League General Discussion Thread

What is the plan for the league playoffs this year.

The league rules are a bit outdated and I don’t believe they reflect the league as it is being played. Up until the release of PTV this year 99% (didnt actually calculate but its close to this) of the games the last few years have been BM3. The 2018 playoffs and 2019 playoffs were both conducted using BM3 since that is the game the the league actually plays. This year things are a little different as PTV was released and allowed with league rules.

The rankings as they are (with one exception) reflect BM3 play. I dont see how its reasonable to have any game other than BM3 used to determine league champion. I also think league champion means absolutely nothing outside of the context of this community so I think its perfectly reasonable for the community to decide how things are considered which is why I am asking.

I think at minimum there should be a league playoff where the sole game played is BM3. If there is enough interest I think there could also be a PTV bracket. But I think that would be better for next year when the game has time to be further developed. The PTV game as it is has been changed several times throughout the season and while I like the idea of a PTV tourney, I dont think there is a real way to determine participants based on exisiting scoring. Cant just take the top 8 and put them in a PTV tourney since a good portion of the top 8 have played almost no PTV.

I will admit that I am biased to this discussion. As things stand now if everyone in top 8 were to participate in tourney I as the 4th seed would probably be forced into playing OOB which I wont do as I have played zero games of OOB. I rejoined the league after a several year hiatus 3 or so years ago and at that time the league was playing BM3 almost exclusively so recognizing that that was the game the league was playing, that is the game I chose to play. Having an OOB game determine playoffs in a BM3 league makes no sense (and would only be considered because the league rules were never really updated and so a loophole exists that doesnt reflect play in the league).

Sorry for the long post…

One of the reasons I signed up for League play was because the rules said the League and Tournament was OOB. My gaming experience is all OOB with the exception of one BM3 game. So if I had to play BM3 in the Tournament I would be at a large disadvantage.

Having said that I would not want to force players to play OOB if they absolutely would not want to. So like @ksmckay I probably would decline to play in the Tournament if it is just BM3 so the rest of the players, assuming they all want to play BM3, can play and have fun and not be forced to play a game they do not want to. Perhaps at the end of the year the top 8-10 players can vote on the versions they are willing to play?

BM3 is the dominant version. I think it should be the version played, unless both players agree to play some other version.

I also think BM3/4 should probably be the default although OOB does still get played here too. I do think BM3 and OOB are fairly close and maybe appropriate bids would make it easier for folks who have strong preferences one way or the other. PTV strikes me as more substantially different. But if there is willingness to organize it, there is no reason we can’t have more than one playoff organized around different games. So we could have a PTV tournament alongside a BM3/OOB one. And players could also choose which one to play in or even play in both (although it may make sense to avoid that to widen the # that can play).

An issue here is that the work of organizing falls on @gamerman01. I don’t know what that looks like so I’m not sure if it is a reasonable expectation. Or maybe someone else can volunteer to help with the moderating?

I would rather play the OOB version. its what the league is built on and the reason all of are playing rite. the PTV does not reflect the A&A we’re all used to. not even close to the OOB version for rules. my self i think it should be played in the play boardgame forum not the league. BM3 is close and i play it because thats what everybody wants to play. when i play the OOB version on the board with my friends they are pretty strict with not altering the rules. they also don’t play on the site because its not about the OOB version played all the time. my self i play a lot of different games here and i love this site. just my take on things. i hope i didn’t offend anyone.

@dawgoneit you won’t be playing in the league finals, your opinion just doesn’t matter in this discussion, sorry to say. If I was playing in the league finals I’d want to play BM3.

if my opinion don’t matter this should be discussed in a private room then. has the tourney started yet?

@dawgoneit if you paid attention you would know that the tournament is supposed to start Jan 1

cool, my bad. I’ll stay out of things. thank you all for the info.

Easy on the Veterans here @bretters.

I totally understand your point @dawgoneit and I think it will be considered since a lot of people here do still play OoB here. Maybe just not more frequently than the BM in League games these days.

BM3 is good with me. didn’t mean to anger anyone. I do like that version also.

Dawgs input is welcome as well. How the league determines playoffs should be a question that everyone who is playing in league can speak to, although I assume gamerman gets to make the final decision. In past years, multiple playoffs have been set up to include people below the top 8. The point is to find rules that are inclusive enough of the different preferences people have, so that people are not discouraged from participating.

I played in the B-final last season and was tricked into playing OOBsolete. Never again.

@trulpen hahaha… neither would i dude, neither would I!

@dawgoneit because PTV is an elevated game, haha. Also… most people are still playing BM3 more than PTV.

Hmm, perhaps P2V should have a separate league. I guess Gamerman01 wouldn’t really want to moderate two leagues though. I would consider doing it.

Maybe it is self-explanatory, but isn’t really the main issue here that people tend to play different versions (OOB, BM3 and P2V) depending on what they prefer, which may then be a problem when deciding what to play, especially in the playoffs? The fact that there is more than one game to choose from is not in itself a problem, I don’t think.

I am fairly sure you can play in the top 8 group and INSIST on playing OOB. Unless the rules has been changed recently… I am not saying you should, although i dont understand why you automatically should be disqualified because everyone wants to play BM and you dont.

It could be relevant now to have 3 leagues OOB, BM3 and PtV

OOB and BM are becoming more and more different these days. When BM first came out bids of ~6 for axis were common. Now we are approaching 30 for allies…

I think i would prefer 3 leagues now

@oysteilo said in League General Discussion Thread:

It could be relevant now to have 3 leagues OOB, BM3 and PtV

OOB and BM are becoming more and more different these days. When BM first came out bids of ~6 for axis were common. Now we are approaching 30 for allies…

I think i would prefer 3 leagues now

But as someone who plays multiple formats (BM3 AND PTV) I wouldn’t want it to be separated into separate leagues.