G starts with 23 Inf, 3 art, 9 tanks and 6 fighters in Europe.
Yes, but not all 23inf are in range to threaten Russia, and most players seem to advocate placing 3-4ftrs on WEur to discourage Allied incursions.
USSR just doesnt have the troops to “overrun” Germany.
Right, not “overrun” Germany but I’m just saying in the game I’m in now after G3 the Russians still outnumber my G inf almost 2-1 on the front lines. Yes, Germany should catch up, but it takes time, primarily because I spent IPCs on naval units. I just don’t see how I can prevent being placed in a 2-front war against Allies that know what they are doing.
G starts with 23 Inf, 3 art, 9 tanks and 6 fighters in Europe.
Yes, but not all 23inf are in range to threaten Russia, and most players seem to advocate placing 3-4ftrs on WEur to discourage Allied incursions.
USSR just doesnt have the troops to “overrun” Germany.
Right, not “overrun” Germany but I’m just saying in the game I’m in now after G3 the Russians still outnumber my G inf almost 2-1 on the front lines. Yes, Germany should catch up, but it takes time, primarily because I spent IPCs on naval units. I just don’t see how I can prevent being placed in a 2-front war against Allies that know what they are doing.
You are already IN a 2 front war to start with. The allies are going KGF. You have 2 options.
If you try #2, you are NOT going to get past trading with USSR for the first few rounds. That’s just a fact of life.
Also, if USSR outnumbers your infantry 2-1 on the front lines, I think you are doing something wrong. They should not have such an advantage unless their dice were so great and yours so bad. What are you buying???
Squirecam
Just a thought, but since we’re talking the strengths of Russia vs Germany, I don’t think I’m completely off topic (as the topic has developed a bit)
Couldnt you bid for a Restricted Russia and then no longer need an axis bid? How would that effect game play?
that would kill the Allies.
But on the topic of being outnumbered by Russia, NO BIG DEAL, why? becuse you defend better then Russia can attack, he will most likley lack offensive punch.
Just a thought, but since we’re talking the strengths of Russia vs Germany, I don’t think I’m completely off topic (as the topic has developed a bit)
Couldnt you bid for a Restricted Russia and then no longer need an axis bid? How would that effect game play?
Agree with Nix.
Germany keeps WR…. Very bad for allies. Very bad…
Squirecam
Jennifer, please hold that thought for a second, I was replying to squirecam.
What are you buying???
To review, the basis for the thread was G1 1AC 12inf. Â G2 I had only 38 IPCs due to sbr by UK, so I bought 8inf 1art 2arm. Â G3 I bought 12inf 1arm, and I’ve only just finished UK3, so those 12inf are in Germany. Â Due to attrition (e.g. taking back Ukraine G2 with 2inf 1ftr, taking Karel 2inf 1ftr, then losing those infantry to counter-attacks), I have only 10inf in E.Eur, 1inf in Balkans, Russia holds WRus, Ukr, Belo, Karel, UK holds Norway. Â Believe me, I’ve tried, but I couldn’t do better than one big stack in EEur with 10inf 1art 5arm. Â I’ve basically followed the moves ad described by experienced members of the forum who have played G1 1AC 12inf. Â My goal is to see how that initial buy plays out, and not surprisingly it has led to an early Russian lead. :-) Â But I am far from giving up hope!
Couldnt you bid for a Restricted Russia and then no longer need an axis bid? How would that effect game play?
In the original A&A, restricted Russia was one way to make it a bit tougher on the Allies. In Revised, I’m not sure I would want to play a Restricted Russia! I agree with Nix. WRus is too critical.
Jennifer, please hold that thought for a second, I was replying to squirecam.
What are you buying???
To review, the basis for the thread was G1 1AC 12inf. Â G2 I had only 38 IPCs due to sbr by UK, so I bought 8inf 1art 2arm. Â
I presume you have 5 fighters still. You do NOT need armor or artillery. You are trading Belo/Karelia/Ukr. This requires sacrificing INFANTRY, not armor. G2 buy should be as much INF as possible, with art/tank left over. In this case, 11 Inf, 1 armor.
A sea purchase usually causes UK to fear 2 things, invasion and merger. I dont think you tried to merge. So the AC by itself wont stop the UK/USA from gathering to destroy you (as you are finding out). If you build an AC you must threaten to do something substantial with it.
see post above. USSR cant have the O power to defeat your D strength… (or wouldn’t with all INF buys)
Trying to follow a “script”, even a “master’s” usually results in trouble. The best thing you can do is learn to think “outside the box”, experiment, and try to determine overall strategies and counters. Dont be tied down to one “set” way of doing things.
Squirecam
@Nix:
that would kill the Allies.
But on the topic of being outnumbered by Russia, NO BIG DEAL, why? becuse you defend better then Russia can attack, he will most likley lack offensive punch.
Likewise, if Germany buys ships and Russia moves in to hold Ukr early it becomes very hard or costly (or both) to push them out.
- A sea purchase usually causes UK to fear 2 things, invasion and merger. I dont think you tried to merge. So the AC by itself wont stop the UK/USA from gathering to destroy you (as you are finding out). If you build an AC you must threaten to do something substantial with it.
I bolded the important part.
Edit: Just to clarify.
I don’t think a sole AC purchase threatens much of anything.
- A sea purchase usually causes UK to fear 2 things, invasion and merger. I dont think you tried to merge. So the AC by itself wont stop the UK/USA from gathering to destroy you (as you are finding out). If you build an AC you must threaten to do something substantial with it.
I bolded the important part.
Buying an AC alone won’t do that. At least not IMO.
Depends. Sometimes it will sometimes not.
Squirecam
@Nix:
that would kill the Allies.
But on the topic of being outnumbered by Russia, NO BIG DEAL, why? Â becuse you defend better then Russia can attack, he will most likley lack offensive punch.
Likewise, if Germany buys ships and Russia moves in to hold Ukr early it becomes very hard or costly (or both) to push them out.
Right, that’s what is about to happen to me if I don’t do something quick! :-o
Jennifer, please hold that thought for a second, I was replying to squirecam.
What are you buying???
To review, the basis for the thread was G1 1AC 12inf. Â G2 I had only 38 IPCs due to sbr by UK, so I bought 8inf 1art 2arm. Â
I presume you have 5 fighters still. You do NOT need armor or artillery. You are trading Belo/Karelia/Ukr. This requires sacrificing INFANTRY, not armor. G2 buy should be as much INF as possible, with art/tank left over. In this case, 11 Inf, 1 armor.
A sea purchase usually causes UK to fear 2 things, invasion and merger. I dont think you tried to merge. So the AC by itself wont stop the UK/USA from gathering to destroy you (as you are finding out). If you build an AC you must threaten to do something substantial with it.
see post above. USSR cant have the O power to defeat your D strength… (or wouldn’t with all INF buys)
Trying to follow a “script”, even a “master’s” usually results in trouble. The best thing you can do is learn to think “outside the box”, experiment, and try to determine overall strategies and counters. Dont be tied down to one “set” way of doing things.
Squirecam
Yes, I have 3ftr WEur 2ftr on AC, 1ftr EEur. Â I bot just 1art, with an extra IPC; that doesn’t hurt, it will help later when I attack.
Yes, on G2 and G3 I moved my naval units to attempt merge, but due to a block it cannot happen until G4 at earliest, if US navy doesn’t sink most of my fleet. :wink:
Russia has 4art 4arm 2ftr at the front lines, along with 20inf. Â They don’t lack offensive punch.
Agreed. Â This is only my third game of Revised, so this whole German AC approach is new and outside the box for me. Â You’re basically reading my thoughts expressed as AAR (after action reports) turn by turn as I discover how this works. :-)
You need to Merge G2. Merging G4 is way too late.
Squirecam
You need to Merge G2. Merging G4 is way too late.
Squirecam
I understand, but there are consequences to that approach, too. First, I might have even less inf in EEur unless I had used the trn G2 to move 2inf. (That goes back to a mistake of having left 3inf in Balk after G1.) Second, G2 I used SZ15 to add more troops to the middle east. Perhaps another mistake, but there it is.
This is starting to feel a bit like Risk, where a common strategy was to have one or two big stacks and leave next to nothing everywhere else! I’ve got a lot to learn…
So what? Pull out of E. Europe and Balkans with Germany, leave 1 infantry there. Unify your fleet, force the Allies out of SZ 3, 6, 7, 8 and 12, then push the Russians back.
So what? Pull out of E. Europe and Balkans with Germany, leave 1 infantry there. Unify your fleet, force the Allies out of SZ 3, 6, 7, 8 and 12, then push the Russians back.
Pull out of EEur to where?
to Germany, build 10 infs or what you can afford, and push back into EEur with force the following round, gives russia some short time cash but he can´t break Germany alone in any circumstance since it´s easier to defend then to attack and “traditionally” Russia tend to lack offensive punch.
@Nix:
to Germany, build 10 infs or what you can afford, and push back into EEur with force the following round, gives russia some short time cash but he can´t break Germany alone in any circumstance since it´s easier to defend then to attack and “traditionally” Russia tend to lack offensive punch.
Retreat? Der Fuhrer will have me shot!!! I understand what you all are saying, but it sure runs counter to my instincts. What the, maybe I’ll give it a try… Still hinges on unifying the fleet (not a given) and the Japanese tank drive to Moscow. Too much talk on my part, I need to get home and play! :-D
newpaintbrush:Â But instead of attacking Karelia on G2, you COULD have attacked Archangel on G2
BTW, I generally do not advocate attacking Archangel on G2. Woops (?)
newpaintbrush:Â The trick is threatening Russia on the north and the south.
I wonder if I’m doing something wrong, because the numbers don’t add up for me to threaten both north and south.
And that’s the trick. It is damn difficult to threaten Russia on north and south. But I should elaborate on what I wrote. It’s not really a matter of ATTACKING Russia so much as pulling Russia into Germany’s infantry. (I think). By that, I mean - let us say that Germany had a big stack at Ukraine that Russia couldn’t attack (because of lots of German infantry). Then let us say that if Russia can’t really afford to attack, Russia must then decide between protecting EITHER West Russia or Caucasus (because Russia should not have enough infantry to protect BOTH West Russia AND Caucasus against a big German stack). So Russia is forced to choose ONE, and Germany takes the OTHER. And when Germany DOES take the other, then Russia is forced to decide between protecting the territory it’s in, or Russia itself (because regardless of whether Germany controls Caucasus or West Russia, it threatens Russia for the next turn). So if Russia still cannot attack the German stack, Russia must pull back to Moscow, and Germany controls Europe and west Asia. Note that I’m not all that great with Axis (at least, judging by my results; I’m not BAD, but I’m not great with em either).
With that said, my AAR for today: heading into J3 things are so-so for the Axis. Panzers took all Africa except S.Afr, and Trans-Jordan fell, but Norway was lost, and R holds Ukr, Belo, W.Rus, Kar. J has not hit its stride yet; just the simple move UK1 destroy J DD in SZ59 makes a significant impact on J’s early game! R3 took Sink back, so J has not made much headway. IC in Kwang and 3trn in SZ61 should get things rolling soon. UK has abandoned India, and US has all but abandoned Pacific due to KGF, so J should now expand.
So you have how many transports total for Japan? I think five is a good minimum.
Back to Germany: once I had a real navy, I wasn’t sure exactly what to do with it. Don’t know if this was a huge mistake or not, but I decided to go for fleet unification. G2 moved from SZ5 to SZ7; Russia went for block by moving sub to SZ12, preventing G3 unification in SZ13. G3 moved SZ7 to SZ12, sinking sub wol. 1BB 1trn moved SZ15 to SZ13. Can the Allies prevent unification?
The Allies shouldn’t be able to stop German fleet unification with just a couple boats/ships, because if they try, German air can just blast those “blockers” away, then Germany’s navy unites during noncombat movement. However, if the Allies have plenty of air, they could potentially just blow up one of Germany’s little fleets before Germany has the chance to unify.
Well, US has 1BB 1DD 3trn in SZ10, plus 4ftr from ACs in SZ8, so the Kriegsmarine will probably be sunk US3, albeit at a high price for the Americans. The long-term consequences of that battle remain to be seen…
Build some German fighters, maybe one a turn. You will see that Germany becomes weakened against the Russians (which is a problem), but IF you kept some German navy intact, the Allies will find it really really difficult to crack either the Baltic or Mediterranean (as soon as they get navy in range, you can suicide the German navy in that area and attack with Luftwaffe, trading your wee navy and perhaps a fighter for the entire combined Allied fleet.
Oh yeah -
Generally, after you see which way the Allies are going, you start buying fighters with the Axis power under attack.
So on G1, you build a carrier and 8 infantry (or whatever), and on J1 you build 3 transports and a tank. If after US1, there’s a fat Atlantic fleet, on G2, you build 1-2 fighters and infantry plus possibly some other ground units so you can continue to trade with Russia, while Japan gets an industrial complex and more transports, but if there’s a fat Pacific fleet, Germany gets infantry to follow with tanks, while Japan starts builds transport and fighter(s) instead of industrial complex and transports. And you continue to buy around 1 fighter a turn, until you have this gigantic air force.
