The Atomic bomb was in WWII - this is a WWII game. How is it useless? I’d say your comment is what is useless.
Yes but only at the end of WWII.
Japan already lost the war anyway…
That’s why is useless.
As an American player, you’re realy a bad player if you need an Atomic bomb…
The dropping of the Atomic bomb had the same effect on Japan as Berlin being taken by the Russians had on Germany. How is the military attack that ended a nations will to fight useless?
As an American player, you’re realy a bad player if you need an Atomic bomb…
No one “needs” the Atom Bomb to win, just as the USA could have invaded Japan with conventional land forces and won. But the Atom Bomb was a part of history and could make interesting “what if” game results - like what if Germany got the A-bomb first? These things can be played out in Axis and Allies for fun. I have classified the A-bomb as an “end war” tech because whoever gets it and starts dropping it will likely cause others to surrender, unless they get it too. It should surface only at the end of the game, as a nail in the coffin or as a last gasp hope.
Here’s a thought: given the limited yield of WWII A-bombs, perhaps an A-bomb house rule should give players the option of using it either as a strategic nuke against a city or as a tactical nuke against enemy ground forces. In the latter case, there could be a special table giving modified defense rolls for the targets, reflecting the greater ability of tanks and APCs to survive nuclear explosions (as long as they’re not too close) than other units.
As an American player, you’re realy a bad player if you need an Atomic bomb…
A smart American player would have invaded Japan and sustained 1 million plus causalities. :roll:
what about instead of destroying an Major IC have them downgrade them to fully damaged Minor IC
It should be from factory to nothing. The morale of the nation falls and the rule needs to be simple and effective results.
Downgrading a factory means nothing
I think downgrading a factory would be huge. either you put 3 units a turn out from your capital or send the 20 ipcs to re upgrade it. Throwing 20 ipcs down the drain just to get back the factory you already had is beyond suck. That and to 2 Atomic attacks (and it can be argued that in game terms would be one) did not by any means destroy all the industrial capacity of the Japanese home islands.
Well next turn you upgrade back to major.
and have it knocked right back down to a minor
On the subject of the battlefield use of tactical nukes, I once read an article about Task Force Razor, an armoured formation which was assigned to carry out a simulated exploitation of a real nuclear explosion (the Apple 2 shot of the Operation Teapot series) in the Nevada desert in 1955. It’s mentioned very briefly in the Wikipedia article on the Desert Rock Exercises. As I recall, the scenario assumed that the A-bomb had been dropped on an enemy line; the task force’s job was to drive through the gap which had been created by the blast. I don’t remember the details, but the maneuver took place quite soon after the explosion and passed close to (but not directly over) ground zero.
@rjpeters70:
Oh yeah, that kind of stuff happened all the time. There’s great footage of Chinese cavalry (real cavalry, the kind on horses) charging into a nuclear blast to exploit a hole in the adversary lines. Both the riders and the horses wore gas masks.Â
Goodness gracious. Compared with what you’ve just described, the few bits of footage I’ve seen of 1950s-era US troops waiting inside their parked tanks and APCs for the flash and concussion to pass before starting to move seem pretty tame.
I think you should not be able to combine a nuclear attack with a conventional, as all combat in AA is considered to be simultaneous, you are not going to be running your infantry into a mushroom cloud. ANY movement into the zone should have be on the next turn after the initial cloud clears.
@Der:
I think you should not be able to combine a nuclear attack with a conventional, as all combat in AA is considered to be simultaneous, you are not going to be running your infantry into a mushroom cloud. ANY movement into the zone should have be on the next turn after the initial cloud clears.
At the time they had no idea that running there infantry into mushroom clouds was a bad idea. I even read a top ranking American general wanted to Nuke the beaches so to ease the landings.
The recent A-bomb rules are too complicated. Larry would never have such rules.
Just concentrate on economic effects, not blowing up entire armies and navy floating in one small area. KISS
KISS is why I said downgrading IC
OK.
you also need an effect that effects Victory directly. Makes it harder to win if the enemy has this weapon. VC is the deciding factor for wining or losing the game, not losing a Major and going to a Minor which means you can place 3 units after paying 6 IPC. The effects of this weapon destroy the resolve to carry on the war. It effects the national morale in that they see the enemy has a great advantage of destroying entire cities and killing 100,000 people in seconds. It is a Sword of Damocles that cannot be overcome. The resolve of the nation sinks as does the entire war effort.
Just have it effect Victory conditions, not freaking rolling for destroying countless armies in a giant area when the effects would be of a small area. You drop a bomb on Germany and it has 12 infantry, 4 tanks, 3 artillery, and countless other units. Even if targeted against an armor division, you might take it out but to assume all these other units are stuck in the same 5 x 5 mile area is silly.
@Imperious:
OK.
you also need an effect that effects Victory directly. Makes it harder to win if the enemy has this weapon. VC is the deciding factor for wining or losing the game, not losing a Major and going to a Minor which means you can place 3 units after paying 6 IPC. The effects of this weapon destroy the resolve to carry on the war. It effects the national morale in that they see the enemy has a great advantage of destroying entire cities and killing 100,000 people in seconds. It is a Sword of Damocles that cannot be overcome. The resolve of the nation sinks as does the entire war effort.
Just have it effect Victory conditions, not freaking rolling for destroying countless armies in a giant area when the effects would be of a small area. You drop a bomb on Germany and it has 12 infantry, 4 tanks, 3 artillery, and countless other units. Even if targeted against an armor division, you might take it out but to assume all these other units are stuck in the same 5 x 5 mile area is silly.
For once, I agree with IL that simple is better here. Just make it permanently add a VC, and maybe do max damage to the IC. Being a able to permanently take control of a VC without even going through the ordeal of invading and holding the tt is a huge advantage, and it accurately depicts what the US was trying to do with their atom bomb.
@Der:
I think you should not be able to combine a nuclear attack with a conventional, as all combat in AA is considered to be simultaneous, you are not going to be running your infantry into a mushroom cloud. ANY movement into the zone should have be on the next turn after the initial cloud clears.
At the time they had no idea that running there infantry into mushroom clouds was a bad idea. I even read a top ranking American general wanted to Nuke the beaches so to ease the landings.
I looked it up last night it was United States Army Chief of Staff General Marshal that had that idea. And holy crap that’s a long title he earned for himself
I looked it up last night it was United States Army Chief of Staff General Marshal that had that idea. And holy crap that’s a long title he earned for himself
When the US got into (or was about to get into) WWII and decided that it needed a 5-star rank (so that the top US military officers could relate as equals to Field Marshalls and other 5-star officers in Allied countries), George Marshall allegedly recommended that the term “General of the Army” be used rather than “Field Marshall” because he didn’t want to end up being called “Marshall Marshall”.
