Global 2nd edition Q+A ( AAG40.2)

A transport cannot however NCM to a hostile sea zone, correct?

@IKE:

A transport cannot however NCM to a hostile sea zone, correct?

Right, a hostile sea zone being a sea zone containing a surface warship of a power with which you are at war.

On a strategic bombing raid, can I send tactical bombers along when they have no target? The reason for doing that would be that if they get shot down, I’d rather lose a tactical bomber than a strategic bomber.

For example: can I send a tactical bomber along with my strategic bombers against a territory that has a factory, but no air base or harbor? Or, alternatively, can I do that when the territory does have an air base or a harbor that has already been damaged to the maximum? In the latter case it could be argued that I would “normally” have had a target, but it just happens to be in too bad a shape to be bombed, which seems a bit odd. I mean, I could drop my bombs on the ruins of that harbor or air field, couldn’t I?

KaLeun, you’re such a trouble maker  :wink:

Great question, I had the same one a while back.

First of all, only fighters can escort, per the rulebook.

Second, after any air battle with defending interceptors, you will assign your strats and tacs to targets.

Now you’re saying there is no target for the tactical.  That is, there are no naval or air bases.  Therefore, they are not shielding the strategic bombers from AA fire, because the industrial complex AA will be firing at attackers, and the only attackers will be strategic bombers.  If you’re sending tacticals at a bombed out base, then that’s doubly ineffective, because the tactical would be taking AA fire for no reason, and would not be shielding the strats.

So I think the part you’re overlooking is that AA fire occurs AFTER dividing the strats/tacs into groups and going after the different facilities.  You can’t send tacs at industrial complexes, so the tactic you are describing is not a viable option, no.

Wait, now I get your question.  You want the tacs to shield your strats in the air war, when the tacs have no target, or a bombed out base is the only “target”.

Not 100% sure on that answer because I didn’t write it down after getting it from Krieghund.  Must have thought I’d remember, or something.
If you want 100% answer on that, you’ll need Krieghund or someone who remembers or can quote his answer.  It’s a good question because the rulebook doesn’t address it, and seems to allow for this tactic.

i would think you can send tacs if there are bases, even if they are bombed out.  however, if the tacs survive the air battle they would have to take aa fire as well i should think.

so the rules explicitly state that only fighters can function as escorts?

Yes only fighters are escorts and that is explicit.  Do you have a rule book, Bold?

Yes, the tacs would definitely have to take AA fire from the base, but it could still be a smart move if it’s allowed.  Because you would be shielding the strats from interceptors and raising your chance of IC damage.

I am sure that you can’t send tacs if there is no base to bomb, because then they would be functioning like fighter escorts and they can’t.  But I’m not sure about whether they can be sent to bomb a base that’s already at 6 damage.

@Gamerman01:

KaLeun, you’re such a trouble maker  :wink:

Thanks!  :-D

The reason I’m asking, is that I noticed that TripleA won’t allow it - if I move in the planes in that situation, it will treat it as an attack and not give me the option to bomb. But in different situations, where bombing can be done with strats and tacs, TripleA will allow me to pick which of them will get shot down by the AA, if any.

Triple A is wrong about the AA.  It’s a known bug.  You need to scour the list in Triple A under
Help -> Game notes

(Most all of these were added as a result of my compilation of observations and questions from players and my own experiences)

There are many known bugs.  Do not rely on Triple A or even use what it allows or disallows, as an indication.  Thou must know the rulebook thyself. (Or ask someone who does)

It’s not really a bug, there is a game option “Choose AA casualties” that you can toggle on to make it how Herr KaLeun described. It’s generally the option used for Low Luck games, although technically only the units attacking the same facility should be grouped. (i.e. A tac bombs an airbase while 2 strats bomb a Major IC: the tac should roll AA@1 and the 2 strats would roll an AA@2, instead of 1 AA@3)

Well, that’s interesting information, but this is listed in the Triple A game notes:

(NA) During an SBR, AA fire and casualty selection should be done on a per-facility-being-attacked basis

NA stands for None Available - There is no fix available for this yet.

Regardless, the point stands.  Don’t count on Triple A to follow the rule book.

Thanks again. I always do check the rule book when TripleA does something that I find odd, but in this case, I just misread it. It says:

Each industrial complex, air base, and naval base has its own antiaircraft system. If there is an AAA (antiaircraft artillery) unit in the targeted territory, don’t roll for it. Those units are used to protect combat units. Each complex and base rolls one die against each bomber directly attacking it (regardless of the number of bombers). For each “1” rolled, a bomber of the attacker’s choice is immediately removed.

While that’s clear enough, I’ve been focusing on the last sentence only. The problem doesn’t occur when rolling separately for each bomber. As I read it now, the defender can even shoot the strategic bomber when the tactical bomber does have a target and when they’re attacking the same facility.

I think you’re still confused, if I understand what you’re saying.

Wait for Krieghund.  We need his answer on the bombed out base question anyway, right?

If you have a tac and strat bomber(s) going at the same base and you take an AA hit, you can always lose the tac.  A bomber of the attacker’s choice is removed.

It’s during the air battle that you have all the fighters, tacs, and strats together rolling 1’s to attack interceptors, and are being fired at by interceptors.  You can take off fighters, then tacs if you want for interceptor hits.  After the air battle, you divide your tacs and strats into groups.  Each facility fires at the group attacking it.  Attacker can remove tacs first in the case of attacking a base with a mixed group (otherwise, there really is no choice because it’s only tacs, or only strats).

Your question seemed to be, can you take in tacs to shield your strats from interceptors even when there is no base (answer is “no”), or if there is a base or 2 but they are fully damaged so can’t take any more damage (not sure, need Krieghund).

Your tacs can always shield your strats from AA fire at a base, IF you are taking in both tac(s) and strat(s).

There’s no rule against bombing a facility that has already taken maximum damage.  You just can’t damage it any further.

OK!  This time I need to pencil it in to my paper copy rulebook!

Ah, so tacs CAN effectively act as escorts sometimes (no further damage can be done, so shielding strats from intercepting fighters)!  “Escorts” that must take AA fire.

Alright…. I think I got it now. So the benefit of taking the tacs along would be during the air batlle, not during the actual bombing.
But I suppose there’s a disadvantage, too. If I send in the tacs when any airfields and harbors have already taken 6 damage, with the excuse that they can still be “bombing” them anyway, then I suppose they can still get fired at by the AA at the facility. So that would discourage this tactic.

That’s right, that’s how it works, but there are situations where this would be an effective tactic.

My question is when the defender decides to intercept would he/she be intercepting all raids resulting in one large air battle of all bombers, escorts and interceptors regardless of target?

Or, does the attacker decide which raid to escort and the defender decide which raid to intercept?

Hope my question is clear.  Thanks

@IKE:

My question is when the defender decides to intercept would he/she be intercepting all raids resulting in one large air battle of all bombers, escorts and interceptors regardless of target?

Or, does the attacker decide which raid to escort and the defender decide which raid to intercept?

Hope my question is clear.  Thanks

The first.  There’s one big air battle of all fighters, tacs, and strats sent by the attacker, vs all fighter interceptors sent by the defender.  After the air battle, the attacker divides them into groups, and AA fire from each facility fires at each group, with attacker choosing casualties, tacs or strats (fighter escorts are finished after the air battle)

Ah, I see now how tactical’s can effectively be used to escort (even though they will have to take AA fire).

So the attacker doesn’t have to declare raid targets until after the air battle?

@IKE:

So the attacker doesn’t have to declare raid targets until after the air battle?

That is exactly right.