Best spot for US to land?

I agree that in Europe (only! not with Pac in play) Spain is a cheaper landing spot but the shuck does NOT reach Belgium/Paris/Italy the turn after landing in Spain. You canNOT blitz through facilities and must stop in either Normandy or Southern France (which have facilities…).
The German counterattacking machine is more than adequate enough to deal with that, so you have to build up a couple of turns anyway, not leaving Spain for as long as the build up is required.

So in short, it is cost effective, but threatens all the same (not more) as landing in Gibraltar for a decent amount of turns and is therefore not faster. AFTER the allies have taken (and hold!) either Normandy or Southern France, THEN the shuck is expanded inland.
Also consider that IF using only half the amount of trannies to cost-effectively channel troops into Spain, Germany also only faces half the threat on West Germany and can thus station more troops in Paris! Defending Europe suddenly becomes cheaper for Germany and I suspect by the same amount as it is cheaper for the US to channel troops into Europe!

Attacking South America (etc.) causes the USA to loose tempo, also a very important thing to consider! I think taking Spain is an OK strategy like any other with pro’s and con’s, but the USA should not overdo it by also investing time and resources in taking South America. That would relieve Germany of a lot of pressure for too long allowing it to focus on Russia longer.

By the way,
the allies always only need naval escorts in 1SZ (where the transport fleet is located). The UK can build a Naval Base in Guyana South America (or Iceland when Norway = liberated) where transports can stage safely if the escorts are in the channel or the Med. From there they can get to the escorts next turn.

Am I missing something when it comes to U.S. invading Spain?  I thought you couldn’t build IC’s on true neutrals.

@ODF:

Am I missing something when it comes to U.S. invading Spain?  I thought you couldn’t build IC’s on true neutrals.

You can build minor ICs on any territory (with a value of 2 or more) that is under your control from the beginning of your turn, except on islands.
Once Spain is attacked/invaded it is no longer neutral.

I thought you could build on Hostile or Friendly neutrals under your control, but never on “true neutrals” like Spain, Sweden, Turkey.  Even after you invaded them.

@ODF:

I thought you could build on Hostile or Friendly neutrals under your control, but never on “true neutrals” like Spain, Sweden, Turkey.  Even after you invaded them.

Major ICs can only be built on originally controlled territories (value 3 or more). Other than that there is no rule supporting your thoughts, sorry.  :-)

@P@nther:

@ODF:

I thought you could build on Hostile or Friendly neutrals under your control, but never on “true neutrals” like Spain, Sweden, Turkey.  Even after you invaded them.

Major ICs can only be built on originally controlled territories (value 3 or more). Other than that there is no rule supporting your thoughts, sorry.  :-)

No need to apologize :evil:  Taking true neutrals and building minor ICs sounds like fun.

In Europe the only way to win as the allies is to land in Spain. The axis will know this and will position to take Sweden/turkey right away, but the ability to have a safe landing spot for your tranny shuck is too worth it. Also US should only take venezuela/brazil in South America. The tempo lost with taking Chile and Argentina isn’t worth it

My personal preference is to land in Spain, but you need to build up  a lot of transports and land units to land there because of the infantry defence and that there is usually (in my experience) quite a lot of Axis forces in Southern France/Normandy. The gains of the Axis moving into the now Pro-Axis controlled Turkey and Sweden can be countered with a constant stream of transports in the following turns and a minor IC on Spain.

When the U.S. is landing in Spain you need to commit all your resources bought to it or you can possibly lose it. Always land prepared.

If Italy is cornered but has too much of a stack, I like totake the Balkans.

I love to get the allies into Greece,but its so far away from US.If Us takes Greece ,they’ll need to re-enforce with UK and or Russians.Last game I played I picked up French inf from Africa rather than send my tts back to EUS.In Greece you 'll likely cut-off axis from activating a pro-axis Turkey.(if you’ve attacked Spain).
  Another good aspect is that your fleet is convoying axis from sz97 while parked off balkans.

The reason the only landing spot that works is Spain is because Germany’s threat projection from his 12+ planes makes having to protect two sea zones from possible attack hopeless. Also US needs to be sending 18 ground over a turn. That is 18 transports needed for the shuck from East US to Spain, 9 off Spain and 9 off East coast. To land anywhere else throws off your shuck really bad, and there aren’t any other good “staging” areas on the map. Say you want to take Norway and hold it. You would have to have at least 10 ground troops. That is 5 transports that you’d have to defend, and then you’d have to defend it with your entire fleet, making the defense of your other transport fleet really difficult. Not only that but Norway is a million miles away from the US and you have to defend two sea zones to make that shuck work.

After Germany takes Moscow, around turn 8 or so, he can easily build 20 ground units a turn in West Germany/Germany to defend. If you haven’t been stacking Europe with guys already you have no hope of overcoming Germany’s defenses.

This is why Global is so broken. US can’t really do much In Europe other than land in Spain and shuck back and forth. You can’t do this shuck in global because Japan will surely win in the Pacific.

If Russia is down turn eight, you obviously mismanaged the war effort ;)

There is literally no way to stop Russia from falling on T8 if you are playing low luck. In dice you can get really really lucky I guess…

You might be correct that Spain is the way to go but I’m skeptical.  It seems too easy for Axis to win if they get control of Turkey and activate additional reinforcements as they move south. But I might be underestimating the long-term benefits to Allies from controlling the neutrals (if they can block an advance from Turkey, which is what seems dubious).  I don’t see much opportunity for Allies to take out the neutrals safely while also bringing sufficient pressure on Axis to avoid defeat.

Most prefer to land in Normandy if the opportunity presents itself but it’s also evident that if Axis are determined to prevent that they can.  Yet even a failed Normandy landing could be a long-term benefit if Axis are delayed from taking Moscow.

If Axis have Western Europe covered, there is always Norway.  Sure, Norway is far away from the major fronts.  But if Allies get a fleet established off Norway, Axis need defensive cover for Normandy, Western Germany, and Germany.  That ties up alot of forces from being deployed in Africa or against Russia.

@theROCmonster:

There is literally no way to stop Russia from falling on T8 if you are playing low luck. In dice you can get really really lucky I guess…

Really? How much of the German economy is being spent on Russia in your games? Are you trying to put enough pressure with Britain and the US? Is Germany ignoring its other interests?

With Russia are you making sure you pull back most of your troops? Never get in a battle that has odds against you. Only defend a territory if you can do it successfully.  Make sure Germany can’t outrun your troops to Moscow. Build plenty of infantry and fighters if Germany is trying to bomb you. If you are playing Global, think about getting some of those 20 units from the Pacific side.

I may be missing a rule or something, but to me Gibraltar is the lynchpin to the US invasion.

Once taken, it allows access to all of Italy, Southern France, Normandy and Holland. If the US builds up to 4 loaded transports and escorts before T4, then buys 4 each (transport, tank, infantry) at 64 IPC for a few turns, it’s very hard to defend since there’s wave of 8 pieces each turn.

If the UK ties up Italy, Germany is exposed on three fronts while fighting Russia.

I just finished a game with my son. He was pressing Moscow and had a sizable force in Normandy, but  after landing in Southern France and surviving the first wave, with RAF softening from UK, the next wave hits Normandy, then the fighters go in to defend and no matter how much Germany builds on France, it can’t stop the buildup as UK bridges.

I had the UK take Denmark as a pause to keep the German Navy enclosed, but ultimately a destroyer screen by the UK outside of Denmark, plus a simple destroyer screen and roving Battleship for the US
to protect the transport cycling is enough to sustain.

Am I missing a rule regarding Gibraltar? If so, a naval base in Morocco would do the same (provided the Med was clear of Italian Navy).

The problem is the US won’t be able to do anything with those transports off Gibraltar because the axis will be able to counter attack the allied ground forces almost anywhere they land. Not only that if you move to land in say Southern France, now your transports are woefully out of position. Also Russia just gets absolutely creamed in this version by Germany and Italy’s can opening ability. You need to have US send a steady stream of 18 ground a turn into Europe. That is 9 transports off Gib landing in Spain, and 9 transports off Eastern US getting ready to pick up the land units for the next turn. Good players won’t let you land in a beneficial spot for the allies without significant loss of tempo from moving your transports and fleet way out of position.