AARHE: Phase 2: Naval Combat

so we need to determine what is a good number required to form a ring around all your primary warships

maybe the OOB rule of letting your submarine-attack casualities fire back is not realistic

in fact, should submarines fire in opening-fire?
if so, should an early warning from friendly DD actually let you fire back?

destroyers are guranteed a chance to hit back…is that realistic?

@Imperious:

destroyers are guranteed a chance to hit back…is that realistic?

++++ well the subs can still sink a ship… only that it now gets a parting shot… ok i think i see what you mean… you want to allow the sub to still maintain its premtive shot, but then also allow any destroyer/ cruiser the ability to then search and attack the sub under ASW ideas?

yeah sort of
so ASW by destroyer/crusier would be in in opening-fire now

(probably more realistic than saying destroyer fire at enemy destroyers (in main round fire), meanwhile throws a few depth charges and chases enemy submarines too)

ships killed by submarines in opening-fire are removed and do not fire in main round fire, whether there was a friendly DD around, whether the submarine was detected at all, whatever ship it is

you don’t have duke’s contact right?
yeah people come and go
maybe he has a life and forgot about us already  :evil:

yeah I’ll compile the current standing of phase 2
this one is gonna be long

@Imperious:

Ok great … sorry to ask this but can you compile what we got at this point for phase two?  We have to reword my horrible linguistic interpretation of the new combat system.

Plus i feel some new people will join us soon and it would be good for them to see where we are in a single thread for phase one and two…

the question remains:  where is Duke?

Please do! I didn’t really get to understanding the gibberish you guys had on Phase 1 so I got lost in the general ideas for combat… It would help to understand it in Rule form…

GG

yep I’ll get to it soon

for now read about phase 1 at
http://www.axisandallies.org/forums/index.php?topic=6743.0

it comes with justifications in italics  :-)

Hey guys, two completely random naval combat ideas: Sherman DD amphibious tanks and Catalina flying boats!

(These are new units)

DD Sherman Tank
Cost: 6 IPCs
Move: 2 (1 when on water)
Attack: 3
Defense: 2
Ability: Able to move across sea zones; may not blitz

PBY Catalina Flying Boat
Cost: 18 IPCs
Move: 7 (8 with Long-Range)
Attack: 4
Defense: 1
Ability: No SBR; able to attack ships?

*What do you think? Swimming tanks can be able to help D-Day. Fact: They were used in the actual D-Day landings, however a lot of them sank at Omaha (27 of 32)

Need to double check the level of deployment of these swimming tanks to see whethre its under the level of abstraction in AA.

But there is a place for sure a unit in our amphibious assault rules!  8-)
These tanks would actually fight from first round!

Our current rule is that only attacking INF fights in the first round of land combat in an amphibous assault.

ARM and ART fights from second round and only if there are surviving attacking INF in the first round.
This is to model the capturing of the beach, without which the slow offloading of tanks and artillery from landing craft would make them sitting ducks.
This is probably the reason why historically infantry were the first waves in amphibious assault.

See… I didn’t even see those rules… So we need a compilation. Btw I saw Phase 1; is there still room for changes?

Ok

oh yeah we need to formalise naval combat antiair

current the these units are assign antiair values

Cruiser (CA) 4
Destroyer (DD) 2
Battleship (BB) 1
Carrier (CV) 1

SS (submarine) and AP (transport) have no antiair capabilities

just let these units in opening-fire in every round roll a dice hitting on 4, 2, 1, and 1 respectively?

I think CA makes more sense for CArrier that Cruiser.

Perhaps add for the Amphibious tanks “cannot move more than 1 (or 2) SZs from a coast”. It doesn’t seem realistic to have a tank moving across the Atlantic or Pacific.

@Adonai:

I think CA makes more sense for CArrier that Cruiser.

Sorry I didn’t explain earlier.
The abbreviations of naval units are US hull classifications.

Yes exactly! but was this the correct value?  was it not:

Cruiser (CA)  4
Destroyer (DD)  2
Battleship (BB)  2
Carrier (CV)  1

ok sure

anyway, but is it too powerful?
a Cruiser fleet, 66% chance of downing an air division, every cycle of combat

I duno.
I only hear 10% of downed planes are due to land antiaircraft, 90% by enemy planes.

I have no idea whats the breakdown for naval combat.