Table Tactics New Product Release

Yeah, read about the Washington Naval Conference of 1921. Japan was given the shaft by the Brits & Americans.

Well, that was the Japanese military’s perspective on it at the time, anyway.  The bottom line is that the Japanese were insisting on full numerical parity with the US and the UK, whereas the US and UK insisted that this was unrealistic, since Japan had only one ocean to defend rather than 2 (the US) or 3 (the UK).  Whatever you think about the arguments on either side, the bottom line is that trying to achieve naval parity with the US and UK would have bankrupted Japan; there was no way that they could realistically afford to keep up with the building pace that their brass was insisting on, and many of the Japanese politicians were actually happy to end the growing dreadnought arms race.  (Which, it must be noted, really just ended up saving the world’s great powers from spending astronomical sums on weapons systems that would be obsolete in 20 years.)

ok stay on topic please.

We are looking forward to these units :-)

Good luck Jack! I’m rooting for you!

@Table:

I tried telling them that I’m a good guy and just cut me a check but that didn’t work.

Mussolini used to brag that he could call upon “8 million bayonets”.  Would it help if you told your money guys that you have (by today’s count) the backing of 10,545 A&A.org board members?

Yeah, at least it made some kind of sense to have Italian units be German recasts; we know they have to cut some corners here and there, and the Italians DID use a good bit of German equipment, especially the Italian Social Republic toward the end.

It would have made so much more sense to give the French US units, as at least in the late-war period the Free French made extensive use of US gear.  (Free French forces liked to wear their Adrian helmets as a distinguishing feature out of national pride, but even this was limited to what they could scrounge.)  Leclerc’s armored columns, for example, rode into Paris in Shermans.

Love those French T-34 tanks.  If they would have had T-34’s the French would have stopped the Germans.

That’s not necessarily true.  Tactics played a big role in the Germans overrunning France.  The British and French actually had more tanks than the Germans and some of the French tanks were considered superior.  Unfortunately, they didn’t mass their tanks like the Germans did and were torn apart piecemeal.  Also, the British and French commanders used outdated strategies and couldn’t cope with the rapid moving Blitzkrieg style of war that the Germans employed.  So, even if the French had T-34s, I imagine the outcome would have been pretty much the same.

OK, duly noted.  The T-34’s didn’t do much for the Soviets either until their tactics caught up with the technology.  Just for the record, though, I don’t think the French produced anything really competitive with the Germans’ Panzer III’s & IV’s (which were, admittedly not the bulk of the German forces yet by 1940) much less the T-34, which was truly ahead of its time when it first came out.

Char-B and the SOMUA were the best medium and heavy tanks in the world in 1940.

Char-B and the SOMUA were the best medium and heavy tanks in the world in 1940.

I’m not so sure.  The Char B and Somua had good theoretical stats, but their crew division-of-labor problems were severe; particularly their 1-man turrets, put them at a huge disadvantage.

DrLarsen,

You are correct. They were the best tanks on a 1v1 basis, but the lack of communication and commander task overload enabled the Germans to easily annihilate them.

Jack,

The tanks were excellent. The crews were French. (No explanation necessary)

Remember, it’s not the size of the dog in the fight, its the size of the fight in the dog that counts.

Well, no so fast: it wasn’t the French crews fault that their tank designers had saddled them with a VERY poorly thought-out division-of-labor arrangement.  This is not a problem with the soldiers, but the leaders/ designers.  Crew arrangement is a vital aspect of design!  So I’d say that these flaws arguably made the French tanks “paper tigers” with good stats but poor real-world performance.

An interesting comparison for the Char B is the US M3 Lee/Grant.  Stats-wise the two match up well.  In practice the M3 did fairly well in the early-war era; the Char B, not so much.  The M3 was much liked by the Brits during the North Africa campaign, and they eagerly snatched up as many as they could get their hands on.  So what was the key difference between the 2 designs?  The US tank had two more crew members in the turret…

General preparedness and warfighting capabilities were sorely lacking in many French ground units.
Forget the exact name, but a sizeable French tank contigent was destroyed because they neglected to recon the area before eating lunch.

Nothing against the French, but one of their best units is the “Foreign” Legion. Kind of tells you something.

True, but I think my point still stands; crew arrangement is a design issue.

Keep in mind also that the issues you’re addressing are primarily still ones of leadership, not crew competence or bravery.  I’m just trying to be fair to the individual French fighting man, not defend French leadership or tactics.

Quote from Inmajor:

OK, serious question;
Does anybody think that by having different classes of tanks, artillery, infantry , planes ,etc. opens up the inevitable fact that the combat system would have to be expanded to a 12d system to accommidate all these units. the 6d system seems stretched to the max to me. what do you think?

I was doing some more thinking and I found a way to include up to 10 different types of land units without resorting to 12-siders.  I’m sure others have come up with similar systems (there are only so many possible permutations using 6-siders, after all.)  Nevertheless, I think it shows that a set with a wide range of alternatives pieces is quite feasible as an upgrade accessory (and this is just land units and only limiting ourselves to 6-siders…)

| Unit                     
Infantry                       
Elite Infantry*         
Light Tank
Armored Infantry

Artillery                     
Medium Tank                       
Medium Tank Dest./ SP Gun

Heavy Artillery
Heavy Tank
Heavy Tank Dest./ SP Gun       
| Attack
1
2
2
2

2
3
2

2
4
3
| Defense
2
2
1
2

3
2
3

4
3
4
| Move
1
1
2
2

1
2
2

1
2
2
| Cost
3
4
4
5

5
6
6

6
8
8
|

*Elite Infantry would include things like Paratroops with the ability to jump from bombers and/or air transports and Marines with bonuses on amphibious landings.