New A&A chaos game C vs S

[Grendal]

TripleA Turn Summary for game: World War II Global 1940 Alpha 3, version: 3.7

Game History

Round: 6

Purchase Units - Italians
            Italians buy 1 battleship, 1 infantry and 1 mech_infantry; Remaining resources: 0 PUs;

Combat Move - Italians
            1 armour moved from Malta to 96 Sea Zone
            1 infantry moved from Malta to 96 Sea Zone
            1 infantry moved from Ukraine to Western Ukraine
            1 artillery moved from Ukraine to Western Ukraine
            1 infantry moved from Eastern Poland to Western Ukraine
            3 infantry moved from Central Mongolia to Tsagaan Olom
            1 infantry moved from Dzavhan to Tsagaan Olom
            1 armour, 1 infantry and 1 transport moved from 96 Sea Zone to 97 Sea Zone
            1 destroyer moved from 95 Sea Zone to 97 Sea Zone
            2 fighters moved from Tobruk to Algeria
            1 fighter moved from Southern Italy to Algeria
            1 infantry moved from Northern Italy to Southern France
            1 mech_infantry moved from Northern Italy to Normandy Bordeaux

Combat - Italians
            Battle in Tsagaan Olom
                Italians attack with 4 infantry
                Russians defend with 1 infantry
                    Italians roll dice for 4 infantry in Tsagaan Olom, round 2 :  0/4 hits
                    Russians roll dice for 1 infantry in Tsagaan Olom, round 2 :  1/1 hits
                    1 infantry owned by the Italians lost in Tsagaan Olom
                    Italians roll dice for 3 infantry in Tsagaan Olom, round 3 :  1/3 hits
                    Russians roll dice for 1 infantry in Tsagaan Olom, round 3 :  0/1 hits
                    1 infantry owned by the Russians lost in Tsagaan Olom
                Italians win, taking Tsagaan Olom from Russians with 3 infantry remaining. Battle score for attacker is 0
                Casualties for Russians: 1 infantry
                Casualties for Italians: 1 infantry

Non Combat Move - Italians
            Turning on Edit Mode
            EDIT: Adding units owned by Japanese to Tsagaan Olom: 1 infantry
            EDIT: Turning off Edit Mode
            1 infantry moved from 97 Sea Zone to Greece
            1 armour moved from 97 Sea Zone to Greece

Place Units - Italians
            1 battleship placed in 97 Sea Zone
            1 infantry and 1 mech_infantry placed in Northern Italy

Turn Complete - Italians
            Italians collect 16 PUs; end with 16 PUs total
            Objective Italians 2 Roman Empire: Italians met a national objective for an additional 5 PUs; end with 21 PUs
            Objective Italians 1 Control The Mediterranean: Italians met a national objective for an additional 5 PUs; end with 26 PUs

[pr0c3ss]

Anzak
Rolling 1d6:
(1)

[pr0c3ss]

japan
Rolling 1d6:
(6)

Smolensk
Rolling 3d6:
(5, 5, 6)

[pr0c3ss]

TripleA Turn Summary for game: World War II Global 1940 Alpha 3, version: 3.7

Game History

Round: 6

Purchase Units - ANZAC
            ANZAC buy 1 destroyer and 1 transport; Remaining resources: 0 PUs;

Combat Move - ANZAC
            1 infantry moved from New South Wales to 62 Sea Zone
            1 artillery moved from New South Wales to 62 Sea Zone
            1 artillery, 1 infantry and 1 transport moved from 35 Sea Zone to 6 Sea Zone
            1 infantry moved from 6 Sea Zone to Japan
            1 artillery moved from 6 Sea Zone to Japan
            2 destroyers moved from 33 Sea Zone to 6 Sea Zone
            1 fighter moved from Philippines to Guam
            1 infantry moved from British Columbia to Alaska
                  Americans take Alaska from Japanese
            1 infantry moved from Karelia to Finland
            3 infantry moved from Belarus to Smolensk
            1 infantry moved from Suiyuyan to Chahar
                  Chinese take Chahar from Japanese
            1 infantry moved from Suiyuyan to Shensi
                  Chinese take Shensi from Japanese
            1 artillery, 1 infantry and 1 transport moved from 62 Sea Zone to 33 Sea Zone
            1 fighter moved from Malaya to Yunnan

Combat - ANZAC
            Battle in Japan
                ANZAC attack with 1 artillery and 1 infantry
                Japanese defend with 1 airfield, 1 factory_major, 1 harbour and 1 infantry
                    ANZAC roll dice for 1 artillery and 1 infantry in Japan, round 2 :  2/2 hits
                    Japanese roll dice for 1 infantry in Japan, round 2 :  0/1 hits
                    1 infantry owned by the Japanese lost in Japan
                ANZAC captures 78PUs while taking Japanese capital
                ANZAC converts factory_major into different units
                ANZAC win, taking Japan from Japanese with 1 artillery and 1 infantry remaining. Battle score for attacker is 3
                Casualties for Japanese: 1 infantry
            Battle in Smolensk
                ANZAC attack with 3 infantry
                Japanese defend with 1 armour
                    ANZAC roll dice for 3 infantry in Smolensk, round 2 :  0/3 hits
                    Japanese roll dice for 1 armour in Smolensk, round 2 :  1/1 hits
                    1 infantry owned by the ANZAC lost in Smolensk
                    ANZAC roll dice for 2 infantry in Smolensk, round 3 :  0/2 hits
                    Japanese roll dice for 1 armour in Smolensk, round 3 :  1/1 hits
                    1 infantry owned by the ANZAC lost in Smolensk
                    ANZAC roll dice for 1 infantry in Smolensk, round 4 :  1/1 hits
                    Japanese roll dice for 1 armour in Smolensk, round 4 :  0/1 hits
                    1 armour owned by the Japanese lost in Smolensk
                ANZAC win, taking Smolensk from Japanese with 1 infantry remaining. Battle score for attacker is 0
                Casualties for Japanese: 1 armour
                Casualties for ANZAC: 2 infantry

Non Combat Move - ANZAC

Place Units - ANZAC
            1 destroyer and 1 transport placed in 62 Sea Zone

Turn Complete - ANZAC
            ANZAC collect 18 PUs; end with 96 PUs total
            Trigger ANZAC 1 Control Original And Malaya: ANZAC met a national objective for an additional 5 PUs; end with 101 PUs
            Turning on Edit Mode
            EDIT: Adding units owned by French to Japan: 1 infantry
            EDIT: Adding units owned by French to Smolensk: 1 infantry
            EDIT: Turning off Edit Mode

[pr0c3ss]

8-) :mrgreen:

[Grendal]

The towel is being thrown in. It is flying through the air. And now the towel is in the thrown in position.

I give up.

good game carl. I should have put one tank in Japan. I was too greedy.

[Grendal]

ok Chris. Start post game analysis. I love this variant. It really spices up things. tweeks needed here and there, but overall it’s great.

[Make_It_Round]

@Grendal:

The towel is being thrown in. It is flying through the air. And now the towel is in the thrown in position.

I give up.

good game carl. I should have put one tank in Japan. I was too greedy.

Yeah, I saw the ANZAC second wave attack coming, but was careful not to alert either of you to it.

It was a knife-edge game.

Russia was on the ropes, but by no means out.

And even though Japan COULD re-take Tokyo, they would lose the initiative quite considerably since the US would (re)gain all of the IPCs yielded from the ‘Masterstroke’ attacks.

I was impressed how quickly America got into the game in Round 6: expelling the invaders, finally getting its teeth sunk into Italy, and threatening a capital take all on the same turn…

Great game to watch, as well as to moderate.

[Make_It_Round]

Does the towel being thrown in resemble this hatchimaki?  :wink:

[Grendal]

Surrender is never honourable. I need a dull knife and a quit place to carve up my entrails.

[Make_It_Round]

@Grendal:

ok Chris. Start post game analysis. I love this variant. It really spices up things. tweeks needed here and there, but overall it’s great.

Thanks Carl!

Would you and Matt be willing to run one more playtest on this thread? Maybe you could switch sides and start over? Let me know if so.

I’d like you to experience the wild variations from game to game, and also on my end I need to tighten up the ‘instructions’ to players in the ruleset. Eventually, the goal is to eliminate the ‘moderator’ role from this game, but we’re just not there yet. Some of what I thought would be obvious needed to be broken down in much simpler terms: even the basic yet crucial distinction between the game’s ‘turns’ and ‘rounds’ needs to be fully understood by players before they start.

So that’s something I can improve right off the bat.

Let me assure you that you’ve seen not even a quarter of the strangeness I’ve crammed into this variant. Some of it was meant for the board game, which I’ve had to scrap and / or replace to work better with the online interface. So, if I take a little time when a ‘6’ gets rolled, it’s because I’m trying to figure out the fairest and cleanest way to adapt the existing concepts.

I won’t spoil anything, because I’d like to keep some surprises for you both next game.

Let me evaluate the mechanics that have been revealed so far:

Zombie-World: Meh. I give this one a 6/10. Although it has potential, it’s fairly complex and doesn’t add much to the table in terms of raw fun. I need to modify it in some way, or drop it in the next iteration.

Spore-Bomb: We never saw this in action. My intuition tells me it would be an @$$-r@ping if employed properly. But who knows?

Ceasefire: 10/10. Simple, doesn’t unbalance the game or require a lot of book-keeping or memorization. Its power depends on the skill and judgement of the player using it. It’s purely defensive, so it prolongs the game instead of killing a player off, which means that no one would probably see this as unfair. I think it was used to good effect in the game we just completed.

Neutral Politicking: 8/10. It opens up new parts of the map for action, and yields a nice amount of surprise while keeping book-keeping to a bare minimum. Could be unbalancing, but only if the European neutrals are randomly rolled.

Chinese Aid: 5/10. Not a lot of fun, and didn’t affect the game at all. However, the game needs small effects as well as big effects, and when a small nation rolls a bonus for itself, you basically wouldn’t expect much more of it. I guess in other games it could be different. Eh. We’ll probably keep it for now, and see.

Storms: 7/10. This has a nice flavor. I’d originally planned for the storms to move around the board, but then I realized it’d be crazy to keep track of that every turn. It postpones certain attacks, freezes other units in places where they’d rather not be, and has other interesting effects. I wish there was a way to ‘mark’ the affected areas on the board, but I’m unable to edit in markers on this program. I think that once you’re used to this effect as players, you will begin to see clever ways to exploit the changes in the board the storms create.

Sabotage: 10/10. This was very easy to do with this interface, and very flavorful. Frustrating for the affected player, and a joy for his enemy. You really start to wish there was a way to kill those bloody spies on your home soil. I will make this effect PERMANENT in the next game, and also provide some counter-espionage to get that monkey off your back if you’re unlucky enough to roll it.

Strategic Masterstroke: 7/10. I think the basic idea is good, but I need to change it somehow so that it’s not an utter and complete BEATING for the other player. Maybe only give mechanized units the second attack? Maybe only give 3 territories the right to overrun, instead of the entire army? I dunno. Suggestions welcome. But it definitely has to be downgraded.

Finally, let me reflect on one general concern I have.

I worry about complexity creep in this variant. We had 8 Chaos Events pop up [out of a possible 54] over 49 turns. That’s pretty much exactly the number of developments you’d statistically expect in a game of this length. Nevertheless, the USA forgot their nation-specific boost from turn 1 by the time the game ended, and the zombie-generation business (and even eventually the chaos rolls themselves) was something which required frequent reminding and clarifying on all sides. The longer a game like this goes, the greater the possibility there is for players to get confused or burnt out under the strain of the extra rules. Thus, in the second edition of the rules, when I need to decide between concision and intrigue, concision will win in the majority of cases. Hopefully this will keep the game fun and quick-moving, while still preserving the ‘spice’ of playing out World War 2 in the m0therf@cking Twilight Zone.

Your thoughts on these matters, and your ratings of the mechanics above, would be highly valued.

Looking forward to the next installation of this epic battle!

Best,

Chris

[Grendal]

Ok I’m in for another round of tales from the crypt. I’m Allies so I’ll wait for Carl to do his turn. I save and post the game here. So Stay tuned Carl for the post. As for reflections and feedback. I would like to state them in numbered form below.

1. Chinese zombies. They should be avoided unless you can get them to move in Europe or Africa or anywhere else beyond Chinese territory and Burma. May I suggest French zombies as default when there is no other choice. UK Pacific can get them where applicable but the Brits Empire homeboys should get the default.

2. Storms. The length of the storms made sense once you clarified turns. May I suggest using neutral white territory when storm is blowing, and for sea zones just put a white transport there. Something with no offence or defence in case there are other naval units there.

3. Zombie initial placement. If a player rolls a four, five, or six after having two or more zombies to place then he can upgrade to mech inf. at the cost of trading in two zombies to get the upgrade. You caneven go one further and the player can trade in three for a zombie armoured unit. eg. 2 zombies = 1 mech inf, 3 zombies = armoured unit

That’s all I can think of for now. My guts are bleeding and I will lose consciousness soon. But not before I post the game here.

Furious Furor Zombie Lord

Matt

[Grendal]

Go Carl and don’t forget the Nation specific Chaos Roll.

Go Carl.tsvg

[Make_It_Round]

@Grendal:

Go Carl and don’t forget the Nation specific Chaos Roll.

Don’t forget to unclick the ‘Remove Tech Tokens After Rolling’ button in the Options menu… That way, tech development will be worthwhile to pursue.

[pr0c3ss]

Will get onto it now.  Not much to add as you have both kindly wrapped up any possible blunders.

Will agree with there being a problem of keeping up with whats going on.  I said to Matt this morning that I was unaware of when the storm would end, forgot about US gaining a 5/6 roll zombie benefit and there was probably so much more I forgot!  As suggested by Matt, may be a good idea to keep a little document/file open when playing to keep track of everything, or as I suggested every forum page or so should have a chaos summary.

The Chinese zombie issue I faced.  The British gain I suppose only 50% bu spawning immobile zombies.  They act as merely defensive units.

Apart from the above, this variant is great

[pr0c3ss]

Ger
Rolling 1d6:
(4)

[Make_It_Round]

@Grendal:

1. Chinese zombies. They should be avoided unless you can get them to move in Europe or Africa or anywhere else beyond Chinese territory and Burma. May I suggest French zombies as default when there is no other choice. UK Pacific can get them where applicable but the Brits Empire homeboys should get the default.

2. Storms. The length of the storms made sense once you clarified turns. May I suggest using neutral white territory when storm is blowing, and for sea zones just put a white transport there. Something with no offence or defence in case there are other naval units there.

3. Zombie initial placement. If a player rolls a four, five, or six after having two or more zombies to place then he can upgrade to mech inf. at the cost of trading in two zombies to get the upgrade. You caneven go one further and the player can trade in three for a zombie armoured unit. eg. 2 zombies = 1 mech inf, 3 zombies = armoured unit

Thanks for the feedback, Matthew!

1. I like the idea of making all Allied Zombies French. Simple and clean, and it makes the French move worth taking at the end of the day.

2. Neutral territories (and Chinese transports) are a good way of marking storms. Plus! It means you can’t collect income from the territory while the storm is raging, which makes a lot of sense. Nice one.

3. This suggestion complicates an already awkward set of zombie rules that I’m trying to simplify. Maybe if it was ‘Voltron World’ or something, I could justify combining / transforming units into other units, but otherwise nope. The ONLY way I could see this working is if you rolled for each destroyed unit individually, and then on a result of 6 that specific unit returned as a zombie: that way, you could have Zombie Corps mechs, tanks, artillery, and anti-air units, on top of the regular infantry. Still, the idea is that the Zombie Corps are free units, and as zombies, they should be slower and less effective than regular troops… a kind of creepy garrison or second-line unit. So… no, I don’t think it’s worth the extra book-keeping and/or flavor disjoint.

[Make_It_Round]

@pr0c3ss:

Will get onto it now.  Not much to add as you have both kindly wrapped up any possible blunders.

Will agree with there being a problem of keeping up with whats going on.  I said to Matt this morning that I was unaware of when the storm would end, forgot about US gaining a 5/6 roll zombie benefit and there was probably so much more I forgot!  As suggested by Matt, may be a good idea to keep a little document/file open when playing to keep track of everything, or as I suggested every forum page or so should have a chaos summary.

The Chinese zombie issue I faced.  The British gain I suppose only 50% bu spawning immobile zombies.  They act as merely defensive units.

Apart from the above, this variant is great

To help you both keep track of the various events, I’ll paste graphics in any posts where a new rule’s been introduced.

The open word file is probably a good idea, too…

[pr0c3ss]

Scramble?

scr3467347.tsvg

[Grendal]

No scrambles across the board. Do your German Chaos roll Carl. Sheesh! Right away, first thing you forgot. :roll: