AARHE: Phase 3: land Combat

I’ve decided to scrap this idea… not enough time to flesh it out before my card deck gets released.

Here is a different way of playing with Fighters.
The Carrier combat value as been change to keep balance amongst themselves: attacking against defending Full Carrier.
Hope you will enjoy.
Let me know if you ever play-test it.

@Baron:

Another way to play a 1942.2 game with some elements which can simulate air-to-air combat between Fighters or against Bombers are as follow.
This House Rule keep the same principles as the opening post system:

Fighters are having dogfight against other Fighters and Bombers and not just hitting grounds targets (as casualties chosen by owner’s) acting like a shield.

That Strategic Bombers are weak and vulnerable against Fighters in air-to-air combat.

But Strategic Bombers have a heavy payload of bombs against ground targets.

There is no special phase in this HR and the dogfight in SBR is consistent with the air-to-air combat value of Fighter and Bomber units.
However, it implies a few changes on combat values and cost of these units:

FIGHTER
Attack 2
Defense 2
Move 4
Cost 7
Always hit enemy’s aircrafts first, if any available.
A Destroyer must be present to hit submarine.

Strategic Bombing Raid Escort and Interception
Attack 2
Defense 2

STRATEGIC BOMBER
Attack 4
Defense 1
Move 6
Cost 12 (Optional: reduced to 10 IPCs)
A Destroyer must be present to hit submarine.
Can make a Strategic Bombing Raid against Industrial Complex.
OPTIONAL: Every time on attack a “1” is rolled, then an enemy’s plane (either Fighter or Bomber) must be taken as casualty.

**Strategic Bombing Raid Escort and Interception
Attack 1

Damage on IC: 1D6+2**

1942.2 FLEET CARRIER
Attack 0
Defense 3
Move 2
Cost 14
Hit: 2 hits
Carry 3 planes (Fighters)
Damaged Carrier can still carry 1 plane.
Carriers are repaired at the beginning of the Power’s turn (Purchase and repair damage phase),
unlike Battleship which are repaired at the end the player’s turn (Placement phase).

ANTI-AIRCRAFT ARTILLERY
Attack 0
Defense 0
Move NCM1
Cost 4
1 hit
Up to 3 preemptive defense @1 against up to 3 planes, whichever the lesser,(as OOB AAA) and
fire regular defense @1 against up to 1 plane on the following combat rounds.
Stop any blitz, but cannot defend itself against enemy’s ground units.

Additional units are added:

For every 2 Fighter units, you can add on the board 1 new Fighter unit.
USSR gets 1 additional Fighter unit. (1 Fg is put in Russia.)
UK gets 2 additional Fighter units. (1 Fg is put on Carrier, 1 Fighter is put in UK.)
USA gets 3 additional Fighter units.  (1 Fg is put on Carrier, 1 Fg is put in Western USA and 1 is put in Eastern USA.)
Optional: You can add an AAA in China instead of a Fighter in Eastern USA.

Germany gets 3 additional Fighter units. (1 Fg is put in Northwestern Europe, 1 Fg is put in Germany, 1 Fg is put in Polland)
Japan gets 3 additional Fighter units. (2 Fgs are put on each Carriers, and 1 Fg is put in Manchuria.)

@Admiral:

Hi Baron,

I know it’s been a while since you posted this, but I have been toying with the idea of increasing air-to-air combat in a way that is very similar to what you have presented here.

I think the A2 D2-3 C6 Fighter is a very interesting idea. Having them target other air units before anything else is a simple and effective way to simulate that air-to-air combat. I also like how the combat values would now be the same in SBR (makes things simple).

I also really like how you altered Tactical Bombers to be A2-4 D3 C8. The two attack bonuses really give meaning to the importance to air supremacy.

I am curious to know how these two units have worked for you.

Thanks!

It evolves into this roster:
Baron’s HR units charts and set-up for 1941, 1942.2 and AA50
http://www.axisandallies.org/forums/index.php?topic=36833.msg1469053#msg1469053

The main reason is because of too many combined arms and bonus for TcBs and Fgs.
Makes for longer combat round and more details to consider to get the correct bonus per combat round.
Since the point was about hitting directly other planes, I simplified the TcB special ability.
That way, combined arms is now reserved to ground units.
So, it is easier to focus on what is specific to Fg and TcB.
I always start combat rounds with preemptive AAA, then these two units (when present) fire, then all other units.
HTH.
Baron

Yeah, I forgot about those weird situations where you have certain units that can’t hit other certain units - like planes and subs not being able to hit each other if no destroyer is with the planes.
In those situations, you have to do a little more figuring than usual. Still, even with rolling dice you still have to roll separately in those instances so it’s not that much different.

By the way, Low Luck can also be used for things like anti-aircraft rolls. Say you have 6 bombers attacking an IC. In regular dice, you would roll 6 dice trying to get ones. However in Low Luck, you can simply remove 1 bomber as an automatic hit.
The drawback here is that now the attacker still has 5 bombers to plaster your IC. If you rolled dice, you have a chance at getting anywhere from 0-6 hits.

Please, I need everyone opinion.
And more specifically, I’m asking people which have a lot of experience with G40 games.

Because I’m still trying to keep the OOB Carrier and develop a real Fighter unit (able to hit directly planes) within the OOB combat values of G40 Full Carrier (A6 D10 / A7 D9 / A6 D8), I’m locked within some borders. Here they are.

Do you think this can still be a viable Fighter unit?
Or is this already and ultimately doomed because it remains too powerful with a Defense @3 which hit directly enemy’s planes?

Does a reduced cost for planes, such as minus 2 IPCs, (ex.: Fg at 8 IPCs, TcB at 9 IPCs, StB at 10 IPCs) can change something about balancing this Fighter unit?
(Here, I thought about a reduced cost as a way to compensate for high attrition rates amongst planes.)

This also rise the issue about such high SBR values, does an increased risk to loose valuable 12 IPCs Strategic Bombers still worth doing SBR? Or such revamped Fighter unit imply to revised SBR, anyway?

Details below are provided to understand what I’m talking about.
I’m not really trying to promote this new unit but rather asking people about obvious flaws which can be seen from experienced players POV get used to play with a lot of units and IPCs coming along with any G40 games.

Down below are the three aircraft units combat values and cost:

FIGHTER
Attack 2 can rise to 3
Defense 3 can rise to 4
Move 4
Cost 10
Air combat unit: All hits are allocated to aircraft units first, if any available
Air Supremacy bonus: +1 Attack/Defense when no enemy’s aircraft
Air Superiority Weapon bonus:+1 Attack/Defense when fighting against only enemy’s aircrafts.
This last point is an entirely new feature:
it is provided to ensure that Fighters on Carrier can still have a high defense against any Strategic Bombers Spam, such as Darkened Skies strategy.

Combined Arms bonus: gives +1 Attack / Defense when paired 1:1 with Tactical Bomber unit

SBR escort mission: Attack @2
Can intercept in SBR: Defense @3.

Carrier operation: up to two units can be on board a fleet Carrier (max.: 2 units of any kind per fleet Carrier)

TACTICAL BOMBER
Attack 3 can rise to 4
Defense 3 can rise to 4
Move 4
Cost 11
Air Supremacy bonus: +1 Attack / +1 Defense when no enemy’s aircraft

Combined Arms bonus: +1 Attack / +1 Defense when paired 1:1 with a Fighter
Combined Arms Bonus in Tank support, Tactical Bomber as a “Tank Buster”:
+1 Attack / +1 Defense when paired 1:1 with Tank

Tactical Bombing Raid: Attack @2
TBR damage: 1D6 on Air Base or Naval Base
On SBR can also do escort mission: Attack @2

Carrier operation: up to two units can be on board a fleet Carrier (max.: 2 units of any kind per fleet Carrier)

STRATEGIC BOMBER
Attack 4
Defense 1
Move 6
Cost 12
Strategical Bombing Raid: Attack @1
SBR damage: 1D6+2 on Industrial Complex, Air Base or Naval Base

No Carrier Operation

Now in SBR situations, aircrafts will be fighting each others with more logical values:
Fighters: Attack 2 Defense 3
Tactical Bombers: Attack 2 Defense 0
Strategic Bombers: Attack 1 Defense 0

@Uncrustable:

Tac bombers need something, they are rarely produced relative to fighters and strat bombers

I would also suggest letting tanks roll a 4 for each tac bomber present if air supremacy has been achieved, that is for each tac bomber one tank rolls at 4 instead of 3. Tac bombers do not change
This even further increases air buys and also gives tanks a buff which they need

We already have a round of combt befor normal combat (AAA) just add all planes to that round, everything hitting on 1s. Easy

Air supremacy is checked for each round of combat, before any dice are rolled for that round

These rules will magnify both fighters and tac bombers buys as well as tanks, and also promote a combined arms approach to purchases similar to artillery and infantry

You want enough fighters to achieve air supremacy, but also a good even amount of tac bombers and tanks to maximize air supremacy when you do achieve it

This kills multiple birds with a single stone
It should reduce somewhat the infantry/mech spam with sprinkles of artillery that we see now
It also indirectly buffs AAA as each AAA adds 3 more dice to the air battle in defense, and increases your chance of gaining control of the skies

Very thoughtful ideas. I like them.
However my first impression is your HR change much more the balance.
I’m looking for just small changes.
I will come back on this.
You have some compelling reason like this one:

We already have a round of combt befor normal combat (AAA) just add all planes to that round, everything hitting on 1s. Easy

Thank you very much for your challenging ideas.

@Imperious:

The reduced values are realistic because the target is a fast moving plane and not a slow moving tank.

My point is: if you don’t dominate the skies, then you can’t loiter around doing the damage required to neutralize a dug-in infantry division, for example.

IMO, there should be some decrease in fighter lethality if enemy fighters remain in the battlespace.

ok ill make a third version with the changes you asked for. Tonight.