So the axis almost pulled it off. Lost Verviers last turn. Allies just stayed in the other 2 stacks. Could roll them out to see if they get control for the heck of it.
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Battle of the Bulge Strategy
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@Imperious:
So how do you concieve of a good german strategy to counter that you understand about the game?
how do you do the following:
allocate air power if you place last
which cities do you attack what is the focus of the spearhead
what do you do with the tanks do you blitz? what kind of stacks are optimal for combat (either as loses or attacks)
It is best to allocate air power last. If you win the air initiative you choose who places first which is huge for Germany. I typically (as Germany) try to cover the hex I advocate the Allies attacking- my key supply dump for a thrust of the attack. No matter when I place. Germany is woefully outnumbered and so far the best I’ve found you can hope for is to minimize the damage. The dogfighting reduces the number of planes (killing all of Germany’s usually) then your AA can reduce it further.
Optimal stacks for combat are balanced. Especailly as you get to the aircraft turns as you get more AA dice. I like two Art in hexes I might have to attack two directions from. I know that “it depends” answers aren’t the most useful but it really does. A variety of units is good as it spreads the random casaulties around without weakening the hex overmuch.
I will add more at lunch, work beckons.
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I didn’t mention that if the Allies place first and don’t go after supplies I cover one of the hexes they do attack.
Back to optimal stacks. I don’t think this game really has an “INF push mecahnic.” Hits are random and with the stacking limit of 12 units and INF only getting one attack dice a lot of INF in hex isn’t always to your benefit. The more dice that will wrap around their address the more INF you want to have. 2 INF and 2 ARM preserves the ARM but with 2 INF, 2 ARM and 2 ART everything is at equal chance of getting hit.
It is easy for defending the more you want to hold a hex the higher you should stack it. For attacking the harder you want to swing the more ART, and ARM you need.
Unlike Revised your ARM can’t be held back and brought up in movement. They have to be on the front at the end of movement. Also we aren’t in a war of attrition in this game. Hitting units that you can “kill” easily like a lone TRN in Revised may gain you nothing. Preserving units isn’t really a priority, holding or taking cities and towns is.
Blitzing.
I bet you have read a book called “The Blitzkrieg Myth” IL? You can move out ARM very fast but if the gas and ammo isn’t moving as fast you haven’t really got anywhere.Supplies are precious and using an extra one for moving had better have a payoff. A blitz behind a supply laden hex to cut it off from reinforcement perhaps. St. Vith is victim of this to first turn. I sometimes blitz thru Malmedy to the hex flanking Eupen. If you can get into Eupen and adjacent to Verviers quickly you can really hinder the Allies. Not blitzing far ahead of the INF and ART isn’t so much about preserving the ARM but protecting trucks and keeping the ARM working.
Say we Blitz from Malmedy to Trois-Ponts, to Werbomont but the Allies can come out of the Northern cities and hamper supply to those units. Granted there are lots of points past Werbomont but can you get enough gas there to take them? I don’t think Germany has enough trucks for blitzing of that sort.
Focus of the spearhead.
This depends on the holes you can bunch on turn one. St. Vith and its supplies are critical. Malmedy also needs to be in German hands by turn two. Eupen and company are high on the list and I like to get at them quickly (getting units there I think is worth the Blitz cost.) You have to screen your units in that area even if you don’t intend to siege Eupen, Verviers and Liege but want to go “deep.”A thrust at Bastogne from the south is good. You might get a chance to bypass and go to Neufchateau via Martlegne without weakening your attack on Bastogne. I don’t have the map out but a quick dash along that southern road can keep the Allies in front of you.
In the broadest sense I think the line should look either smooth or “bulge” to the east. The middle of the board a valley between two mountains shape. Trying to make a clockwise encirclement of Bastogne and of Eupen et al. Never locked into anything other than protecting my supplies and trucks and making due haste.
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I bet you have read a book called “The Blitzkrieg Myth” IL?
Thats not one i have read. I have about 4 or 5 books written by Germans on biltzkrieg:
Panzer leader by guderian
Lost victories by manstein ( my favorite)
Panzer battles by von Mellinthin
Infantry Attacks by Rommel
and another Rommel book ( not sure about name)
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I have not read any of those. My reading on WWII is pretty pedestrian. The basic contention of the book is that Blitzkrieg was not some great innovation but an invention of the Allies to cover the fact that they were caught with their pants down. On a more substantive note he compares average advance per day to advances in WWI and on how wide a front they are and contends that they do not indicate a radical change in technique. The amount of advance is not dependent on tanks but on the support units. Quick read. You’ll probably find it pretty light if you choose to make time for it.
I found myself thinking about it as soon as I saw the Blitz rule article on AH. During the first BOTB game I played I kept not blitzing because I wouldn’t be able to shoot with those units later. I keep meaning to make time for the Guderian book I always seem to pick it up when I’m in a store with a copy but never buy it or take it out of the library.
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Hey Frimmel, I’m going to post that strategy on the website, okay?
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Feel free to do so. Double check my spelling if you don’t mind. :-)
edit:
Do you want me to combine the Allied and Axis strats into one paper first? Maybe do a draft of the whole thing first? -
Unless they are not separable, I prefer that they are two different articles. I will post each as soon as you give me the final go ahead.
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Alright let me work them up a little more formally. The Allied strategy wasn’t meant to be that long. I think I can clean it up a bit. The same goes for the Axis strategy post. I’ll give them a once or twice over and pass them on to you as two separate pieces. I would like to add an intro to each if they are going up on the main page. I’ll e-mail them to you as either word or pdf or plain text. Do you have a preference?
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I have the Allied portion completed with intro. It is ready for review and posting. The Axis version is going to need a bit more editing. I think I can have it completed by Sunday.
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Well, actually, if you want to save me a bunch of time, do it in HTML. :-D
Otherwise a PDF is fine. If you limit the amount of formatting that you use to font size and font weight (bold, etc.) then that will be a time saver too.
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I could probably manage the HTML. PDF is certainly no problem. I did not use any bold or italics in anticipation of it not being easy to translate. Where do you want me to send the files?
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Enough about articles for the minute.
I wanted to look at the map and the only one I had on this computer was IL’s from his BOTB variant ruleset. I found it very amusing to find a city with a road going thru it in a hex I advocate the Allies fighting for. The OOB map has nothing there. Unsure what conclusions can be made from that but it seemed worthy of note.
I guess we don’t have a lot of BOTB players yet? This discussion has been a trifle one-sided.
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I don’t get much of an opportunity to play.
IL, do you have the original scans from which your maps was made? It would be nice to have a digital version of the standard BotB map. If we have that, we can number the hexes. The sooner we have one map out there, numbered, and promoted then the less likelihood of there being multiple of these circulated.
Frimmel, send your articles to david.jensen at axisandallies.org
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I can easily tailor my expansion map for Bulge and remove the extra stuff and number the hexes. It will take time to do this …probably no earlier than sunday. Ill email it when its done.
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Dear Frimmel,
I appreciate the time you took to elaborate on the Allies strategy. I have used it to good effect. Thanks for your thoughtful plan. -
Has it gotten you any wins or simply not got you slaughtered?
edit:
What has Germany been doing to counter? -
Dear Frimmel,
In response to your query,Yes, I had one win so far with this strategy. Germany only needed one good die to win by eliminating the last unit in the town just west of Bastogne. But it was not to be. I think if I was Germany, I would have concentrated my forces more. With the loss of initiative that Germany suffered in this last game, they seemed confused as to whether or not to attack north or south. This divided effort I think led to their defeat. It was close. A real squeaker for the allies. It helps to blitz the allied tanks off the reinforcement boards to penetrate the ZOC thrown up by German penetration. Thanks for asking. -
What was Germany’s supply situation? Also was Germany doing a bunch of blitzing of their own? Did the game go the whole eight turns or did Germany get stuck without being able to re-supply and “lost?” Did you kill a lot of German trucks?
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Dear Frimmel,
The Germans lost on turn 8 because time ran out. They were also down to one available truck to bring in fresh supply as two others were stuck in ZOC. All others were destroyed by air power. That was fun! It might have been possible for Germany to win on turn 9 as supply could stilll be brought to the front, however allies were blitzing towards Malmedy from Eupen in an attempt to reduce the Victory points. In all my other games as the allies the battle was over by turn 4 or 5 and so this was much more interesting. -
Just a thought as a strategy opportunity:
Since aircraft combat precedes ground combat and since the allies have an overwhelming superiority in airpower - it seems that it would be advantageous for the allies to tank blitz to form an unreatreatable ZOC especially at the end of turn 4 and following. In this way, they start turn 5 with the offensive against any German hex with ZOC issues. Before the German ground forces can attack the allied hex causing the ZOC problem, the allies are saying “bombs away!” Even though the German player may counter with their own airforce, it is stilll 12 planes against 3 planes and the remaining allied units get to pummel the German ground forces.
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