Tutor game: AndrewAAGamer (X) vs trulpen [and everyone else] (A+50) OOB

trulpen · Jun 9, 2020, 6:22 PM

@surfer said in Tutor game: AndrewAAGamer (X) vs trulpen [and everyone else] (A+50) OOB:

I would move every possible Russian unit south. Build Ukraine 1 turn and retreat to Bryansk. Need to block the southern group from marching into Caucasus for cheap. A contingent of German fast movers+2 italian tanks could take down the Middle East before Persia gets going. The goal is to make it impossible for G to split his forces N&S. Just has a single unit moving along the N side. They will still march to Moscow, but the Middle East will have time to build up.

I agree that the key squares here are Bryansk and Rostov.

trulpen · Jun 9, 2020, 6:24 PM

Sorry, should’ve continued. The germans are not in Ukraine or even Bessarabia yet. There’s still time to pull back to Bryansk from Belarus when the time is ripe.

surfer · Jun 9, 2020, 6:42 PM

The point of focusing hard in the south is perhaps academic since we are just going to give ground anyway. But the German forces are strategically split to go after 2 objectives simultaneously. They have a good chance of getting both. We most definitely cannot stop him from either.

But since his forces are split, we can force him to stay consolidated in the south by consolidating our position. The reason I care about this is that typical Allied defense of Moscow involves air from Middle East factories. I think we are setting up that exact plan. I don’t want the Germans to be confident enough that they can send a contingent of 10 mobile units wandering south and picking up beaucoup NOs + destroy Persia.

trulpen · Jun 9, 2020, 6:47 PM

Definitely. But would you say we’re hard pressed to consolidate in Bryansk already now and not in the next turn?

Arthur Bomber Harris · Jun 9, 2020, 7:09 PM

@trulpen No need to fall back to Bryansk this round. It will be perfectly safe to consolidate forces there on R3. That part is scripted.

With only 3 Russian artillery, he can easily move his Poland slow-movers to Eastern Poland this turn. The slow movers from Romania can go to Bessarabia or Eastern Poland, depending on his preference on the Northern or Southern route around the Marshes. Nothing that you can do to slow him down on G3 or G4.

I assume that he will bring back his German planes on G4, having them in position to support his G5 move to Bryansk if he chose the Northern route, or support a break away tank/mech push into the Middle East. Not much that Russia can do until that critical moment.

Saber25 · Jun 9, 2020, 7:20 PM

I like the all infantry buys for Russia. That is what has personally worked for me in my last few games. I don’t really have any understanding of can-openers or Italy’s role in Russia though. Are you planning to pull the eastern troops back or threaten the Japanese north in a few turns?

trulpen · Jun 9, 2020, 7:21 PM

@Arthur-Bomber-Harris said in Tutor game: AndrewAAGamer (X) vs trulpen [and everyone else] (A+50) OOB:

With only 3 Russian artillery, he can easily move his Poland slow-movers to Eastern Poland this turn. The slow movers from Romania can go to Bessarabia or Eastern Poland, depending on his preference on the Northern or Southern route around the Marshes. Nothing that you can do to slow him down on G3 or G4.

E Poland is a great square. I’m happy if he gets the mIC in Ukraine as late as possible. We can’t stop the conquest of Leningrad. If R builds only inf this turn, then G can enter in E Poland with a slight advantage on defence. Just building 3 mech by the front gives R a positive TUV-swing. Not sure how valid the threat is though. Russia is very happy with the abscence of luftwaffe anyway.

trulpen · Jun 9, 2020, 7:22 PM

@Saber25 said in Tutor game: AndrewAAGamer (X) vs trulpen [and everyone else] (A+50) OOB:

I like the all infantry buys for Russia. That is what has personally worked for me in my last few games. I don’t really have any understanding of can-openers or Italy’s role in Russia though. Are you planning to pull the eastern troops back or threaten the Japanese north in a few turns?

That’s a key issue. There are ups and downs for both ways. I want it discussed. Dissected.

Saber25 · Jun 9, 2020, 7:28 PM

It seems to me that they don’t have much support and there is already a lot of Japanese infantry up there. They won’t really be able to be used offensively without additional aid, but they could stop you from hemorrhaging points in the far east. On the converse, it seems like there is a chance they make it back to Moscow, and that is a big addition to your man power meat shield. I usually like to pull them back, but that’s just my two cents.

Saber25 · Jun 9, 2020, 7:29 PM

Maybe keeping up there slows down Japan though? But at what cost…?

Arthur Bomber Harris · Jun 9, 2020, 7:33 PM

@Saber25 Those 12 Siberian troops are stuck in this game. Japan can easily pivot and wipe them out with the help of a few planes. They won’t be much resistance to the 10 inf+10 planes if chooses that option, although that distracts him for a couple of turns from the more valuable objective of the Money Islands and India.

There is no way that the 12 Siberian troops will make it back to Moscow. They will get wiped out by German troops + planes. I think that is an even smaller distraction since those German planes are never out of position to aide with other attacks.

Arthur Bomber Harris · Jun 9, 2020, 7:35 PM

@trulpen I personally have been a supporter of the Northern Route because it allows the Germans to move into Bryansk on turn 5. In our separate game where you took the Southern Route, it is an additional turn or two before you can get threaten Moscow.

The Southern route has the advantage of the additional mIC and faster progress into the oil fields. I have seen many of the top players choose that option now.

surfer · Jun 9, 2020, 7:51 PM

@trulpen No do not pull back this turn. I suggest reinforcing Ukraine with 3 inf + whatever can move there. It will not stop G, but then you can pull back more units in Bryansk. Also, put all remaining buys in Moscow. Nothing up North. The point is that in 2 turns we should try to have as many as possible in Bryansk

Arthur Bomber Harris · Jun 9, 2020, 10:16 PM

@surfer building 3 infantry in Ukraine should stop the Germans from attacking. They don’t have any airforce support, so would have to use 3 tanks to capture the town. Two of them would likely die in the attack and the final one could be killed with one Russian infantry next round. That would be an expensive loss for the Germans.

Add in a plane and Ukraine can’t even be attacked on G4. No Italian can opener to create a safe landing zone for those Gibraltar bombers if I count the squares right. A bit awkward for Germany not to have a bit of support with at least one German bomber and an Italian fast mover.

farmboy · Jun 10, 2020, 12:11 AM

They are only useful to bring back if you can get them to Moscow in time. To get the back in time, you need to make sure that you can delay the Germans from hitting Moscow with overwhelming force in rounds 6 and 7. To do that you likely need to put some pressure on them elsewhere and have air in the Middle East that can join them. You might need to calculate conservatively what those combats look like then and you will regardless need to be thinking about how Persia (and/or Norway) can be set up to provide air support to Moscow. I suspect that if you can set up to hold out until those units in Yakut arrive, you are probably not going to need them to arrive. And there is a huge risk that they will be too late. They don’t have much offensive power but they force Japan to commit if it wants to take the Soviet Eastern territories and that pulls units away from the South. I think a Japan attack there is more trouble than it is worth so I would leave them in Buryatia.

Also, I would put a mech and tank in Leningrad unless you are placing inf there. The air is probably safe, but an attack by two tanks is a low risk high payoff attack especially since so much of your offensive power as Russia is in those air.

Omega1759 · Jun 10, 2020, 6:34 AM

If it were for me, I would put the 12 infantry + 2 AA in Amur, the 6 infantry in Buratia and bring 1 fighter to Yenisey to have option to support a counter-attack with at least 7 infantry. This attack would require putting ships out of position,

One question, can Japan attack Buyant-Uhaa right after walking into Amur without putting all neutrals against them, or no?

surfer · Jun 10, 2020, 1:41 AM

If Japan attacks Buyant-Uhaa, before they turn Russian, which they don’t do until after Japan’s combat round. Then its like attacking a True Neutral, all the other True Neutrals are allied against you.

Omega1759 · Jun 10, 2020, 1:49 AM

@surfer

Thanks, very helpful. Then there are 9 infantry for the counter-attack, that’s quite good.

trulpen · Jun 10, 2020, 6:34 AM

@Omega1759 said in Tutor game: AndrewAAGamer (X) vs trulpen [and everyone else] (A+50) OOB:

One question, can Japan attack Buyant-Uhaa right after walking into Amur without putting all neutrals against them, or no?

No, it has to become russian first, which happens only at the end of their CM.

trulpen · Jun 10, 2020, 10:40 AM

@trulpen said in Tutor game: AndrewAAGamer (X) vs trulpen [and everyone else] (A+50) OOB:

On a note, the german trannie is a dead trannie.

No it’s not. G will build before R goes next turn. Think I somehow had the impression that R was in the war by now. Silly me.

Tutor game: AndrewAAGamer (X) vs trulpen [and everyone else] (A+50) OOB

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