Finland, Russia and a Naval Base

i did not move the fleet to seazone 115, no it was 112. there the build occurs.

I asked why you move them to SZ115 on G2 not on G1. I assume only to unload 8 Inf there. So you move to 112 on G1 and all your G1 builds were placed there…
As UK I would wipe you out instanly (abandon the Taranto Raid) !
B/c I can End the German Fleet (especially if the Transprts are in SZ112 t b/c bonus damage of 21IPCs for free if  win the fight and UK will) with a minimum of 1DD 1CV 3 FIG and 1 TAC. UK got 7 Hits and attacks at 2,0,3,3,3,4. Germans defend with best of 4 Hits (if BB isn´t damaged before) and 2,3,4. Maybe you bring up a sub there (but this lowers your chances to wipe out most of the fleet in G1 I think) so max of 5 hits with 1,2,3,4 in defend. In this case I would build 3 tanks in south africa (counter the Italians) and only a few units in Britain or save the money for UK2. And maybe activate Greece with the transport form egqpt just for distraction.

the return to seazone 112 is kind of obligatory.

Sure if you want to end up in SZ127, but If you aren´t wiped out in UK1 then maybe in UK3… depends on what UK will buy, but I would buy at least some subs when germans move their fleet to SZ115 or SZ127 on G2 b/c they would mostly (depends on gemran aircraft) be safe…
So UK could easily attack you on UK3 when your are in SZ112 again.

no CV on G1, but i think that a battleship, a cruiser and a destroyer are able to defend those british fighters. or not?

No I am afraid they aren´t able to defend themselve against a massive UK strike,
see above

than an aircraft carrier instead of the destroyer and one transport are in. this way there are 6 troops less in scandinavia, four during the attack on novgorod.

That would be the most regular buy to threat sea lion and could work,
far better chances as only 1 DD for defend. You trade 1Hit @ defend 2 against 4Hits (Fighters land there) @ 2,4,4 !

in G3 returning from seazone 127 to 112 you can drop eight troops from western germany in norway

So you mentioned your fleet moves to SZ115 on G2 or to SZ127 on G2 !
I am confused by your statements…
But it makes a little sense now, you move on G2 to SZ127 to unload troops in Finland.

to achieve a quick getting and back from finland the northern way round it is needed to build this naval base. not just because i can do it via the baltic sea, but also to put a threat towards the uk into the game.

IMO its no threat for a expirenced player, only in G1 when you pretend sea lion.
But once you move backwards on G2 (127 or baltic sea again) the threat is over.
Even with the Taranto Raid done and buildung all Inf in UK1 I would simply build so much subs as possible, so 3 or 4 (not attackable by Luftwaffe) on UK2 an wait to crush the fleet when it returns to the baltic (so on G3 / UK3) with all the subs and RoyalAirForce or what else is left and available.

to force the british to secure its homeland which means less british naval buys.

This counts only for UK1 or not even there if you don´t buy a CV on G1
as I mentioned before

but this means that german tanks can be build directly in russia (novgorod). the german position is strong, so reinforcements are no more needed there. another point is the russian NO from the start on being denied. now the southern russia is getting interesting, you are right. but with italy on the german southern flank…this point, actually, i have to elaborate yet.

Well if you are lucky to get to this point you can maybe overwhelm the russians,
the lost NO for Russia is a big + ,but think of what you have to to for it…

Italians are supposed to react on UK - Taranto Raid or activating Greece for example
and should have in mind that Egypt must be taken (as Greece) for NO achivement.

yeah! i thought, i did. well:
G1: one destroyer, three transports (29 ipc, saving one), placement in seazone 112 - capture of paris, normandy, yugoslavia, bulgaria, finland, one NO (swedish ore), in total 64.
G2: one naval base, 10 infantry, 3 artillery, one submarine, saving one ipc. - no direct actions just movements to secure coming attack on all fronts. italy secured southern france on I1: 47 plus two NOs (france, swedish ore), in total 57.
G3: 11 infantry, 3 artillery, 2 submarines - capture of bessarabia, eastern poland, baltic states, vyborg and karelia. stack in baltic states to secure all tanks in there. (here it becomes clear, why italy has to move some troops to romania)
G4: depends. minimum 10 infantry. the rest…depends on the movements of the UK and the USA.

now you are talking  :wink:
G1: CV instead of DD+Transport+1IPC (wich you saved before)
What if left after your attack on the RN ?
Did you attack SZ109 and/106 ?
G3 Problem, how should the Italians magae it to get there with even 1 Inf on I3 ?
You have to use starting units or I1 builds to get there,
but this means no max support to take africa or greece…
missing the Italian NO (wich I as Italian would be after).

but there has to be a continious coming of minimum two or three italian infantries to romania every turn

Thats very heavy to handle for the Italian.
Moving troops right from the start and continously to Romania means less actions elsewhere.

but this makes it really hard in the mediterranian for italy. that is why i thought of going with two german infantry on a italian transport, securing the third NO for Germany in G3 which is a bit insecure, unfortunately

Really hard is just right said…
Think about giving Bulgaria to the Italians, they can use them for Romania and can be more flexible in Med I hope.

as seen above bulgaria gets activated by germany, because of the big lack of troops. but the activation by italy is not a bad idea, thanks.

you´re welcome

knowing this, what do you think? is it viable to play like this?

As you see in my descriptions its not completly viable, but with little changes (the CV is a must) some luck (as always) and if your UK Player isn´t well experienced. But its sounds like fun anyway, so try it and tell us  :-D

It sounds like a viable strategy,

If you were my ally as Germany, and I was Italy (or Japan) and you told me you were going to do this, I wouldn’t be like “that’s stupid”.

That being said, I think you NEED to build a carrier or I agree, your fleet is gonna get toasted.  Also, you mention subs as “Naval Defense”??  Subs suck at defense.  They can be fodder, but much better when they are fodder in an attack instead of defense.  They can’t fire back at air units, which is going to be the biggest threat to your German navy.  Therefore, destroyers would be a better investment for two dollars more.

I also think the counter strategy would be for the Russians to wall off the north of Moscow and give you the Northern territories but at the same time threaten your southern flank.  That Southern Flank is what I would worry about because every dollar you spend on another transport or destroyer in the Baltic (and you’ll need plenty), that’s several men and tanks you won’t have in the Southern/Balkans front.

In addition to hitting you in the south with Russia, I would probably hit Norway and Finland with the US and UK and try and knock out your flank.  So in that case, you could rush troops from the mainland to Scandinavia to defend it or counter attack, but only if your fleet still survives.

I have had good luck building a factory in Norway as Germany and building lots of tanks there.  It gives you more options in both defense and attack against Russia and USA (who you definitely don’t want coming into Norway and building a factory of their own).  It also does this without sacrificing so many IPC’s on naval units.  Germany isn’t really a naval power in this game, and although I do think that building a CV on G1 is almost a gimme buy, other than that, it is risky to build heavy in the sea as Germany.

1st: i have to clarify something: i never, i repeat, never, said that i would go to seazone 115. i just asked if a naval base could be used in that zone and 127. that is all. i do not understand why you always mention that!  grin

Sorry my mistake, but caused by your inaccuracy  :wink:

2nd:
as germany i wipe out all of the british fleet surrounding the uk.

OK got that

so there is no destroyer to attack with

Sure there is, take the one along with the carrier of Gibraltar  :roll:

and the three or four time i played germany the battleship never got hit

Lucky you  :-D
But defenders got 2x 50% chances, so one hit would be average.

this means you have three fighters, a tactical bomber and a carrier to attack a german fleet consisting of destroyer, cruiser, battleship.

add the destroyer

maybe a german carrier is a good choice.

and erase maybe  :-)

but one fact is clear, you can only attack one navy! not both. repelling a german sealion or doing taranto raid? what would you do?

If you threat Sea Lion (with your original builds) on G1,
I would surely wipe out the german fleet.

leaving taranto raid means giving the italian everything he wants to have. two transports, a battleship etc. no difficult buys, just troops…which means an easier access to africa an helping germany out in russia as well.

With no Taranto Raid the Italian will become strong, but never strong enough to hold of the US (if it goes KIF), I think if germany is “weak” (because complete G1 buy is lost) Italy can´t win the Game for the Axis.

i say, minimum two planes, a carrier damaged with no option of salvation… evil giving the german time to recover…italy strong in the med etc. i think you get it…

I would rather sacrifice the carrier and save the planes, the carrier would only be prey for the luftwaffe or (remaining) subs.

okay. then lets assume this: G1 buy is a carrier and two transports. G2 fleet moves to seazone 127 (this means that the british attack got repelled nor never occured). so it is obvious that the german fleet has to return to seazone 112. so i would buy 2 subs instead of one as germany in G2. maybe in G3 as well

Ok lets say UK got frightend and UK1 build only Inf,
gathering fleet at Sz91 (gibraltar) or sz106 (canda), move the cursier from 85 on its way north (gibraltar at best at UK2). This move I make everytime by the way, so no special to counter your operation sea bear  :-D
So on G2 I see that you move to 127, so I move my fleet to 109 and build 3-4 subs,
so 1 carrier + 2 Destroyer (1 form canada) 3 subs , 3 fighters , 1 tactical and maybe the cruiser if moved to gibralter on UK2 and survied until UK3.
So 1x0 , 5x2 , 3-4x3 , 1x4 (11-12Hits)

This against 1 Cruiser 1 Battleship 1 carrier 2 Fighters and 2-4 subs
2-4x1 1x2 , 1x3 , 3x4 (with 9-11 Hits)
Destroyer for defend (and against sub build on UK2) would be better choice.

But anyway I admit that would be hard (because the subs soak hits)for UK,
so better attack on UK1 I think. But if you move again to sz127 on G4 and have to return to sz127 on G5 than its over b/c of the US.
Or your fleet stays in 127 (where it is of little use).

mmmm… USA needs to wake up, that is for sure :)

ahh, fatigue tactics!  :-D