Should we make better rules for invadable neutrals? (1940)

@FranceNeedsMorePower

That’s a better idea, especially since Japan is usually somewhat stretched to the limits on their declaration of war on the US.

For players who have questions to the Game Mechanisms of the G40 HRE game, we draw attention to the fact that this thread explains what is “Behind the Scenes”.

See the top of the first post in this thread for further information.

We’ll gradually add more Information & Explanations about the remaining Units & Rules in the G40 HRE rulebook.

@jonahawesome

Hi,

Go to “Customization” and “House Rules” section at this forum - and search for:

Global 1940 Basic Expansion Axis & Allies Global 1940 House Rules Expansion Axis & Allies Global 1943 House Rules Expansion

Fell free to contact me, if you have any questions concerning those expansions.

This rule is part of the Axis & Allies Global 1940 2E, House Rules Expansion.

The increased IPC values in the Pacific Theatre (which reflects both strategic importance as well as oil resources - see Topic that describes the Expanded Pacific Theatre) makes this Battlefield crucial for both sides - in order to turn the tide of War to their own favor.

The Increased Ship Building rule helps both sides to perform major offensives and create multiple Naval Task Forces.

G40 Increased Ship Building.pdf

I’m reviewing all Vichy rules available out there, as I plan to make a unique mod, because I like historical realism and simplicity, with minimized luck of dice, and some “asymmetric balance”.

Some major points I’ve posted elsewhere in the forum:

The main issue for this expansion is how to develop French neutrality, while at the same time providing a bonus to Germany. Apparently ignored by most players, in real life (IRL), Germany economically exploited Vichy, which had to richly sustain 300,000 German troops stationed in Northern France. Therefore, in the game, it only makes total sense that Germany gets the 3 IPCs from Vichy Southern France.

Another related major issue is what to do with French colonies in terms of neutrality/occupation and IPC flows. I agree that the Vichy setup should reflect what happened IRL: North Africa, Syria, and Indochina go to Vichy, while other French colonies stay Free. However, it messes up Italy’s incursions into North Africa (as IRL, Hitler denied French colonies to Italy). I’m not sure yet as to the best approach to subjecting these colonies to invasion, occupation, and who gains IPCs (other than agreeing that Japan has easy access “rights” over Vichy Indochina), and also remote units…

Germany never fought Vichy. IRL, with Operation Torch, Germany simply occupied Vichy in 1942, with no resistance whatsoever. Vichy units were disbanded. That can be also the case in the game. Just remove Vichy units.

The uncertainty surrounding local pre-battles is quite interesting (will Vichy troops welcome or resist Allies in North Africa?..). However, I’d try to minimize dice randomness that is often used to decide some outcome. IRL, Vichy troops (just like Italians) surrendered as soon as seeing enemy superiority: thus, in the game, if Allies send more land + air units than defending Vichy units, then there should be no battle but quick surrender. Or, make it highly unlikely that a battle would ensue (for example, need to roll a 1).

I’m now working on my own house rules, for an expansion (HBG lingo) that is quite realistic, fun yet simple. If anyone is interested, let me know and I’ll be happy to share my rules when ready…

phd_angel@yahoo.com

Chicago, December 2020

Imperious Leader:
the whole idea of subs is to be on station waiting for some target to come by… If you just allow any destroyer to “SEE” the sub automatically on CM it defeats the purpose. I feel you must install that roll the DD has to make to achieve detection ( either that 3 or 2)

++++ Thanks Imperious Leader for your comments, you are right, I’ll drop this. Ditto the hidden subs.
Here are the new rules (bold stuff is new):

A player can submerge a submarine in his NCM phase or during his CM phase
when he retreats from an attack. Place a control marker under the
sub every round after the round where the sub submerged. When two markers are under the sub, it has to surface
in the next round. (In effect, it can move 8 fields submerged: 2 in the submerging round, 2 in marker one
round, 2 in marker two round, 2 in surfacing round).
(This may be a bit too much, I’ll have to playtest it. Maybe one marker is enough, making for 6 fields)

A submerged submarine may move through hostile sea zones without restriction.
Exception: When it enters a sea zone with an enemy destroyer in it, a die is rolled
for every sub in the pack. All subs must surface if at least one 3 is rolled (super sub: one 2)
Corollary: It is only allowed to enter a sea zone with a destroyer in it in a combat move phase.
Combat ensues when the subs have to surface.
The number of destroyers does not influence the detection dice roll, only the number of subs
(similar to AA gun / Fighter / Bomber rule)
The player may of course make a normal move and simply surface and attack the
destroyers in its CM.
All subs in the same sea zone have to surface at once.

**If a destroyer enters a sea zone where submerged enemy subs are stationed in a combat move,
they are detected on a roll of three (on a two for super subs). Again, roll as many dice as there are
subs in the sea zone, the number of destroyers has no effect. If a sub is detected, they are all detected
and have to suface.
(Optional rule: DD can go sub hunting: if they only move one sea zone in their CM phase instead of two

this has to be declared in advance - they may add 1 to their detection roll.**
Subs are never detected during a destroyer non combat move.

**4)  Attacking and defending subs may submerge except when an enemy destroyer is present (as stated in LHTR 1.3.).
If the sub submerges during combat, this round counts as a full submerging round.
Example: A sub has one marker under it, indicating that it has been submerged for two rounds.
In this round, it attacks on its CM phase, but retreats during the attack by submerging (or, if victorious, it
submerges in its NCM phase). Do not remove the control marker, instead, place another control marker under
the sub.

The markers are only removed if the sub surfaces during its NCM phase. (In effect, giving the opponent
the chance to take at least one combat action against subs even if he does not posess destroyers).**

So, I think I’ve thought of most of the stuff that can occur, I’ll start playtesting,  any feedback is welcome :-)
Additional thought: with this new sub capabiltiy, maybe it would be wise to raise the price of the sub?
(for instance to 10 IPCs?) And maybe the super sub advantages should not be applied to the DD detection
roles. Any comments would be much appreciated.

Regards,
sponge

oh wow that will be helpful…

Your right Guerrilla Guy, but they cant shoot out of the transport