There seems to be some confusion here. The rule in question is not “Sea Units Starting in Hostile Sea Zones”. That rule is fine, and it’s not relevant to the question at hand. The situation that we’re dealing with is sea units starting in sea zones containing enemy subs (and/or transports), which are not hostile, that you want to attack. The relevant rule is higher up on page 13 (Europe 2nd edition):
You can move units through friendly (but not friendly neutral) spaces en route to hostile spaces during this phase. However, units can’t end their movement in friendly spaces during the Combat Move phase except in four instances.
Tanks and mechanized infantry that have blitzed through an unoccupied hostile space (see �Tanks, Mechanized Infantry, and Blitzing, page 15).
Units moving from a hostile sea zone to escape combat as their combat move. …
…
The part that concerns us is the second bullet point. It provides an exception for units moving from a hostile sea zone to avoid combat to allow them to move in combat movement even if they’re not going to participate in combat elsewhere. Since a sea zone containing only enemy subs and/or transports is not hostile, the exception doesn’t apply there. The simple fix to allow for this (as was intended) is to remove the word “hostile” from the first sentence so it reads, “Units moving from a sea zone to escape combat as their combat move.”
Thank you, Krieghund and Gamerman, for the clarification. I understand the issue now.
But would this fix apply to Europe/Pacific/Global only - or to 1942 2nd Edition and older games, too - as the rules back to at least Anniversary Edition (I did not check older games/rulebooks than AA50) read the same?
It goes all the way back to AA50. It’s funny how a single word can have such impact and go undetected for so long.
Be glad you weren’t responsible for writing the U.S. Constitution or the Bible or something, Krieg :wink:
Be glad you weren’t responsible for writing the U.S. Constitution or the Bible or something, Krieg :wink:
:lol: :lol: :lol:
:-o
You’ll note from the credits that I had nothing to do with the Rulebook for AA50. I do bear some responsibility for continuing the error forward through copy-and-paste, though. However, in my defense, no one else noticed it in the past 6 years either. :-o
Don’t worry - we all still think you’re the bomb!
I’m still in the early stages of playing with this now known “loophole” and just realized an off-setting effect…
You can move a sub into a convoy zone with the enemy fleet and force him to choose between attacking the sub or making noncombat moves freely and leaving the sub alone, but even after leaving the sub alone for a turn, if the fleet remains there, then the sub is forced to leave on the next turn to avoid combat (assuming 1 or more destroyers there). And wherever it moves to, it is in range of the enemy fleet.
The sub can’t just sit there turn after turn if there is an enemy destroyer there - it only works once. Kind of blunts the effect.
Hi guys.
According to the current/latest ruleset, does Germany get the +5 if Italy controls Leningrad, Moscow, or Stalingrad? Or does Germany need to be the occupying power?
Hi guys.
According to the current/latest ruleset, does Germany get the +5 if Italy controls Leningrad, Moscow, or Stalingrad? Or does Germany need to be the occupying power?
Germany must be the occupying power (ie, the territory must be dark gray).
Can you land aircraft in a friendly neutral that you activate that turn with land units?
No. The territory (friendly neutral) was not controlled by your alliance at the beginning of your turn.
Page 22 about air doing non-com movements says they must land in a territory that was friendly (but not friendly neutral) at the beginning of your turn.
The rulebook includes the specification “but not friendly neutral” on page 22
Krieghund, there was a question posted recently about Japan restrictions when not at war with USA - how do you count 2 sea zones from WUS and Alaska?
For example, Japan is not allowed to end movement of boats in Z3 when not at war with USA?
How about 4 or 26, for example?
Not seeing the question, was either in a different thread or was removed by poster. But we still need to know. Someone else just asked me about it tonight.
Thanks!
Just start from Western United States or Alaska (not the Aleutian Islands) and move out two sea zones. The restricted zones are 1, 2, 3, 8, 9, 10, 11, and 12.
A convoy disruption question.
1 Russian sub is in SZ 99. Greece is Italian controlled. Syria is German controlled. End of Germany’s turn, the sub is still there and the Russian player rolls 2 dice and gets a 2. So 2 IPCs in damage to be assessed.
Do the Axis players then decide among themselves who takes the IPC hits? For example, 1 IPC from Germany, 1 IPC from Italy? Or can the disruption only occur against the country whose turn is ending because it is only that country who is about to collect income? So effectively just 1 IPC from Germany and the other IPC hit is ignored?
The disruption occurs against the country whose turn is ending…so Germany would lose 1.
It goes all the way back to AA50. It’s funny how a single word can have such impact and go undetected for so long.
I just realized that all official FAQ starting from at least AA50 have been updated to reflect this:
@FAQ:
Movement
Q. If some of my units begin my turn in a sea zone with enemy submarines and/or transports and
I decide to attack them, can I move some or all of my units out of the sea zone in combat
movement to avoid having them participate in the combat?
A. Yes. Even though the sea zone is not hostile (it contains no enemy surface warships), you can still
move units from the sea zone in combat movement to escape combat if you’re attacking there.
However, you must still respect the rules for moving units in the Combat Move phase to escape
combat.
@P@nther:
It goes all the way back to AA50. It’s funny how a single word can have such impact and go undetected for so long.
I just realized that all official FAQ starting from at least AA50 have been updated to reflect this:
@FAQ:
Movement
Q. If some of my units begin my turn in a sea zone with enemy submarines and/or transports and
I decide to attack them, can I move some or all of my units out of the sea zone in combat
movement to avoid having them participate in the combat?
A. Yes. Even though the sea zone is not hostile (it contains no enemy surface warships), you can still
move units from the sea zone in combat movement to escape combat if you’re attacking there.
However, you must still respect the rules for moving units in the Combat Move phase to escape
combat.
What is the last sentence referring to. Seems a contradiction.
The problem is the rulebook has not been corrected. That’s a FAQ that contradicts the rulebook. What was needed was ERRATA, which changes the rule as written in the rulebook.
@P@nther:
It goes all the way back to AA50. It’s funny how a single word can have such impact and go undetected for so long.
I just realized that all official FAQ starting from at least AA50 have been updated to reflect this:
@FAQ:
Movement
Q. If some of my units begin my turn in a sea zone with enemy submarines and/or transports and
I decide to attack them, can I move some or all of my units out of the sea zone in combat
movement to avoid having them participate in the combat?
A. Yes. Even though the sea zone is not hostile (it contains no enemy surface warships), you can still
move units from the sea zone in combat movement to escape combat if you’re attacking there.
However, you must still respect the rules for moving units in the Combat Move phase to escape
combat.
Nice one! P@nther.
