Germans are willing to devote forces to take Stalingrad since unless you’re sending a secondary party off to go take Stalingrad, it’ll take you to G7 or G8 to taking Moscow which isn’t exactly ideal. Like I said though, for the most part I can guarantee a successful opening into a Barbarossa but unfortunately not a proper way of going about doing it since there are so many different options the German player can do and so many different outcomes.
But the Soviets should be building even after Moscow falls in the urals.
If Germany goes all out for Moscow then Paris should always get liberated. Unless allies play wrong.
Other option is if they just go after Stalingrad and oil fields then Germany of course gets money but should get some kind of victory point for each. Point for Stalingrad and a point for the oil in some way. Then u would have a clash there.
But don’t know if you have that in game.
I had a game not 36 39 and Germany took Moscow , lost Paris and west Germany and still barely pulled out a win based on Japan had to win the game then for a few more points. That was awesome.
Another game Moscow fell and Paris was liberated and Russia was able to hold Stalingrad based on correct IC moves, tankograd and Russian planes retreating after a certain amount of turn battles for Moscow.
Ok. Well good luck
@gen-manstein
You shouldn’t be losing Paris as Germany.
I assume the Americans are the ones responsible for the liberation of Paris which means 1 of 2 things.
Youre moving too slow on the Eastern Front and not taking Moscow in time or
Youre not doing anything to stop the Americans from landing.
In another thread a made i talked about how to counter the floating bridge to which the Americans are capable of shucking 8 troops at a time into Europe being they properly set it up.
The way to counter this is by doing Afrika Korps. Afrika Korps allows the German Player to build a formidable navy and send a decent amount of units down to Africa to stop the American Operation Flashlight
@luftwaffles41 said in Countering the Russian Fall Back Line:
@gen-manstein
You shouldn’t be losing Paris as Germany.
I assume the Americans are the ones responsible for the liberation of Paris which means 1 of 2 things.
Youre moving too slow on the Eastern Front and not taking Moscow in time or
Youre not doing anything to stop the Americans from landing.
In another thread a made i talked about how to counter the floating bridge to which the Americans are capable of shucking 8 troops at a time into Europe being they properly set it up.
The way to counter this is by doing Afrika Korps. Afrika Korps allows the German Player to build a formidable navy and send a decent amount of units down to Africa to stop the American Operation Flashlight
Depends on what you are looking for in the game. Why should Germany never lose Paris then ? Is game setup for Paris to fall in 44!and like on turn 10 or something ?
@gen-manstein
Well assuming you’re playing with natural OOB victory conditions, if Paris is being liberated by turn 10 then that’s way too late for the Allies. 4 turns late to be exact. It takes America roughly to turn 6 to get a complete floating bridge up and running and Germany only to turn 3 to officially get a navy and formidable sized army down to Africa to assist Italy as well as it’ll take the Germans to G6 to reach Moscow which is right around the time the Soviets are wanting reinforcements from Siberia and planes from UK middle east.
All in all, the Axis have the absolute advantage to win the game swiftly and soundly its up to them to enact that properly.
Ok. Not a fan of allies stuff able to go to Russia. Should only be from lend lease.
Ok. Nice talkin.
@gen-manstein
Yeh, I really don’t like it either. More often than not the UK will put a complex on Persia then slowly build up fighters and when Germany arrives they just stack all their fighters on Moscow I ain’t a fan either.
Glad I could answer your questions man! Obviously this strategy still needs some work but I just got done running a track race so I need some rest before I do that.
If you have any other questions about Germany id be more than happy to answer them with the best of my knowledge
Well I don’t play this game but was just getting up some chat about different stuff about what Russia has and don’t. Since ain’t much going on else ware.
@gen-manstein
Do you play A&A Anniversary? Thats another favorite Axis and Allies game of mine
No. Good game though. I’ve been playing 39 games since 2009.
Now I play my 41 game with group.
@gen-manstein
Ahhh okay I see. By 39 do you mean Global War 1939?
Ya. 2 buds have 39 games. Then group started playing tigermans 39 game from HBG like version 6.0. We played that. Gar was involved too. Discussed stuff with tigerman and changes were made and then HBG came out with version 1 39 game.
Then we played and discussed stuff and rules where adjusted up till version 7.2 rules.
Then HBG came out with I believe version 2 36/39 and nice map but then my group and a few other groups wouldn’t play it based on to many rules and then version 3 came out which you guys are playing now.
So after playing version 1 39 US would get to war to late in game and Russia had issues. I had like 8 house rule changes but pretty much group was done with game. So I never got a chance to test.
So in mean time I came up with my 41 game so everybody is at war and axis at peak strength.
Most guys love when US is at war at start of game.
And now we got about 50 games in on that.
Setup of my game. Plus map I made. Almost done with another version of map. 
@gen-manstein
I’ve always wanted to play 39 it seems engaging dont have the time to buy the board and pieces though
Oh I guess I read the thread title wrong. Never mind on the 39 stuff.
So yes u could make changes to the g40
Game.
You interested in playing the captains expansion g40 rules ?
@gen-manstein
I’ve heard of the Grasshopper rules but not the captain. What exactly is that?
He’s suppose to be post rules pretty quick. Has been posting individual rules here and there.
@thedesertfox Except Germany hasn’t won the war. You still need Egypt or London. Accompanying a middle Earth strategy do you expect to claim egypt after:
a: Losing a huge chunk of your forces in the battle for Moscow
b: Fending off American Beachhead.
Floating bridge finished or not. If the USA player sees planes leave striking distance of the shores of Western Europe they will be staging as close as possible, dumping troops in North Africa, setting up to take Rome, etc. You don’t need much to cover transports if the luftwaffe is in Ukraine. Unless the Luffwaffe is at least in Western Germany you can’t retaliate against a landing.
Assuming Moscow falls turn 6 AND your planes were on Bryansk to start they will be at best Eastern Poland at the end of the turn. To reach Bryansk they would have needed to be on Western Germany end of Turn 4. USA would see this and probably stage in Gibralter SZ 91 with minimal coverage, maybe 3 transports, a couple carriers, Battleship, cruiser and destroyer.
This means turn 5 when the luftwaffe heads over to Bryansk, America is free to beachhead in France. Turn 6, Moscow falls, wave 2 arrives in France. Turn 7 potentially a 3rd arrives probably with 4 transports or more and your planes still cannot touch American navy. So yes, your planes are out of position turn 4, 5, 6, AND 7 to do anything against the incoming invasion if you plan on sending them over to crush Moscow. I was being generous buy suggesting 2-3 turns.
Add to all this, the sheer ability to harass that America has from SZ91 alone. Listing possible targets that Germany can’t cover all at once: Normandy, Southern France, Holland, Norway, Denmark, Western Germany, Northern Italy, Rome. If the German player takes planes to Moscow for the early capital grab America can establish a beachhead or land troops wherever it pleases to cause the most damage to your game. Letting USA establish a foothold is really bad.
I am sorry, I do not see how this is a new strategy. People have known that you could claim Moscow hands down as Germany if you brought everything to the table from the get go. This is nothing new. The challenge still remains, can you hold onto everything in Europe AND capture Egypt before the end. USA is not just going to sit around and wait. They will mobilize turn 4 and at the very least make sure you hold back your planes. They will at the very least establish a strong enough presence in N.Aftrica with tanks and Mechs to make sure Axis never claims Cairo. With Moscow falling on 6 and a luftwaffe unable to touch the American transports until 8, the floating bridge is established anyways if they only needed 5 turns of building to begin with any planes required to defend transports can be built on 5 or six and land on carriers before Germany can remove them. Its a tough prospect. Especially on the Europe board alone where there’s no Japan to pressure the States.
