G40 Balance Variant - Latest Version

[Shin-Ji]

I could see setting up Vichy so that the Italians could invade Southern France in I2 - it essentially saves them the trouble of killing that fleet, and denies it to the Allies.  As an added bonus, you destroy a few French Inf around the board too.

Still, dangerous to take forces away from the France fight to take Normandy, and extremely tricky to take Normandy with the Italians.

[Jennifer]

I generally hit Normandy with Germany with 2 inf, 1 art, 1 arm anyway.

But if I want to activate Vichy, I would have to redetail 4 or 5 aircraft away from the British to ensure to clear S. France in one shot and minimize risk of defensive fire hitting multiple plans.  (Not negate the risk, minimize it.)

[Shin-Ji]

You don’t have to clear S France, tho.  As long as the UK doesn’t land stuff there, you’re fine.

[regularkid]

correct :)

[MrRoboto]

I have a question concerning the Russian NO.

It says that Russia gets 2 additional PU per open lend lease, if Japan declares war. So, if Russia declares war at Japan, Russia still gets these extra PU?

[Shin-Ji]

No, they do not.  Those only happen if Japan declares on Russia.  It’s an incentive to keep them off each other’s backs.

[Jennifer]

@Shin:

No, they do not.  Those only happen if Japan declares on Russia.  It’s an incentive to keep them off each other’s backs.

What does Japan get for not declaring war on Russia?

[MrRoboto]

You don’t get a bonus from not declaring war. But both sides get punished for declaring a war.

Japan gives Russia bonus IPC from that land lease NO. That’s very likely 2 IPC from persia each round and maybe 2 more from norway and amur each.

Russia, on the other hand, gives Japan the ability to invade Siberia, Kazakhstan and so on.

[regularkid]

Exactly. And critically, by DOWing Russia also gives Japan the ability to block sz 5 by moving a ship there, which cuts off the Pacific Lend-Lease Route. Granted, Japan could always declare war on Russia to block the route, but then Russia at least gets an offsetting increase through its other routes. But if Russia declares war on Japan unprovoked, there’s no offset.

[variance]

The north africa NO for USA is a great cash cow for the allies.  I really like the mod

[Shin-Ji]

I like the beachhead NO for the USA.

Germany first is totally an option now.  This mod does a lot to improve the game, and I think the only question is what might need to be taken from the Allies.  The fact that everyone is playtesting the heck out of it means we’ll more than likely get those answers soon.

Another thing I like about it is it speeds up the game.  J1 is a MUST.  You’re a fool if you wait.  The Axis have to win quickly, or the Allies will crush them.

[regularkid]

Yah! I love that its getting put through its paces now by league. Looking forward to see how all these games shake out.

Regarding, “J1 DOW is a must now” thats a very interesting perspective, and you might be right. But i willl say that the general view among the TripleA-online regulars who initially conceived of and play-tested the mod is that it makes J3DOW at least as viable as J1DOW (if not more so). There are several reasons for this:

1. Textbook J1DOW doesn’t address Guam, which gives USA +5 when at war
2. J1DOW permits USA to get the North Africa Beachhead objective on US1, before Italy has had a chance to do anything with FrenchNorth Africa–another +5 for USA;
3. Sinking the ANZAC transport on J1 isn’t as big a deal cuz ANZAC still gets +3 for Gilbert+Samoa+Fiji, and the DNG NO is only worth 3.
4. J1DOW ensures that UK Pacific gets +3 for the Indian Ocean NO for several rounds of war.
5. J1DOW completely negates any strategic benefit of pursuing Vichy France (which actually can be a big bonus for Axis when UK is the only player at war on the Atlantic side)
6. J1DOW makes it more difficult for Euro Axis to contest the med (which is much more important in the Mod) or to challenge the UK no-sub objective for more than a round or 2.

You are very correct, however, that Axis definitely needs to hit the ground winning and move quickly to secure the win, regardless of when Japan DOWs. While J1DOW certainly remains viable (I’ve had some success with it in Mod games), I think its benefits are counter-weighted enough for later JDOWs to warrant serious consideration.

Food for thought. It will be really interesting to see what conclusions can be drawn from all the League games using Balance Mod.

[variance]

@Shin:

Another thing I like about it is it speeds up the game.  J1 is a MUST.  You’re a fool if you wait.  The Axis have to win quickly, or the Allies will crush them.

Absolutely.  Germany better be fast too

[aequitas-et-veritas]

How much is it effecting Germans grand strategy (KRF).
Do you have to build more ships?
Set up France garrison earlier?
Enlarge or reenforce the DAK?

[TheDefinitiveS]

Is there no visual representation of the new NOs when they become true of false. Just the fact you have the extra income to show that they true?

[regularkid]

Definitives:

This most up-to-date version of the Mod is kept here (League forum):

http://www.axisandallies.org/forums/index.php?topic=37341.0

The version that I posted here is out of date.

In answer to your question, yes, in order to have the NOs listed on your Objectives Panel, you have to download a separate file (“objectives.properties”). However, this download is entirely optional, since the objectives will be tracked and correctly calculated by the game, regardless of whether they are listed on the panel.

To get the “objectives.properties” file, along with a other bells and whistles that improve the mod experience (more distinct sculpts for marines, distinct map color for vichy france), check out the second post in the thread linked above. It provides a download and directions on how to install these optional files.

Hope that helps.

[Shin-Ji]

I wonder - has any thought been given to reducing the cost of Tac Bombers to 10?  Fighters got buffed with this mod, and they were strong to begin with.  Now, to be fair, I’m not sure what that would mean historically speaking, nor do I expect that it would change the overall balance much.

I just like the idea of having more viable options in terms of units.  Cruisers are solid at 12 with the Marine option, I think.  Battleships could be reduced somewhat, which WOULD be historical, right?  Maybe to 18?

[regularkid]

Shin Ji, I think, in general, we have tried to avoid fussing too much with unit costs and mechanics because those types of changes generate the most controversy and can be a hurdle to wide acceptance in the community (same goes for starting unit-set up, territory alignment and IPC values). Accordingly, the only unit-mechanic change we made (air raid defense value of fighters) was one where we felt there was exceptional need.

I’ve followed your BM games with interest. Curious to hear your thoughts/feedback on the mod so far.

[Shin-Ji]

I follow your arguments there.

My feelings thus far are that the balance is very nearly there.  I agree the Allies have an advantage, in much the same way the Axis has in the regular game.  All the Allies have to do is to make sure the Axis doesn’t win.

The current unmodded version is essentially a race for resources, with the Allies losing more and more ground until they either reverse it, or tumble into nothingness.  Now, it’s the Axis that risks becoming irrelevant.  The Axis essentially cannot count on getting an IPC advantage and keeping it indefinitely.  This means that playstyles need to change.

I don’t feel as strongly about this as Gamerman does, and from what I’ve seen the numbers don’t seem to bear out a clear Allied advantage.  I’ve been playing with no bid - rather alternating sides with a given player - and it’s working for me.

I’m very meh about Vichy.  The (minor) advantages take a bit too long to come into play, and it’s often very dicey creating the conditions before France’s first turn.  But that could be a function of how my opponents and I play.  Nothing wrong with it, but I don’t think it’s worth the effort for Germany to take Normandy round 1.

Overall, I am sold on this mod.  I don’t ever intend to play without it at this point.  It’s a clear and unambiguous improvement over the standard game.  Kudos to you and the rest on the design team.

[regularkid]

Wow. High praise. Thanks, shin ji. That means a lot. I agree, it’s very close to true balance. Will be interesting to see how the axis/allies win ratio shakes out.