Uh…
OK so on round 1 Germany takes Southern France and then UK leaves a pair of unescorted transports in z91.
Italy declares an attack on Spain via z93 with 1 sub, 1 transport, and 1 infantry (even though there are no allies ships in z92 or z94). Italy also declares an attack on the UK transports with the bomber, with plans to NCM over Spain and land in South France.
So the bomber attacks the UK transports and sinks them. Then the sub fails to sink the French ships, there is no landing, Spain remains strict neutral, and the bomber crashes.
:?
Uh…
OK so on round 1 Germany takes Southern France and then UK leaves a pair of unescorted transports in z91.Â
Italy declares an attack on Spain via z93 with 1 sub, 1 transport, and 1 infantry (even though there are no allies ships in z92 or z94). Italy also declares an attack on the UK transports with the bomber, with plans to NCM over Spain and land in South France.
So the bomber attacks the UK transports and sinks them. Then the sub fails to sink the French ships, there is no landing, Spain remains strict neutral, and the bomber crashes.
:?
Exactly!
OK, you’ve convinced me. Since an amphibious assault is a declared attack, the neutral territory should join the opposing alliance when the attack is declared, and scrambling to defend it should be allowed. That makes sense.
To be honest, this was actually my initial gut reaction, but the word “invaded” in the rules implied to me that units actually had to enter the territory (plus, I wanted Gamerman to be right :-)). However, the word “attacked” is also used in the same sentence. This is a case of where using alternative terms for “flavor” in the rules can lead to confusion over shades of meaning.
It never ceases to amaze me that new situations can keep coming up for years after publication in a game like this.
So the neutral territories become pro-other side the moment the attacker announces the attack at the start of combat movement phase; not when troops actually enter the neutral territory. And a defending alliance can scramble to defend against an amphibious assault on a neutral that is pro-their side. Thank you Krieghund.
Well that was a lot of fun. :)
Thanks Krieg
On a similar note
EXAMPLE
Germany attacks Yugoslavia G1, and the allies opt to replace the Yugo pieces with “French” units.
Germany’s attack is a one round strafe, and they retreat. England chooses to land an aircraft in Yugo on UK1.
Question #1. By UK landing, is Yugo now activated? Or can planes land but not activate?
Question #2. Are the “activated” pieces, now French - as originally placed? or UK because of the plane landing?
Per above
Question #3. If UK lands ground units into Yugoslavia, and the Yugoslavian (French units) forces now switched from French pieces to british pieces? or are they activated for the French?
Here are my guesses:
1. Planes don’t activate territories, similar to in the case of the Dutch (Brits can land planes in the DEI but can’t take control of them without ground units).
2. They would still be French since they were not activated.
3. I would say they become British, since the only reason they are French units is because come country’s pieces are needed to represent them (since there are no neutral units in the game box).
The planes land but do not activate. Yugo does not become French; they are Yugoslavian units that can defend but not attack because Yugoslavia doesn’t have a turn. But if UK drops an infantry from the transport after Taranto, then they are activated and become British.
So the neutral territories become pro-other side the moment the attacker announces the attack at the start of combat movement phase; not when troops actually enter the neutral territory. And a defending alliance can scramble to defend against an amphibious assault on a neutral that is pro-their side. Thank you Krieghund.
I think Krieghund is saying you can scramble to defend a strict neutral, actually. Because as soon as the attack is declared, the neutral is on your side.
On a similar note
EXAMPLE
Germany attacks Yugoslavia G1, and the allies opt to replace the Yugo pieces with “French” units.Germany’s attack is a one round strafe, and they retreat. England chooses to land an aircraft in Yugo on UK1.
Question #1. By UK landing, is Yugo now activated? Or can planes land but not activate?
**No, it takes an infantry, mech, artillery, or tank to activate. Planes can land, and the territory will not be activated.Question #2. Are the “activated” pieces, now French - as originally placed? or UK because of the plane landing?
The rulebook is clear it does not matter what nationality of pieces are put down. It is totally irrelevant. They can’t move**
Per above
Question #3. If UK lands ground units into Yugoslavia, and the Yugoslavian (French units) forces now switched from French pieces to british pieces? or are they activated for the French?
Again, the nationality that is chosen when Yugoslavia is invaded is irrelevant. If UK lands ground units into Yugoslavia, the infantry that was in Yugoslavia that is being activated must be UK now.
If I have 2 german infantry on an italian transport. I move the italian transport on the italian turn. Can I do an amphibious assault on the german turn using a single infantry and move the second infantry during the ncm phase?
If I have 2 german infantry on an italian transport. I move the italian transport on the italian turn. Can I do an amphibious assault on the german turn using a single infantry and move the second infantry during the ncm phase?
Tested in triple A and triple A does not allow it. So I am assuming it is a no.
Right, it’s a no, because once a transport unloads, it is DONE for the turn.
Can you do a landing with an inf and an AAA (which you loaded in a previous turn)?
Can you do a landing with an inf and an AAA (which you loaded in a previous turn)?
A noncombat movement landing, yes. They would have to go to the same territory.
You can never move AAA during the combat movement phase, however. So you can’t take over an empty enemy territory with an infantry and AAA together, during the combat movement phase.
Can you do a landing with an inf and an AAA (which you loaded in a previous turn)?
A noncombat movement landing, yes. They would have to go to the same territory.
You can never move AAA during the combat movement phase, however. So you can’t take over an empty enemy territory with an infantry and AAA together, during the combat movement phase.
Hmm, the rulebook says they can move during the combat move iff they’re being carried by a transport, but there’s no reason to move a transport during the combat move if you’re not going to do an amphibious assault with it, right? Unless you want to use it as fodder for a sea battle you expect to win barely?
OK, well the way I think of it, it’s the transport moving - the AAA is riding on the transport.
You can use a transport in the combat movement phase to do an amphibious assault that has an AAA previously loaded on it (earlier turn) and you could be unloading the infantry in an amphibious assault and necessarily leaving the AAA gun on it, so that is how you could possibly be “moving” an AAA gun during the combat movement phase.
Transports can’t be used as fodder in sea battles, so that doesn’t really make sense. Again, a transport laden with an infantry and AAA gun (the AAA would have to have been previously loaded, and could not legally be loaded this turn) could be moved in the combat movement phase in order to amphibiously assault with the infantry.
Also, a transport could be moved in the combat movement phase in order to avoid combat with enemy surface warships that the transport was sharing a zone with at the beginning of the turn.
Oh right, I forgot about transports escaping combat…
Are you allowed to assault with one infantry and leave the AAA on (until noncombat)? In general, if you have 2 units on a transport, can you unload one during combat and unload the other in noncombat or not even unload the other at all in that turn?
Yeah, I thought the transports could be used as fodder if the last enemy units manage to kill all your units plus extra transports, but I think that’s impossible, since you’d need at least as many units as them to kill all of them in the first place, and so they wouldn’t get to your transports.
