Russian Subs

@knp7765:

So you are suggesting that the British player loses his capital so that he can sink the German navy? Seems kind of far fetched to me. Yeah, I guess if the German navy were taken out, it would help the US Navy later on and they could liberate London possibly. In the mean time, Germany got to plunder the British treasury and run hog wild on Russia while Italy gets strong in the Med and Africa since the UK can no longer replace their losses there. I suppose India could send stuff over to face Italy, but what if they are being pressured by Japan?

Yes, but Germany spent 2 rounds of income on a fleet so they essentially lose their ground units, probably some air units, the French treasury and whatever ground they have left would be sitting on London, assuming this worked/works.

So what’s holding back the Russians at that point?  They can DOW the round London falls.  (great, now I have that Fergie song in my head!  Bastages!!!)

Thanks for the answers, I had figured as much.  I might have to re-print the rules and go over them again with the gang next Saturday.

To be fair, this is why you never ever ever send carriers anywhere without a destroyer. The same problem happens if you send a carrier plus fighters to attack submarines. Since the carrier doesn’t roll attack dice and the fighters can’t hit the submarines, you just have infinite rounds of combat until the subs either sink the carrier or the units retreat.

This is also why it is recommend that when playing the pacific side as either Japan or the US, you purchase at least one sub for every carrier that the other side purchases.

You should also never tip your carriers on defense if you have no where for your planes to land, since the attacker will almost always retreat and watch your planes crash into the ocean for free.

If you take Southern France, don’t forget there are two surface ships in z93 that convoy raid it.

@thoes426:

can subs attack other subs?

if both sides have submarines present in a naval battle with destroyers, the subs must participate in combat. however, as soon as a side has removed all destroyers as casualties and their opponent still has submarines, they may submerge and escape the battle if they wish.

Therefore, during the combat movement phase, a power may choose to attack a lone sub with a lone sub, but during the resolve combat phase the defender may choose to defend and resolve combat or submerge before any dice are rolled (the defender is not required to make that choice until all combat movements are finished).

Remember this: Submarines have 3 special abilities,

1. Submerge to escape combat
2. Pass through hostile sea zones within their movement limit
3. Surprise strike disallowing casualty rolls

A submarine may not do any of these with an enemy destroyer present.

In my experience, people forget to use their own subs special abilities, once their opponent removes their destroyers in the early rounds of the battle.

Japan/Russia has no effect on UK/Anzac relations to Japan.
UK/Anzac can declare war on Japan “when they want” (so to speak)

Well atleast the reds tried to escape.

@Natasin:

@zooooma:

I recal a concern about this that if UK is at war with Japan but Russia is not at war in Europe, Russia can land a fighter in Egypt, forcing Italy to ignore it or attack Russia.  This only really works if UK declares war on turn one or two, and Germany has not attacked Russia by turn two or three.  I don’t see this as a problem for the Axis:

Japan would love a DoW by UK

Germany tends to attack Russia anyway

UK can generally hold Egypt by turn two without the Russians

If it’s the ahistoric nature of the situation that bothers you, how do you feel about Japan helping Italy in the Med, or America ignoring a Japanese occupation of Hawaii?

I’ve seen it noted before ( I believe by Krieg) that the attacker can choose to not attack units that it is not at war with. So technically Italy could still attack and Russia would just watch from the sidelines. Because it isn’t a combat turn of Russia, then I doubt they could choose to go to war at that one moment especially if it’s before turn 4.

That only applies to sea zones. If Italy takes the territory, and the Russian plane remains, what happens?