Necessity of Attacking Ukraine (R1)

@Paulzy:

Question … my typical R1 (ussr) purchase is 2 inf 2 arty 2 tanks or 3 inf 3 tanks.

Dice combat movement is all out for Ukraine and WR … usually sending 1 Fig or tank to WR instead … leaving around 85% odds in kraine and 99% odds in WR.

If these attacks go bad, example … 1G fig left in ukraine … only 2 or 3 russian units left in WR … what is the best move for russia and the allies ?

Surrender. Start the game again :)

@Bunnies:

@BigPapaSmurf:

Send 5 inf from Kar/Arch, 1 Artillery and two fighters to West russia and stack everything else in Cauc. Leave one Inf in Lenningrad and do your standard moves on the east end.

Don’t you run into Germany taking Karelia and West Russia, and establishing a strong center position from which Russia cannot reclaim Karelia income?

Bunnies is correct. G takes West Russia with units from BR/Ukr. Russia can retake West Russia but will only earn 27 IPC, not being able to contest Belorussia and Karelia. Germany meanwhile can build 5 inf, 5 arm on G1 and put some serious pressure to prevent Russia from stacking West Russia on turn 2.

The main goal of the Ukr attack is IMHO to get the fighter,

Cutting most of Germany’s ability to attack Caucasus is another big big plus.  If Russia lucks out on the Ukraine attack, Germany may either risk fighters on G1 on other targets to send a fighter to Ukraine, or may send valuable tanks to reclaim Ukraine.  Or if Russia lucks out at Ukraine, Russia may retreat to Caucasus to preserve its tanks/artillery.

As equally as important as the fighter is to protect the Russian units on West Russia from being destroyed on G1. If you lose them, you lose any chance of contesting Karelia/Belorussia. Germany may also stack Ukraine like you mentioned, cutting off 3 IPC to Russia (plus the 2 from Belorussia) and both sides get into a war of positions that doesn’t favor Russia (i.e. the Allies better get quickly to help).

@Advosan:

A successfull IC in India imho demands also for 1)a 6 inf stack in BUR,4 inf in XIN and a soviet ftr in NOV,2)a successfull Uk1 attack in FIC with 2 UK ftr in either WR or Russia and 3)a US1 China IC(given it is still US owned),or a US1 double IC in both XIN and China if J1 puts an IC in Asia.I would be giving it a shot if G1 buys only 1-2 armor and does a lousy job at AES.

Edit: And of course destroy the lone tranny.

The problem with attacking FIC UK1 is you only destroy the units 70%.  So you are staking a lot on that attack if you’re committing to building an IC there Uk1.

In my first games as Allies I tried playing a India IC/USA Pac combo alot.  For ipc reasons I preferred to counter Egy UK1 though.  In alot of games, I wasn’t even building fleet with UK–if I was, I wasn’t getting to Africa or helping Russia with it till around UK4.  Since a Germany with Africa in its pocket can produce 10 armor a turn, I needed the UK1 Africa counter and sometimes UK1 and USA1 drops as well to mop up the dark continent and keep UK prosperous.

That meant that I was frequently allowing Japan to capture India, and then retaking it with the Russians.  I’d still build UK2, but I’d be short on units, and might require Russian assistance.  Ordinarily, the Japs became less fixated on India because USA was 100% Pacific.

I’m wary of a Sink IC unless Japan got really diced bad on the mainland J1.  It costs 24 ipc with the first bombing raid and the aa gun.

Certainly a successful FIC attack is a huge victory.  After a successful UK1 FIC if I’m Japan I might not even try to get India–I might just play defense and wait for Germany.  So at that point Africa is also critical because if Germany gets it they’ll get to Moscow that much faster.

I hope people will keep experimenting with IIC and other KJF tactics–it makes for good games.  The problem for KJF in 42 as opposed to Revised is its much harder to get a UK established in Europe and able to sufficiently distract Germany from Moscow.  The advantage for KJF is Japan’s fleet is weaker without those transports as fodder units.

Yes, that’s correct.  The move is done after the attacker finishes all battles, but before the attacker makes any noncombat movements.

Thanks Krieg

I would say no for this version of the game… but there are some house rules out there and some other tournament games where it is allowed, check those.  in this version its probably too complicated, We have used the Joint Strike Advantage in thos game where US uses both his and UK’s units in an attack, works ok as a one time option… but the rules state it must be declared during russia turn so Germany gets to prepare for it.

That CAP rule in good old Pacific always remained a mystery to me. As far as I remember you can only use airplanes that didn’t take part in any combat. Now who would let any airplane sitting around doing nothing in combat ?  Japan not using airplanes in her attacks ?  That’s why I never used CAP, not once.

@MrMalachiCrunch:

Rev 1) In a situation where only defenseless transports are present a single attacking piece can be used to destroy them allowing the rest to perfrom offshore bombardment.

I think this is a question of value… You can chose to ignore transports, allowing Bombardment on the territory, which improves your chances of winning the IPC’s and position from territory.
…OR choose to sink Transports Each costing 7 IPC’s but lose the bombardment option.
I think they did this to force the choice, for strategic purposes and game balance

@MrMalachiCrunch:

Rev 2) This is much more radical.  In a situation where there is a defending fleet, some of the attacking fleet is held in reserve.  Combat occurs in the sea zone and if the attacker wins, then the the reserve fleet performs offshore bombardment.

Doesn’t make much sense to me, If an Entire Sea Zone is considered hostile because of any amount of surface warships, any Sea units entering their fire range are vulnerable.  If i were a defending Carrier with planes and i see lots of ships Im gonna try to sink the most valued units, it would help my defense in the land portion. Also, if the attacker could do that then the defender should have some similar balancing option, like maybe the ability to retreat defending planes, to the Land Territ.