Game History
Round: 1 Purchase Units - Germans Germans buy 1 carrier, 1 destroyer and 1 submarine; Remaining resources: 0 PUs; Trigger Germans 6 Atlantic Wall Broken Switch: Setting switch to false for conditionAttachment_Germans_6_Atlantic_Wall_Possible_Switch attached to Germans Combat Move - Germans 1 armour, 1 artillery and 2 infantry moved from Holland Belgium to Normandy Bordeaux 1 mech_infantry moved from Western Germany to Normandy Bordeaux 3 armour and 3 mech_infantrys moved from Austria to France 1 artillery, 3 infantry and 1 mech_infantry moved from Western Germany to France 2 armour, 1 artillery and 3 infantry moved from Holland Belgium to France 1 fighter moved from Norway to 114 Sea Zone 1 tactical_bomber moved from Germany to 114 Sea Zone 1 battleship moved from 116 Sea Zone to 114 Sea Zone 1 bomber moved from Germany to 114 Sea Zone 1 submarine moved from 127 Sea Zone to 114 Sea Zone 1 submarine moved from 121 Sea Zone to 114 Sea Zone 1 submarine moved from 120 Sea Zone to 109 Sea Zone 1 submarine moved from 111 Sea Zone to 109 Sea Zone 1 submarine moved from 111 Sea Zone to 113 Sea Zone 1 submarine moved from 106 Sea Zone to 113 Sea Zone 1 bomber moved from Germany to 113 Sea Zone 1 fighter moved from Holland Belgium to 113 Sea Zone 2 fighters and 4 tactical_bombers moved from Western Germany to 113 Sea Zone 2 artilleries and 6 infantry moved from Austria to Yugoslavia 1 armour and 2 infantry moved from Slovakia Hungary to Yugoslavia 1 armour and 1 infantry moved from Romania to Yugoslavia 1 armour and 1 fighter moved from Poland to Yugoslavia Combat - Germans Battle in Yugoslavia Germans attack with 3 armour, 2 artilleries, 1 fighter and 9 infantry Neutral_Allies defend with 5 infantry Germans win, taking Yugoslavia from Neutral_Allies with 3 armour, 2 artilleries, 1 fighter and 9 infantry remaining. Battle score for attacker is 15 Casualties for Neutral_Allies: 5 infantry Battle in Normandy Bordeaux Germans attack with 1 armour, 1 artillery, 2 infantry and 1 mech_infantry French defend with 1 artillery, 1 factory_minor, 1 harbour and 1 infantry Germans win, taking Normandy Bordeaux from French with 1 armour, 1 artillery, 2 infantry and 1 mech_infantry remaining. Battle score for attacker is 7 Casualties for French: 1 artillery and 1 infantry Battle in 114 Sea Zone Germans attack with 1 battleship, 1 bomber, 1 fighter, 2 submarines and 1 tactical_bomber British defend with 1 battleship, 1 cruiser and 1 destroyer Units damaged: 1 battleship owned by the British Units damaged: 1 battleship owned by the Germans Germans win with 1 battleship, 1 bomber, 1 fighter, 1 submarine and 1 tactical_bomber remaining. Battle score for attacker is 31 Casualties for Germans: 1 submarine Casualties for British: 1 battleship, 1 cruiser and 1 destroyer Battle in 109 Sea Zone Germans attack with 2 submarines British defend with 1 destroyer and 1 transport Germans win, taking 109 Sea Zone from Neutral with 2 submarines remaining. Battle score for attacker is 14 Casualties for British: 1 destroyer and 1 transport Battle in 113 Sea Zone Germans attack with 1 bomber, 3 fighters, 2 submarines and 4 tactical_bombers British defend with 1 battleship and 1 cruiser; French defend with 1 cruiser Units damaged: 1 battleship owned by the British Germans win with 1 bomber, 3 fighters and 3 tactical_bombers remaining. Battle score for attacker is 18 Casualties for Germans: 2 submarines and 1 tactical_bomber Casualties for French: 1 cruiser Casualties for British: 1 battleship and 1 cruiser Battle in France Germans attack with 5 armour, 2 artilleries, 6 infantry and 4 mech_infantrys British defend with 1 armour and 1 artillery; French defend with 1 aaGun, 1 airfield, 1 armour, 1 artillery, 1 factory_major, 1 fighter and 6 infantry Germans captures 19PUs while taking French capital Germans converts factory_major into different units Germans win, taking France from French with 5 armour and 4 mech_infantrys remaining. Battle score for attacker is 27 Casualties for Germans: 2 artilleries and 6 infantry Casualties for French: 1 aaGun, 1 armour, 1 artillery, 1 fighter and 6 infantry Casualties for British: 1 armour and 1 artillery Trigger Germans Conquer France: Setting switch to true for conditionAttachment_French_1_Liberation_Switch attached to French triggerFrenchDestroyPUsGermans: Setting destroysPUs to true for playerAttachment attached to French Non Combat Move - Germans 1 cruiser and 1 transport moved from 117 Sea Zone to 115 Sea Zone 3 infantry moved from Norway to Finland Germans take Finland from Neutral_Axis 2 infantry moved from Denmark to 115 Sea Zone 2 infantry moved from 115 Sea Zone to Norway 1 aaGun, 3 artilleries and 11 infantry moved from Germany to Poland 1 infantry moved from Romania to Bulgaria Germans take Bulgaria from Neutral_Axis 1 fighter moved from Yugoslavia to Southern Italy 1 fighter and 1 tactical_bomber moved from 114 Sea Zone to 115 Sea Zone 1 bomber moved from 114 Sea Zone to Western Germany 1 bomber, 3 fighters and 3 tactical_bombers moved from 113 Sea Zone to Western Germany 1 aaGun moved from Germany to Slovakia Hungary 1 aaGun moved from Holland Belgium to Normandy Bordeaux 1 aaGun moved from Western Germany to Holland Belgium Place Units - Germans 1 carrier, 1 destroyer and 1 submarine placed in 115 Sea Zone Turning on Edit Mode EDIT: Removing units owned by Germans from 114 Sea Zone: 1 submarine EDIT: Removing units owned by Germans from 114 Sea Zone: 1 battleship EDIT: Adding units owned by Germans to 115 Sea Zone: 1 battleship EDIT: Changing unit hit damage for these Germans owned units to: battleship = 1 EDIT: Turning off Edit Mode Turn Complete - Germans Germans collect 41 PUs; end with 60 PUs Trigger Germans 5 Swedish Iron Ore: Germans met a national objective for an additional 5 PUs; end with 65 PUs Objective Germans 1 Trade with Russia: Germans met a national objective for an additional 5 PUs; end with 70 PUs2016 League Post Game Results Here
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2 years in a row now, he’s left with about 8 or more games going. Beware playing him in the future, unless you like your opponent disappearing :-P
I am not surprised
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I do understand the points, and the realism argument.
I would suggest choosing from this menu:
- Increase cost of Bombers back up to 15, and consider fighters to 12 (leave over-priced tacs alone), just like they used to be. Tanks won’t look so expensive any more :)
- Remove the +2 SBR for Strat bombers, or make it +1.
- What you’re saying. Lower bomber attack value or do a 1 round thing. Bombers attacking at 4 in air to air combat or in naval combat is ridiculous. Very few instances of bombers actually attacking fleets in WWII to my knowledge.
- Lower cost of Strat bomber unit and make it so it only does SBR. No conventional attacks allowed. Who ever heard of bombers flying over an army of 20,000 and killing them all, anyway? And whoever heard of infantry shooting down bombers? Or tanks shooting down bombers? What is WRONG with this game anyway?! :wink:
What I experimented with is STBs attacking only @ 2 BUT any land unit can support the bomber with +2 attack bonus. In sea battles again attack is only @ 2 but each surface warship can support up to 2 bombers with +2 bonus. This change improves realism a lot and importantly does not alter the OOB mechanics as long as number of bombers in a battle is small. It still allows for “dark skies” strategies, but makes them significantly less optimal.
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There you go - good stuff
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you know what? That sounds like an extremely good idea.
It prevents these annoying bomber-only attacks on the Allies fleets in Med, Atlantic or the Canal, as well as the typical Egypt / London captures with 1 inf and 30 bombers.
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16L G40 ArtofWar1947 (Axis) vs. JWW (Allies + 22) Rematch: JWW (Allies+22) over ArtofWar1947 (Axis)
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ABH over AldoRaine.
http://www.axisandallies.org/forums/index.php?topic=37358.0 -
http://www.axisandallies.org/forums/index.php?topic=36312.300
Legion386 over Giallo
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Variance as Axis over Strategic Planner as Allies http://www.axisandallies.org/forums/index.php?topic=37119.75
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cds over Surprise Attack Id # 37130.0
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Cyanight (Allies +22) over Pherman1215 (Axis)
I guess he has gone missing again. I have not heard from Pherman1215 since December.
http://www.axisandallies.org/forums/index.php?action=post;topic=36903.120;num_replies=127
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I do understand the points, and the realism argument.
I would suggest choosing from this menu:
- Increase cost of Bombers back up to 15, and consider fighters to 12 (leave over-priced tacs alone), just like they used to be. Tanks won’t look so expensive any more :)
- Remove the +2 SBR for Strat bombers, or make it +1.
- What you’re saying. Lower bomber attack value or do a 1 round thing. Bombers attacking at 4 in air to air combat or in naval combat is ridiculous. Very few instances of bombers actually attacking fleets in WWII to my knowledge.
- Lower cost of Strat bomber unit and make it so it only does SBR. No conventional attacks allowed. Who ever heard of bombers flying over an army of 20,000 and killing them all, anyway? And whoever heard of infantry shooting down bombers? Or tanks shooting down bombers? What is WRONG with this game anyway?! :wink:
What I experimented with is STBs attacking only @ 2 BUT any land unit can support the bomber with +2 attack bonus. In sea battles again attack is only @ 2 but each surface warship can support up to 2 bombers with +2 bonus. This change improves realism a lot and importantly does not alter the OOB mechanics as long as number of bombers in a battle is small. It still allows for “dark skies” strategies, but makes them significantly less optimal.
This is similar to HBG’s rules in the Amerika game. Bombers have 2 attack values 4(1). The high value is for bombers attacking without any enemy fighters in the battle. The second attack value is much lower and is used if the enemy has fighters in the battle. Amerika does not have any naval ships in though so this rule is for land based attacks only. Another thing I like about their game is each attack round has multiple phases in it. Planes conduct and initial air to air phase prior to air to ground combat phase.
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Looking through these threads, I appreciate what you guys are doing in changing the game, but honestly, it’s not at all the Axis & Allies that I have in my boxes – to balance this game, you are making so many changes that you really should call it a different game. And, balancing units doesn’t balance out territories, so if the problem is the way that the territories connect then you are almost spinning your wheels a little.
After some experience with other games, may I suggest that people take a look at the mechanics of games like New World Order in TripleA and even World At War? Here is why: those games are much more balanced than Global 40. They don’t even really require a bid. There are bombers that cost 14, there are then after 4 turns bombers that cost 12 for some nations (att def move of 4/2/5) and others get them at 18 (5/2/8), and the ones at 18 even give support. What keeps the game in balance is 1) the spacing of the territories and map construction, and 2) the fact that infantry grunts only cost 2, not 3. That is a huge difference in the dark skies strategy, and dare I say that it destroys bomber only purchase strategies against the Russian front. There are more units in these games as well (and it sounds like you are incorporating more units into your mod, so I’d take a look at those too).
Again, this is a different game, but instead of making change after change with little testing (after all, that seems to be how the initial game was developed lol), perhaps looking at those comprehensive mechanics of a different, well-functioning game may help.
Otherwise, I honestly would prefer going back to AAG50 where at least the game was less complex and more balanced. I do still like my actual Europe and Pacific board games tho – very cool when set up. They just don’t seem to be very balanced from a league perspective (and having to bid 25-30 is not balance).
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Why tweak G40 when these other games (New World Order, World At War, etc.) are already out there, with different unit mechanics, etc.? The answer to your query is pretty simple. I don’t like those games; I wanted to like them! I really did. But they just weren’t love at first play (like G40 was).
I love G40. Ever heard that song “I love you. You’re perfect. Now change”? Thats pretty much how it is with G40. After playing vanilla G40 a lot, I (and other G40 devotees) identified a few ways that an already awesome and deeply engrossing game might be made even awesome-er. Some of those ideas ultimately found their way into G40 Balance Mod. Others were tried and discarded. The end-product remains very much recognizable as G40, but with a player community’s firm imprimatur on it.
Even if a majority of the ideas are never implemented in any meaningful way, I think continued discussions about how to improve the game I love are always fun and sometimes even constructive.
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majikforce +20 Allies -VS- dawgoneit Axis majikforce WINS
http://www.axisandallies.org/forums/index.php?topic=36945.120 -
MrRoboto (Axis) defeats StuckTojo (Allies +15)
http://www.axisandallies.org/forums/index.php?topic=37363.60
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Rubioton (Aliies +17) defeats Odonis
Failure to take France in Round 1 doomed this game from the start, but well played by Rubioton!
http://www.axisandallies.org/forums/index.php?topic=37161.new#new
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http://www.axisandallies.org/forums/index.php?board=54.0
Radiant (Axis) defeats Talleyrand19 (Allies)
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Wrong link, please provide corrected one
To all - please specify the bid (then I know it’s a regular 2nd edition match and not the balanced mod), thanks -
http://www.axisandallies.org/forums/index.php?topic=37242.240
sorry about that, Radiant (Axis) over Talleyrand19 (Allies +23)
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Stalingradsky (Axis) over Rubioton (Allies +18)
http://www.axisandallies.org/forums/index.php?topic=37177
Excelent job Sir.
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