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Long Range Air (LRA)

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WILD BILL
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I know this tech goes way back. Has any one made changes to it. I was thinking +1 for movement and -1 for cost. You could call it imp air. With +1 movement you can still do quite a bit, but ftrs couldn’t fly out 3 spaces and return to the same tt. You would need to be more creative or use an AC. I know this isn’t going to win me a popularity contest but I really hate counting out all the possibilities of an enemy LR HB. Any thoughts or is this one for the trash bin.
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(Classic) Paratrooper and Air Transport Rules for Classic

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• • • Midnight_Reaper

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@Imperious:

An 8 IPC air transport carrying a unit 6 spaces is worth far more than a sea transport. You all need to increase the cost to 12

I am only charging 10 IPCs for Fighters, I don’t see charging more than that for planes that can neither attack or defend. But I do agree that fast moving reinforcements are very useful. So, let’s make them 10 IPCs units as well for now.

To re-cap what I am going with for my rule set from all that has been discussed in this thread:

Paratroopers
Unit Name IPC Cost ATK DEF MOVE Notes
Paratroopers 4 1* 2 1 Noted by Country Marker or an Airborne disc beneath an Infantry.
Paratroopers attack increases to 2 when doing an Airborne Assault. In every round of combat where Paratroopers have done an Airborne Assault, the first offensive casualty of the round must be a Paratrooper.
Cargo Planes
Unit Name IPC Cost ATK DEF MOVE Notes
Air Transport 10 0 0 6 Noted by Country Marker or an Airborne disc beneath Fighter or Bomber. Can carry one Infantry or Paratroopers unit. May be used to help a Paratroopers unit perform an Airborne Assault.

Paratroopers - The “Poor Bloody Infantry”, now with wings. Can be noted by Country Marker disc or an HBG Airborne marker beneath an Infantry. Paratroopers attack increases to 2 when doing an Airborne Assault OR when combined with Artillery. Combining both bonuses is not allowed.

Air Transport - A grouping of the humble cargo aircraft, this unit has 3x the speed and 1/3 the capacity of regular Transports. Can be noted by Country Marker disc or an HBG Airborne marker beneath Fighter or Bomber. Used to help Paratroopers conduct Airborne Assaults. Except for satisfying hits from AAA, Air Transports can not be taken as casualties in either Attack or Defense and are simply all destroyed if they are the last units present in a defending territory.

For context, in my rule set Transports cost 8 IPCs, have a defense of 1 and a move of 2, and can carry 3 Infantry or 1 (Armor or AAA) and 1 Infantry.

Airborne Assault - During the Combat Movement phase, a power may declare an Airborne Assault. The territory to be attacked by the Airborne Assault must be within the range of at least one of that power’s Air Transports. (Air Transports must end their movement at a friendly territory, no different from any other Combat Movement by an aircraft unit.) Additionally, the territory receiving the Airborne Assault must be no further away than two (ground and/or sea) territories with friendly ground units.
The Air Transports conducting an Airborne Assault are subject to AAA fire, as per normal rules. If the Air Transport is successful at arriving over the drop zone, (i.e. is not shot down by anti-aircraft fire) then the attacking unit adds a +1 to its attack roll for the duration of that battle. The Air Transport can not be taken as a casualty to satisfy a Land Combat hit taken while fighting the Airborne Assault.
In every round of combat where Paratroopers have done an Airborne Assault, the first offensive casualty of the round must be a Paratrooper. This is a self-limiting system. Paratroopers keep their attack of 2 for conducting an Airborne Assault for the duration of the Airborne Assault, but are only guaranteed to be around for a number of rounds equal to the number of Paratroopers in the attack.

-Midnight_Reaper
S

Each air attack is to be considered as a strategical bombing raid.

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• • • SgtPepper

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As the Baron points out, modeling air superiority contests in a relatively simple wargame like A&A is quite a challenge! I think there are actually several different phenomena that go by the name of ‘air superiority’ that a good house rule would pay attention to. One is that if your air force is totally unopposed, your ground units will have advantages in terms of recon, surprise, flexibility, etc. because your planes can survey the lay of the land and strike quickly at the point of maximum impact. Another is that airplanes tend to kill each other first, before killing ground units. A third factor is that when fighters intercept bombers, the bombers tend to be less effective – it’s not just that the bombers get killed accomplishing their missions; it’s also that the bombers fly at higher altitudes, fly at faster speeds, and fly on more evasive flight paths to try to minimize their risk of getting shot down. Even when the bombers survive, they do less damage if they’re being harassed by fighters.

Here’s my take on a set of rules that could capture all of those dynamics:

After all attacks are declared, the defender may scramble up to 3 fighters from anywhere on the board, plus up to 2 more fighters from each airbase. Scrambled fighters can move to an adjacent territory or sea zone to participate in a battle there, and then (if they survive) automatically return from whence they came. The same fighter cannot participate in more than one battle per turn.

Attacking and defending fighters roll their dice separately from other units. When fighters score a hit, that hit must be assigned to a plane if possible. The victim can choose which plane is killed. Even though fighter casualties are assigned separately, they are resolved at the same instant as other casualties. For example, suppose a German force of 4 inf, 1 tnk, 1 fighter, and 2 bombers attacks a French garrison of 3 inf, 1 art, 2 fighters. The Germans score a hit with their fighter, and 3 hits with their remaining forces. The French score one hit with their fighter, and 2 hits with their remaining forces. The Germans would have to lose 1 plane and 2 units of their choice – they would probably choose to lose 2 inf, 1 ftr, leaving them with 2 inf, 1 tnk, and 2 bombers. The French would have to lose 1 plane and 3 units of their choice – they would probably choose to lose 3 inf, 1 ftr, leaving them with 1 art, 1 ftr.

If at any point you have at least one plane in a territory, and your opponent has no planes or AAA guns left alive in that territory, then your infantry and mech. infantry in that territory get +1 to their dice rolls. This is cumulative with the artillery bonus. For example, if you have 2 inf, 1 mech. inf, 3 art, and 2 bombers attacking in a territory, and your opponent is defending with only 3 inf, 1 tnk, then your infantry would score hits on rolls of “3” or less – 1 for their basic offense, +1 for the artillery, +1 for the air superiority. Defending infantry can also benefit from air superiority if the defender has air superiority. For example, if your force of 4 inf, 1 fighter, 1 bomber is being attacked by 3 inf, 3 tnk, then your infantry will hit on rolls of “3” or less – 2 for their basic defense, +1 for the air superiority.

Before each combat starts, match each fighter in the combat with one enemy bomber. At the end of the first round of combat, remove that bomber from combat. It no longer rolls dice to try to score hits, and it can no longer be taken as a casualty. This represents bomber pilots’ efforts to avoid interceptors by flying high, flying fast, and then going home. The bomber can be returned to a friendly territory as normal during the non-combat move. If, in any given territory, you have more bombers than your enemy has fighters, your ‘excess’ bombers participate in the entire combat as normal.

To help adjust for the increased mobility of fighters and for their ability to preferentially target (expensive) planes, the combat value of a fighter is reduced to a “2” on offense and a “3” on defense.
B

Many ways of figurating air-to-air combat in general combat

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• • • baron Münchhausen

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Thanks for answering.
I hesitated on making it a poll but the choices are still fuzzy and can depend on specific houserules instead of a generic mechanism.

And sometimes, the answer cannot fit in a single point.

You just introduce two kinds of air combat according to the grounds setting or the naval setting of the battle. Already outside the boxes.

To summarize in a different fashion:
Against ground: 1 single air-to-air phase with as many combat cycles required to get total air supremacy. Then regular combat follow.

Air phase values:
Fighter A1 D2 M4-5 cost 8?
Tactical Bomber A1 D1 M4-5 cost 10?
Strategic Bomber A1 D0 M6-7 cost 12

In naval combat:
All units has their OOB value
Fighter A3 D4 M4-5 any hit is applied to an enemy’s aircraft first if targeted,
Tactical Bomber A3-4 D3 M4-5, any hit is applied to capital warship first (Carrier, Battleship and Cruiser, if targeted)
Strategic Bomber A4 D1 M6-7, any hit can be applied to Submarines first.

1- All aircrafts roll dice, and target casualties.
2- Then all ships roll dice, owner choose casualties.
3- Remove casualties.

Is it right?

Here is the poll:
4 ways to play aircrafts dogfighting inside G40 or 1942.2 ?
November 26, 2014, 09:17:43 pm
http://www.axisandallies.org/forums/index.php?topic=34875.msg1351379#msg1351379
B

Alternate Air combat in OOB G40 with 2 planes Carrier, 1942.1 and 1942.2

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• • • baron Münchhausen

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@Baron:

Do you think this last HR makes Carriers too much vulnerable against Subs if they put 1 Fg and 1 TcB on board?

Does this cutting in half the defensive power of Carriers against Subs should be balance by a no restriction against Subs for Tactical Bombers?

TcB A3-4D4M4C10 can hit Subs anytime by themselves. No need of Destroyers.

But StB units (any number) can only hit submarine units when paired to at least 1 destroyer unit.

Who knows? Some ideas to judge this situation?

Don’t you think it could help simplify the Rules on the subs vs aircrafts?

Because, there is only StBs needing DDs on offence which can be part of any naval combat with Subs ?

Actually, this line of thinking pushed me further away.

Once fighters can no more hit any Subs, I thought why not simply allows both TcB and StB to hit subs without the need of destroyers.
But, at the same time, keeping all the actual stuff on DD and subs.
That would meant that any type of bombers attacking subs only in a given SZ should not be able to do any harm to them since subs keep their Surprise phase and can submerge prior to the regular combat phase. In other terms, DDs will still be needed on many circumstances to get a chance to hit subs.

So with Fg unable to hit them and the Subs submerge still very efficient, giving Bombers the ability to hit subs will not doom them.

That’s how I see things, am I under a false impression?
Do you think it is playable?
Because, it could be much simpler to play subs vs planes than the actual OOB.
Hope you can leave a comment.
Thanks.
I

Simple solution for long Global 1940 games

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• • • Imperious Leader

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Its like Tank Blitzing. If the SZ has an enemy token but unoccupied, IN NCM you must stop. Only in combat can you blitz into two empty zones.

The map will look more like a history book showing the control of sea zones. I guess you need more tokens.
E

Air-Sea Combat

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• • • Emperor_Taiki

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yah, so planes should be able to target other planes, tanks and artillery becasue thats what they were devistating against.

If i was defending against only infantry I would rather have the machineguns and autocannons of the aircraft given to my infantry rather than have them used on the planes. Why would u not do this?
U

Does anyone do Combat Air Patroles in Non-Pacific A&A Games?

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• • • Upside-down_Turtle

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I never do CAP, mostly because I don’t think about it. The few times I do I don’t want to risk my fighters. I’ve never seen it done in any games I’ve played. I do think it could be useful so I’ve thought about adding it again to my house rules but I am striving for simplicity right now.
?

Something from long ago…

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• • • Anonymous

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I see k_'s point, but disagree.

If the US player builds in WUS and moves units to WCan, then ECan then trans them to UK or Nor/Fin he protects Alaska and Mexico.

Besides, its turn 3 before UK/US can take much in the Pacific. Look what Japan can chew off of Asia…SFE(2), Chi(2), Sin(2), and Ind(3) or Yak(2)at least.

And if UK/US are going for Pacific isles then Germany is having a field day in Africa and v USSR!!

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