Opening moves for AA42

Allied UK player builds fighters to sink the German fleet. Then fighters fly off to Moscow and/or India to help defend it after sinking the German fleet.
Win-win situation for Allies: they destroy a significant portion of the German forces and can still use those fighters on Asia or Europe.Â

And you’ll lose the German fleet on SZ17 to a combined UK1 attack of 2 FTRs, 1 BMR. And lose Syria as well if the UK so desires. Don’t assume that the UK needs to attack the East Indies fleet - with only 63% odds it is a decision that needs to be weighted carefully.

As mentioned above, why should the UK risk attacking East Indies with 60% something odds when it can sink the German fleet and secure Africa for the Allies? Just the starting IC on India gives it a lot more options to slow down Japan on Asia.

Yeah, look at the numbers: Soviets build 24 worth of ground units. Germany buys a Battleship and only builds 21 worth of ground units, of which 7-9 will be sent to Africa, so that leaves only 12-14 in reinforcements against  the Soviets’ 24.
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1. You mentioned you would build 2 FTR on UK1 to sink a German fleet in the Baltic. I told you I would consider building a Carrier + 1 ART + 8 INF on G2 turn. And I would land 2 German FTR on that Carrier. You must understand that 4 UK FTR and 1 BMR cannot sink German BB, 2 FTR, Carrier and Cruiser. Your entire UK Air Force would be wiped out. There would NOT be any planes going to Moscow OR India for that matter.

When you build 2 UK FTR, then you only have 11 IPC left. Your UK BB is there alone with a 1 Russian sub. Try to guess what happens to that UK BB and Russian sub when it is G2 turn ?

I mean, don’t you plan on expanding a UK fleet outside London? Because that UK BB is dead there all alone when G2 turn starts. Or else you have to move UK BB away to Canada. Either way, your strategy does not bring many UK INFs or ART against Germany, on contrary, it brings basically ZERO units against Germany on UK1 turn, same for UK2 if you buy 2 FTR and just sitting there with 11 IPC left which barely gives you a DD to buy. Again, no units on India either if you buy DD to give some more protection to your UK BB on London.

Yes, of course, if you use 2 UK FTR AND 1 BMR then you can sink that German BB on SZ17. However, again, you have to take FTR causalties for the UK Air Force, which according to your strategy would be now basically wiped out by UK2 turn.  And having Japanese Fleet outside E.Indies 100% safe is a BIG advantage for Japan, which is now according to this 2012 version in harder position that earlier. But with that fleet alive outside East Indies, options for Japan are HUGE. They can wipe out entire U.S. force across all 3 Chinese territories + take a Russian territory too.
Not to mention securing FIC to even bigger extend, which you preferred just to trade off with the UK. I on the other hand don’t want UK even near FIC.

All German Naval units have the option to attack the Caucasus also, not just Egypt or Syria, it’s not like German units dissapear if I ship them to Egypt or Syria, they would be destroying UK forces there with minimal losses, which again helps Japan to huge extent. Russian units on the other hand will be having some seriously bad offensive capability after you allowing Russia to lose 2 out of it’s 4 Armor and 1 out of it’s 3 Artilleries.

@AxisBrutality:

1. You mentioned you would build 2 FTR on UK1 to sink a German fleet in the Baltic. I told you I would consider building a Carrier + 1 ART + 8 INF on G2 turn. And I would land 2 German FTR on that Carrier. You must understand that 4 UK FTR and 1 BMR cannot sink German BB, 2 FTR, Carrier and Cruiser. Your entire UK Air Force would be wiped out. There would NOT be any planes going to Moscow OR India for that matter.

Carrier is definitely a wiser choice but you still have the same problem as Germany. UK builds 2 FTRs plus units for India on UK1. Then on UK2 it builds 2 more fighters and it now has 6 FTRs and 1 BMR against the German Baltic fleet. Germany has to build more naval on G3 else its carrier, fighters, cruiser and transport are dead on UK3. And the leftover Allied fighters can still go to Moscow after they sink the German fleet. And the more Germany spends the more it is wasting IPCs on the water while Moscow is getting stronger, not weaker.

When you build 2 UK FTR, then you only have 11 IPC left. Your UK BB is there alone with a 1 Russian sub. Try to guess what happens to that UK BB and Russian sub when it is G2 turn ?

I’m already used to that UK fleet being blasted away on the majority of the hundreds of games I’ve played Spring 1942 1st Ed. - apparently that’s news to you though…

I mean, don’t you plan on expanding a UK fleet outside London?

Because that UK BB is dead there all alone when G2 turn starts. Or else you have to move UK BB away to Canada. Either way, your strategy does not bring many UK INFs or ART against Germany, on contrary, it brings basically ZERO units against Germany on UK1 turn, same for UK2 if you buy 2 FTR and just sitting there with 11 IPC left which barely gives you a DD to buy. Again, no units on India either if you buy DD to give some more protection to your UK BB on London.

Apparently the world class player hasn’t figured it out yet… building ANY British ships on UK waters on UK1 will usually suicide and a waste because of the Germans power and the new SZ dispositions.
The US can’t reach and reinforce an UK fleet with its starting ships so the UK can only place 1 carrier and 2 destroyers, together with the Soviet sub and 2 FTRs. The Germans should have 2-3 subs, plus most airforce in range, so any naval buys on UK1 are a waste if the Germans can reach and sink them.

The best UK1 buy on that situation actually 2 FTRs, 2 INF, 1 ART, put the fighters on UK and the ground units to India.

Yes, of course, if you use 2 UK FTR AND 1 BMR then you can sink that German BB on SZ17. However, again, you have to take FTR causalties for the UK Air Force, which according to your strategy would be now basically wiped out by UK2 turn.

Nope. 1 fighter from the fleet off India, the other from Egypt, remaining units (bomber) land on Egypt. That retains the 4 FTRs on the UK to use against the Baltic fleet.

And having Japanese Fleet outside E.Indies 100% safe is a BIG advantage for Japan, which is now according to this 2012 version in harder position that earlier. But with that fleet alive outside East Indies, options for Japan are HUGE. They can wipe out entire U.S. force across all 3 Chinese territories + take a Russian territory too.Not to mention securing FIC to even bigger extend, which you preferred just to trade off with the UK. I on the other hand don’t want UK even near FIC.

Yupiii… the East Indies fleet is safe… wait, didn’t that happened already on 1st Edition and the Axis could still lose the game?

Then on UK2 it builds 2 more fighters and it now has 6 FTRs and 1 BMR against the German Baltic fleet. Germany has to build more naval on G3 else its carrier, fighters, cruiser and transport are dead on UK3. And the leftover Allied fighters can still go to Moscow after they sink the German fleet.

I’m already used to that UK fleet being blasted away on the majority of the hundreds of games I’ve played Spring 1942 1st Ed. - apparently that’s news to you though…

Apparently the world class player hasn’t figured it out yet… building ANY British ships on UK waters on UK1 will usually suicide and a waste because of the Germans power and the new SZ dispositions.
The US can’t reach and reinforce an UK fleet with its starting ships so the UK can only place 1 carrier and 2 destroyers, together with the Soviet sub and 2 FTRs. The Germans should have 2-3 subs, plus most airforce in range, so any naval buys on UK1 are a waste if the Germans can reach and sink them.

The best UK1 buy on that situation actually 2 FTRs, 2 INF, 1 ART, put the fighters on UK and the ground units to India.

1 fighter from the fleet off India, the other from Egypt, remaining units (bomber) land on Egypt. That retains the 4 FTRs on the UK to use against the Baltic fleet.

Yupiii… the East Indies fleet is safe… wait, didn’t that happened already on 1st Edition and the Axis could still lose the game?

1. Yes, UK can continue to buy 2 FTR each round, but that is NOT what UK is “made” for. UK needs to have a fleet outside London, and push units against Germany, this is normal and pretty much logical.  Letting a UK fleet outside London sink, makes UK totally crippled.

I don’t need to buy more naval units with Germany than what I said I will do. G1 = Battleship and maybe a Transport, but Battleship + 7 INF is a very good buy.  G2 turn = Carrier + 1 ART + 8 INF. So the funny part is that UK is letting it’s fleet getting wiped out while Germany expands it’s fleet and takes out your 4 FTR if you ever decide to attack on UK2.

As you said, you would need 6 FTR. Remember, there is NO UK Bomber left anymore to attack Baltic Fleet on UK2, because as you said, you would land your UK Bomber on Egypt, the only possible place to land because I took Syria.
Then try to guess what happens to that UK Bomber in Egypt on G2 turn ?

So basically, you would have only 4 FTR to attack German Baltic Sea fleet with on UK2. Germany on the other hand has BB, Carrier with 2 FTR +  Cruiser + Transport. If you want to commit suicide with 4 UK FTR, be my guest, but it’s not going to be fun for the UK Air Force. You will get 2 hits with 4 FTR and then they die, one of the hits is absorbed by the German Battleship.

There is a good possibility to save a UK fleet on London. If the U.S. attacks German subs outside Canada with U.S. DD and 1 FTR + 1 BMR, then U.S. will be able to wipe them out, although U.S. will not be able to unload anything on Morocco. Allthough that still gives Germany 2 more subs in the North Sea.
Now, the way UK can save it’s fleet is to build a carrier outside of London, land 1 UK FTR on it. On U.S. turn, American FTR lands on UK carrier after attacking German subs on Canada.  Furthermore UK could buy additional cruiser which would give UK a fleet of 1 BB, 1 Cruiser, 1 Russian sub + 1 Carrier with 2 FTR.  Now, you tell me,how Germans are going to sink that with having only 2 subs as a “shield” ?

So you could say I think it is funny that you or others choose to let the UK fleet outside London, just die.

East Indies being safe, yes, totally worth it. In previous versions, those Japanese ships were NOT in the UK range of attack, they are NOW. As you said, there is a 63% chance that UK will win if they attack, with my strategy, that prosentage is NOW ZERO, which gives Japan a massive air and naval power to start with. You see, I don’t like seeing Japan losing 33% of it’s FTR before they even start, and I don’t like Japan losing 50% of their Battleships or Carriers before it is even Japanese turn ;)

@AxisBrutality:

Then on UK2 it builds 2 more fighters and it now has 6 FTRs and 1 BMR against the German Baltic fleet. Germany has to build more naval on G3 else its carrier, fighters, cruiser and transport are dead on UK3. And the leftover Allied fighters can still go to Moscow after they sink the German fleet.

I’m already used to that UK fleet being blasted away on the majority of the hundreds of games I’ve played Spring 1942 1st Ed. - apparently that’s news to you though…

Apparently the world class player hasn’t figured it out yet… building ANY British ships on UK waters on UK1 will usually suicide and a waste because of the Germans power and the new SZ dispositions.
The US can’t reach and reinforce an UK fleet with its starting ships so the UK can only place 1 carrier and 2 destroyers, together with the Soviet sub and 2 FTRs. The Germans should have 2-3 subs, plus most airforce in range, so any naval buys on UK1 are a waste if the Germans can reach and sink them.

The best UK1 buy on that situation actually 2 FTRs, 2 INF, 1 ART, put the fighters on UK and the ground units to India.

1 fighter from the fleet off India, the other from Egypt, remaining units (bomber) land on Egypt. That retains the 4 FTRs on the UK to use against the Baltic fleet.

Yupiii… the East Indies fleet is safe… wait, didn’t that happened already on 1st Edition and the Axis could still lose the game?

1. Yes, UK can continue to buy 2 FTR each round, but that is NOT what UK is “made” for. UK needs to have a fleet outside London, and push units against Germany, this is normal and pretty much logical.  Letting a UK fleet outside London sink, makes UK totally crippled.

I don’t need to buy more naval units with Germany than what I said I will do. G1 = Battleship and maybe a Transport, but Battleship + 7 INF is a very good buy.   G2 turn = Carrier + 1 ART + 8 INF. So the funny part is that UK is letting it’s fleet getting wiped out while Germany expands it’s fleet and takes out your 4 FTR if you ever decide to attack on UK2.

As you said, you would need 6 FTR. Remember, there is NO UK Bomber left anymore to attack Baltic Fleet on UK2, because as you said, you would land your UK Bomber on Egypt, the only possible place to land because I took Syria.
Then try to guess what happens to that UK Bomber in Egypt on G2 turn ?

Still don’t need it… 1 carrier, 1 cruiser and 2 fighters (if the Germans don’t build anything else) against 6 UK fighters it’s 91% odds for the Brits. And that assumes that Germany can take Egypt on G2 (i.e. that the UK didn’t move 2 INF there from India and everything else that can reaches it.

So basically, you would have only 4 FTR to attack German Baltic Sea fleet with on UK2. Germany on the other hand has BB, Carrier with 2 FTR +  Cruiser + Transport. If you want to commit suicide with 4 UK FTR, be my guest, but it’s not going to be fun for the UK Air Force. You will get 2 hits with 4 FTR and then they die, one of the hits is absorbed by the German Battleship.

UK simply continues buying fighters on UK2 and UK3 - 8 fighters on UK4 and the German fleet of 1 battleship, 1 carrier, 1 cruiser and 2 fighters is toast, while the US also builds its presence on the UK to wipe out any survivors. And the UK still has 2-4 fighters off to Moscow or elsewhere while Germany most loses the ability to challenge the Atlantic. And that’s 34 IPCs spent by Germany that could now be 11 infantry defending France from Allied landings or being used against Russia. Gone. And the Allies didn’t even had to land to kill the equivalent of those units.

How the hell is the E. Indies Japanese fleet 100% safe? It’s in total danger, especially if you don’t get that FTR in Egypt, that could leave UK with a carrier and two FTRs…and if they build anything in India, time for the rising sun to set!  The UK fleet will be wiped out on G1…on 1st ed, I probably wouldn’t go after the BB because I had the gringos to kill (CA/2Trans vs SS), but now, all London can do for the time being is build air units…and so what about Africa?  I don’t care…while the Allies needed Africa in 1st ed, the UK ALREADY has a 2nd complex so me losing a couple of IPCs is completely irrelevant…if Germany wants to expend so much resources in taking IPCs, “be my guest, be my guest, put your waste of money to the test”  The UKs main power has shifted to India in this game, which will make things very interesting in the Middle East/Pacific…This shift makes me more interested in a KJF strat now…

@Mallery29:

How the hell is the E. Indies Japanese fleet 100% safe? It’s in total danger, especially if you don’t get that FTR in Egypt, that could leave UK with a carrier and two FTRs…and if they build anything in India, time for the rising sun to set!  The UK fleet will be wiped out on G1…on 1st ed, I probably wouldn’t go after the BB because I had the gringos to kill (CA/2Trans vs SS), but now, all London can do for the time being is build air units…and so what about Africa?  I don’t care…while the Allies needed Africa in 1st ed, the UK ALREADY has a 2nd complex so me losing a couple of IPCs is completely irrelevant…if Germany wants to expend so much resources in taking IPCs, "be my guest, be my guest, put your waste of money to the test"  The UKs main power has shifted to India in this game, which will make things very interesting in the Middle East/Pacific…This shift makes me more interested in a KJF strat now…

Can you talk at least normal as Hobbes does, instead of being aggressive and cursing all the time ? Thanks in advance.
The Japanese fleet is not in danger when J1 turn starts. I will merge E-Indies fleet with a Cruiser and another Carrier from Caroline Islands. Then it will matter very little if a second UK FTR survives after trying a suicide mission against a German Battleship on SZ17. But most probably that 1 UK FTR, will be dead. If not, a Japanese fleet will be merged anyway outside F.I.C. and FIC will be safe from any UK attack. Japan can wipe out because of this all 6 US INF and 1 FTR that are on Chinese territories.

Now that Japanese fleet survives, there is no need for a Japanese Carrier which you want to buy. Now, I can buy a factory as Japan should + dump in forces on mainland, again as Japan should, as FAST as possible. Besides factory, I would buy another Transport, 1 ART, 1 INF and save I IPC. This enables Japan to dump into the mainland 6 units on J2 turn + add 2-3 units on it’s newly built factory from J1 turn. This is how it should be, and NOT accepting Japan to lose 33% of planes, 50% of Carriers and Battleships before it even starts.  Axis has to cooperate in the same way Allies does, this seem to be sowewhat hard for you to understand. I just commented what happens if you try to attack my German Battleship on SZ17 after I massacred your UK 1 INF on Syria + UK DD there.  So if you touch German Battleship, this is what happens when Japan starts it’s turn.

Fine, I agree with Hobbes…you’re a noob.

UK simply continues buying fighters on UK2 and UK3 - 8 fighters on UK4 and the German fleet of 1 battleship, 1 carrier, 1 cruiser and 2 fighters is toast, while the US also builds its presence on the UK to wipe out any survivors. And the UK still has 2-4 fighters off to Moscow or elsewhere while Germany most loses the ability to challenge the Atlantic. And that’s 34 IPCs spent by Germany that could now be 11 infantry defending France from Allied landings or being used against Russia. Gone. And the Allies didn’t even had to land to kill the equivalent of those units.
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You can do that, it will not help UK, how can you say it’s great for UK to just sit there, accept it’s fleet being wiped out, reducing UK to one building 2 FTR a round and like 2 ART on India? This is not a good strategy. If we follow this, you will not be a threat to a German fleet until you have 6 FTR.

Yes, I could buy 11 INF for Germany, and just sit like an idiot, looking how Allies are buildning their fleets, preparing for an invasion, but this is not what Axis is all about, Axis are ment to be aggressive, you should know that. If Axis goes into the defence, they will lose eventually. While you degrade Russian offencive capabilies in Ukraine, it’s even more tempting and wise to build as I did, some naval units for the first two rounds.

Look at this this way, I forced you to spend not 34 but somewhere between 40 and 60 IPC on units which can’t invade, on units which can’t take a country by themself, they can only attack or defend, and they are worse at attacking than defending.

50 IPC would give you a lot more naval power to expand your London Fleet with exsisting UK Battleship + Transport, which you say are “dead” ( they doesn’t need to be ) than simply bying 5 FTR.

@Mallery29:

Fine, I agree with Hobbes…you’re a noob.

Lol, I think it’s really clear who reacts aggressivly here, with basically no good arguments. I don’t have anything against you, I just simply point out huge weaknesses in your strategy while you resort to calling others names.