So we know that Russia can and will be taken out of the war due to the Revolution but what happens to her captured territories? Do the CP get to keep all the gains they’ve made in Russia over the course of the game (with the exception of Moscow and Petrograd) or will they have to give them all up and lose vital economic points needed for the Western Front (which America will probably be fully involved in. A third option is that the CP get to control certain territories in Russia upon its exit from the war even if they didn’t capture said territory? What do you think?
Even if Larry doesn’t explain it I assume you’ll just have a player take the occupied territories (probably Germany, but just let the CP players hash it out). You could go ask this on his official site, it seems like something he might actually answer :wink:
Good luck with that.
Reminder: Revolution is an optional rule.
Good luck with that.
Reminder: Revolution is an optional rule.
Really Flashman? I expected you to dive into this one headfirst.
Well, this one’s tough, because in history, Russia and Germany haggled over territory Germany had already taken, and in the game, we don’t know in advance how many/which territories they will take. We can assume, however, that Germany (or the Central Powers in general) will have at least 4 Russian territories, since this is a condition for the Revolution occurring according to Larry’s rule.
Three or more territories adjacent to Moscow are controlled by the Central Powers.
At least one other original Russian territory is controlled by the Central Powers or contested.
Moscow is controlled by Russia or contested.
So maybe the CP have to return all the territories adjacent to Moscow, and get to keep the additional territory? I don’t know. Not even sure if Larry will address it; from his writeup its seems like Russia just disappears from the game.
I meant good luck getting Larry to reply…
My own system for RR is posted elsewhere: reds vs whites in civil war shock!
Given that (I assume) an unlimited number of units can be built directly into the capital, these tts are likely to be very tough to crack; so why not have revolution rules for every power? If you want to KISS and not do the morale thing then relate it simply to number of home tts occupied.
Given that (I assume) an unlimited number of units can be built directly into the capital, these tts are likely to be very tough to crack; so why not have revolution rules for every power? If you want to KISS and not do the morale thing then relate it simply to number of home tts occupied.
Yeah, I like your morale system (haven’t read it, where’s it posted?), and especially the fact that it applies to everyone. After all, the Germans had their own revolution at the end of the war.
Germany surrendered before the Allies even entered Germany, never mind took Berlin. A morale tracker is a much more relevant depiction of how and why countries lost the war; and that the winners were not so far from collapse themselves at certain times.
And, after all, if the game is finely balanced, won’t it potentially go on forever? Or do we assume that American entry will produce a definite result, even with capitals captured, because it causes such a huge imbalance; that is the CPs have to win before American industry is fully brought to bear.
Flash I would like to see a more bare bones morale tracker that only goes from 0-15. Some simple penalties at each increment of 3.
And to keep track of your morale with National Control markers on your capital. For instance, of you are at 8 morale you have an NCM, a dark chip and two light chips.
Also a rule called “war weariness”
Speculation on how the RR might work, based on the simplest rules I can formulate.
The map doesn’t follow the Treaty line exactly, but assume it ceeds the CPs:
Finland, Livonia, Poland, Belarus, Ukraine, Sevastopol.
Leaving “Great Russia” as Karelia, Moscow, Tartarstan & Kazakhstan.
When the treaty is enacted:
1. All Russian units are removed.
2. The CPs must evacuate Great Russia by either
a. Moving all units in these tt one space into CP held tt, or
b. Moving them into the Mobilization Zone, to be placed in the respective capital the next time that nation places new units (no cost).
3. CP units in the Ceeded tts may remain, or be sent to the MZ as per b above; however in order to occupy and collect income from them the CP must retain at least one infantry in each ceeded tt to hold down local nationalists. The Allies may also control these tt under the same terms.
4. No player may enter Great Russian tts under any circumstances.
5. If capturing the capital allows the victor to grab the vanquised nation’s money, all Russian held cash is distributed between the CPs. If they cannot agree on the cut the Russian player chooses who gets how much.
6. Any allied units on Great Russian soil at the time of the treaty have one turn to evacuate under the allied equivalents of a & b above; if they cannot do so they are eliminated (interned).
7. Allied units in the Ceeded tt may remain and fight or evacuate as per a & b.
My gut feeling is that Germany, Austria-Hungary, and the Ottoman Empire remain in control of the territories they control when Russia exits and the remaining Russian territories are out of bounds.
What about other Allies on Russian soil?
Suppose Russian and British forces are contesting Finland with Germany - what happens here?
They’re required to withdraw?
or
They’re allowed to stay but collect no income?
or
I didn’t think that far ahead?
