13L G40 Vold vs Amon-Sul (Allies +12) No tech

[Amon-Sul]

as for sbr

when attacking multiple facilities or attacking with various types of aircraft (bombers and tacs)

u need to roll it here on the forum manually beacuse triple a is wrong and is allowing the attacker to choose the casualties which is forbiden. u have to roll for each building and each type of units attacking separately.

but if u attack only lets say harbour with 2 bombers than u dont have to.

but in all multiple cases either buildings or planes of various types u have to roll it here manually.

please re-roll the sbr from the begining starting from aa guns

thank U :)

[Vold]

I assume you are referring to my ability to pick the casualty?

I’m not familiar with this being a problem.  please post the rule reference so I can get more educated then we’ll figure the best way to go - a reroll may not be the answer as the dice have been cast, so to speak.

[Vold]

I found the reference.  On this rule book here (http://www.wizards.com/avalonhill/rules/A&A_Europe_1940_2ndEd_Rulebook_LR.pdf).

These two passages were relevant;
A base may be both strategically and
tactically bombed at the same time.

Each complex and base rolls one die against each bomber
directly attacking it (regardless of the number of
bombers). For each “1” rolled, a bomber of the attacker’s
choice is immediately removed.

So it appears that each target rolls separately, but not each plane type per target.

That being clarified, here are the options that I see we can pursue;

a) We keep the combat and rolls as they are, but roll a single ‘1d5’ in forum to determine which plane was hit (1-3 bombers, 4-5 tacs). the plane that was hit would have it’s die removed from the damage.

b) re-roll the AA and SBR damage from the beginning, but remove the tacs from the fight.  I only included them due to my misunderstanding of the rule - I actually have little interest in bombing the airfield.

c) Leave things as they are and apply the rule properly from here on out.

I’m up for either course of action - or do you have an alternative?

V

[Amon-Sul]

U should replay German turn from the begining then.

Decide which combat moves will U make, send which airrcraft U wish, but watch out, because each building has it s own aa gun. And tacs cant bombard ICs.

U have to do the sbr here unless U re attacking only one building.

We have to play by the rules, and sometimes triple a does not follow them. U have a thread of Gamerman with all the mistakes Triple a  does.

In other words we have to take option b of yours. REstart , replay the German turn from the begining.

[Vold]

I’m all for playing by the rules - this rule is new to me and I’ll be sure to incorporate it from here on out.

However, there is no need to reset and replay the German turn from the beginning.  The infraction only affects the Moscow SBR.  Any adjustments to that combat have no effect on any other combat.

I’m willing to either pull the tacs and redo the Moscow SBR (the tacs will not participate in any other combat), or roll a die and randomly choose which plane was shot down.

I’ll let you choose which course of action we take.

V

[Amon-Sul]

It affects all because u had one casuatly from all those bombings and it was tac but  maybe it should be bomber.

and more important how do we know which unit (attacking which building) was destroyed by aa gun

and then how can we now which amount of dmg was to be taken on which building.

i think U should just replay the turn, because it is simply too confusing.

[Vold]

It’s not that difficult at all to fix the issue and keep the integrity of the turn.

From the SBR run in the last posted file:

• AA fire in Russia : 5,3,4,4,1
  Bombing raid in Russia rolls: 3,8,5 and causes: 16 damage to unit: factory_major
  Bombing raid in Russia rolls: 2 and

causes: 2 damage to unit: airfield

Five planes were sent and one was shot down.  If you enumerate the bombers as 1,2 and 3, and the tacs as 4 and 5, a simple 1d5 roll determines the one to get shot down.

There are still 4 damage dice, it’s only a matter of shifting them accordingly.  If a bomber is selected, the last bomber damage dice (5) becomes tac damage, loses its +2 modifier and shifts to the airfield.

This roll identifies the plane hit:

:roll 1d5:

continued in next post…

[Vold]

whoops - here’s the bomber dice

:roll 1d5:

[Vold]

Rolling 1d5:
(3)

darn typos

[Vold]

The roll is a 3 - according to the enumeration a bomber was hit.

Now the ‘5’ damage dice (the 3rd damage dice in order) shifts to a tac bomber.

Result:
1 bomber hit
Factory +7 points
Airfield -5 points

All in all not a bad day for you.

Unfortunately it’s a PITA to make the adjustments since the German turn is over.  Please make the adjustments on Russia’s turn (remote a bomber from Novo).

Now can we continue?

V

[Amon-Sul]

What is PITA?

Can U please make the changes? It is simply too confusing for me. U can even start Russian turn and just give me the map.

I trust U , but it is just too confusing for me. I hope Triple A guys will solve this thing soon, and watch out for future SBR runs. This is probably the biggest deal with Triple A now. All other minor mistakes are more easily handled.

[Amon-Sul]

@Vold:

The roll is a 3 - according to the enumeration a bomber was hit.

Now the ‘5’ damage dice (the 3rd damage dice in order) shifts to a tac bomber.

Result:
1 bomber hit
Factory +7 points
Airfield -5 points

All in all not a bad day for you.

Unfortunately it’s a PITA to make the adjustments since the German turn is over.  Please make the adjustments on Russia’s turn (remote a bomber from Novo).

Now can we continue?

V

**From the SBR run in the last posted file:

AA fire in Russia : 5,3,4,4,1
    Bombing raid in Russia rolls: 3,8,5 and causes: 16 damage to unit: factory_major
    Bombing raid in Russia rolls: 2 and**

should not it be

FActory +5
Airfield -4(2+5 =7=6 the maximum dmg)

comparing to primary SBR run of urs?

[Vold]

Here you go.

I was incorrect - The bombing rolls were 3, 8 and 5 but have a +2 modifier (hence the ‘8’ roll).  I added the modifier when I indicated the factory would be -7, but it was already added.

So removing the ‘5’ die would only remove 5 from the factory, and only add 3 to the airfield.

Adjustments are made in the attached file, and a bomber has been removed.

by the way, PITA = Pain In The A$$  :wink:

V

[Amon-Sul]

TripleA Turn Summary for game: World War II Global 1940 2nd Edition, version: 3.7

Game History

Round: 5

Politics - Russians
            Turning on Edit Mode
            EDIT: Changing unit bombing damage for these Russians owned units to: factory_major = 11
            EDIT: Changing unit bombing damage for these Russians owned units to: airfield = 5
            EDIT: Removing units owned by Germans from Novgorod: 1 bomber
            EDIT: Turning off Edit Mode

Purchase Units - Russians
            Russians repair 6 damage on 6 factory_majors; Remaining resources: 17 PUs;
            Russians buy 2 artilleries and 3 infantry; Remaining resources: 0 PUs;

Combat Move - Russians
            2 mech_infantrys moved from Samara to Volgograd
            2 fighters and 1 tactical_bomber moved from Tsinghai to Volgograd
            11 artilleries and 37 infantry moved from Russia to Bryansk

Combat - Russians
            Battle in Volgograd
                Russians attack with 2 fighters, 2 mech_infantrys and 1 tactical_bomber
                Germans defend with 1 armour, 1 factory_minor and 1 mech_infantry
                Russians win, taking Volgograd from Germans with 2 fighters, 1 mech_infantry and 1 tactical_bomber remaining. Battle score for attacker is 6
                Casualties for Germans: 1 armour and 1 mech_infantry
                Casualties for Russians: 1 mech_infantry
            Battle in Bryansk
                Russians attack with 11 artilleries and 37 infantry
                Germans defend with 5 armour, 7 artilleries, 21 infantry and 7 mech_infantrys
                10 artilleries owned by the Russians retreated to Russia
                Germans win with 5 armour and 7 artilleries remaining. Battle score for attacker is -24
                Casualties for Germans: 21 infantry and 7 mech_infantrys
                Casualties for Russians: 1 artillery and 37 infantry

Non Combat Move - Russians
            2 fighters and 1 tactical_bomber moved from Volgograd to Russia
            1 infantry moved from Timguska to Urals
            2 aaGuns and 17 infantry moved from Timguska to Novosibirsk

Place Units - Russians
            2 artilleries and 3 infantry placed in Russia

Turn Complete - Russians
            Russians collect 15 PUs; end with 15 PUs total

Territory Summary for Russians :

Urals : 1 infantry
    Russia : 5 aaGuns, 1 airfield, 12 artilleries, 1 factory_major, 2 fighters, 3 infantry and 1 tactical_bomber
    Novosibirsk : 2 aaGuns and 17 infantry
    Volgograd : 1 factory_minor and 1 mech_infantry
    114 Sea Zone : 1 submarine
    91 Sea Zone : 1 submarine

[Vold]

TripleA Turn Summary for game: World War II Global 1940 2nd Edition, version: 3.7

Game History

Round: 5

Purchase Units - Japanese
            Japanese buy 1 airfield, 2 destroyers and 5 infantry; Remaining resources: 6 SuicideAttackTokens; 0 PUs;

Combat Move - Japanese
            1 infantry moved from Korea to 6 Sea Zone
            1 infantry moved from Japan to 6 Sea Zone
            2 infantry and 1 transport moved from 6 Sea Zone to 26 Sea Zone
            2 infantry moved from 26 Sea Zone to Hawaiian Islands
            1 destroyer moved from 6 Sea Zone to 25 Sea Zone
            1 bomber moved from Japan to 25 Sea Zone
            2 infantry moved from Jehol to Anhwe
            1 fighter and 1 tactical_bomber moved from Chahar to Anhwe
            1 infantry moved from Sakha to Buryatia
                  Japanese take Buryatia from Russians
            1 armour moved from Siberia to Buryatia
            1 infantry moved from Kwangsi to Hunan
                  Japanese take Hunan from Chinese

Combat - Japanese
            Japanese creates battle in territory 37 Sea Zone
            Battle in Anhwe
                Japanese attack with 1 fighter, 2 infantry and 1 tactical_bomber
                Chinese defend with 1 infantry
                Japanese win, taking 37 Sea Zone from UK_Pacific, taking Anhwe from Chinese with 1 fighter, 2 infantry and 1 tactical_bomber remaining. Battle score for attacker is 3
                Casualties for Chinese: 1 infantry
            Battle in 25 Sea Zone
                Japanese attack with 1 bomber and 1 destroyer
                Americans defend with 2 submarines
                Japanese win with 1 bomber remaining. Battle score for attacker is 4
                Casualties for Japanese: 1 destroyer
                Casualties for Americans: 2 submarines
            Battle in Hawaiian Islands

Non Combat Move - Japanese
            1 bomber moved from 25 Sea Zone to Japan
            1 transport moved from 35 Sea Zone to 34 Sea Zone
            1 infantry moved from Paulau Island to 34 Sea Zone
            1 infantry and 1 transport moved from 34 Sea Zone to 36 Sea Zone
            1 infantry moved from 36 Sea Zone to Hainan
            2 bombers moved from Chahar to Kwangsi
            4 fighters and 2 tactical_bombers moved from Kiangsi to Kwangsi
            1 aaGun moved from Chahar to Anhwe
            1 fighter and 1 tactical_bomber moved from Anhwe to Kwangsi
            2 tactical_bombers moved from Hainan to Kwangsi
            1 carrier, 2 destroyers, 1 fighter and 1 tactical_bomber moved from 35 Sea Zone to 36 Sea Zone
            1 destroyer moved from 6 Sea Zone to 36 Sea Zone
            1 submarine moved from 37 Sea Zone to 36 Sea Zone
            1 tactical_bomber moved from 36 Sea Zone to Kwangsi
            2 fighters moved from Hainan to Kwangsi

Place Units - Japanese
            3 infantry placed in Kwangtung
            1 airfield placed in Kwangsi
            2 infantry placed in Japan
            2 destroyers placed in 6 Sea Zone

Turn Complete - Japanese
            Total Cost from Convoy Blockades: 0
                Rolling for Convoy Blockade Damage in 43 Sea Zone. Rolls: 6,4
            Japanese collect 46 PUs; end with 46 PUs total
            Objective Japanese 3 Control Honolulu Or Sydney Or Calcutta Or Western United States: Japanese met a national objective for an additional 5 PUs; end with 51 PUs

[Amon-Sul]

the map

sada.tsvg

[Vold]

Ignore any dice rolls you may have received via email.  I had it in PBEM accidentally.

Scramble 3 fighters to sz 36.

Kamikaze 3 to each surface warship in sz 6

V

[Amon-Sul]

stupid program did not allow me to withdraw

[Amon-Sul]

TripleA Turn Summary for game: World War II Global 1940 2nd Edition, version: 3.7

Game History

Round: 5

Purchase Units - Americans
            Americans buy 1 armour, 1 artillery, 1 carrier, 2 destroyers, 4 infantry and 3 transports; Remaining resources: 0 PUs;

Combat Move - Americans
            1 artillery, 1 infantry and 1 transport moved from 44 Sea Zone to 35 Sea Zone
            1 artillery and 1 infantry moved from 35 Sea Zone to Philippines
            2 battleships, 2 carriers, 3 cruisers, 1 destroyer and 4 fighters moved from 44 Sea Zone to 35 Sea Zone
                  Americans take 35 Sea Zone from Japanese
            2 battleships, 2 carriers, 3 cruisers, 1 destroyer and 4 fighters moved from 35 Sea Zone to 36 Sea Zone
            1 armour moved from Aleutian Islands to 8 Sea Zone
            1 armour, 1 cruiser, 1 destroyer, 1 submarine and 1 transport moved from 8 Sea Zone to 6 Sea Zone
            1 armour moved from 6 Sea Zone to Korea
            1 bomber moved from British Columbia to 6 Sea Zone
            1 fighter moved from Johnston Island to 26 Sea Zone

Combat - Americans
            Japanese scrambles 3 units out of Kwangsi to defend against the attack in 36 Sea Zone
            Kamikaze Suicide Attack attacks 1 destroyer owned by the Americans scoring 1 hits.  Rolls: 2,5,3
            Kamikaze Suicide Attack attacks 1 cruiser owned by the Americans scoring 1 hits.  Rolls: 2,5,6
            Battle in 6 Sea Zone
                Americans attack with 1 bomber, 1 submarine and 1 transport
                Japanese defend with 2 destroyers
                Americans win, taking 6 Sea Zone from Japanese with 1 bomber, 1 submarine and 1 transport remaining. Battle score for attacker is 16
                Casualties for Japanese: 2 destroyers
            Battle in Korea
                Americans attack with 1 armour
                Japanese defend with 1 infantry
                Japanese win with no units remaining. Battle score for attacker is -3
                Casualties for Japanese: 1 infantry
                Casualties for Americans: 1 armour
            Battle in 26 Sea Zone
                Americans attack with 1 fighter
                Japanese defend with 1 transport
                Americans win with 1 fighter remaining. Battle score for attacker is 7
                Casualties for Japanese: 1 transport
            Battle in 36 Sea Zone
                ANZAC loiter and taunt with ; Americans attack with 2 battleships, 2 carriers, 3 cruisers, 1 destroyer and 2 fighters
                Japanese defend with 1 carrier, 3 destroyers, 4 fighters, 2 submarines and 2 transports
                Units damaged: 1 carrier owned by the Japanese
                Units damaged: 1 carrier owned by the Americans
                Americans win, taking 36 Sea Zone from Neutral with 2 battleships and 1 carrier remaining. Battle score for attacker is 26
                Casualties for Japanese: 1 carrier, 3 destroyers, 4 fighters, 2 submarines and 2 transports
                Casualties for Americans: 1 carrier, 3 cruisers, 1 destroyer and 2 fighters
            Battle in Philippines
                Americans attack with 1 artillery and 1 infantry
                Japanese defend with 1 airfield, 1 harbour and 1 infantry
                Japanese win with 1 infantry remaining. Battle score for attacker is -7
                Casualties for Americans: 1 artillery and 1 infantry

Non Combat Move - Americans
            1 battleship, 2 carriers and 2 fighters moved from 54 Sea Zone to 35 Sea Zone
            4 aaGuns, 8 infantry and 4 mech_infantrys moved from Central United States to 101 Sea Zone
            4 aaGuns, 8 infantry, 4 mech_infantrys and 8 transports moved from 101 Sea Zone to 91 Sea Zone
            4 aaGuns, 8 infantry and 4 mech_infantrys moved from 91 Sea Zone to Gibraltar
            1 fighter moved from 26 Sea Zone to Wake Island
            1 bomber moved from 6 Sea Zone to Amur

Place Units - Americans
            1 armour, 1 artillery and 4 infantry placed in Central United States
            Americans undo move 1.
            1 armour, 1 artillery and 2 infantry placed in Western United States
            2 transports placed in 10 Sea Zone
            1 destroyer placed in 10 Sea Zone
            1 carrier, 1 destroyer and 1 transport placed in 101 Sea Zone
            2 infantry placed in Central United States

Turn Complete - Americans
            Americans collect 49 PUs; end with 49 PUs total
            Objective Americans 3 Defense Obligations: Americans met a national objective for an additional 5 PUs; end with 54 PUs
            Objective Americans 1 Homeland: Americans met a national objective for an additional 10 PUs; end with 64 PUs

Territory Summary for Americans :

Guam : 1 airfield
    Wake Island : 1 airfield and 1 fighter
    Western United States : 1 airfield, 1 armour, 1 artillery, 1 factory_major, 1 harbour and 2 infantry
    Midway : 1 airfield
    Amur : 1 bomber
    44 Sea Zone : 1 flag
    36 Sea Zone : 1 flag, 2 battleships and 1 carrier
    35 Sea Zone : 1 flag, 1 battleship, 2 carriers and 1 transport
    10 Sea Zone : 1 destroyer and 2 transports
    6 Sea Zone : 1 flag, 1 submarine and 1 transport
    Central United States : 1 factory_major and 2 infantry
    Eastern United States : 1 airfield, 1 factory_major and 1 harbour
    Gibraltar : 4 aaGuns, 8 infantry and 4 mech_infantrys
    101 Sea Zone : 1 carrier, 1 destroyer and 1 transport
    91 Sea Zone : 8 transports

[Amon-Sul]

TripleA Turn Summary for game: World War II Global 1940 2nd Edition, version: 3.7

Game History

Round: 5

Purchase Units - Chinese
            Trigger Chinese Artillery Supplies: Chinese has their production frontier changed to: productionChinese_Burma_Road_Open
            Chinese buy 2 artilleries and 3 infantry; Remaining resources: 0 PUs;

Combat Move - Chinese
            1 infantry moved from Hopei to Chahar
                  Chinese take Chahar from Japanese
            1 artillery and 1 infantry moved from Kweichow to Hunan
            5 artilleries, 1 fighter and 5 infantry moved from Yunnan to Kwangsi

Combat - Chinese
            Battle in Hunan
                Chinese attack with 1 artillery and 1 infantry
                Japanese defend with 1 infantry
                Chinese win, taking Hunan from Japanese with 1 artillery and 1 infantry remaining. Battle score for attacker is 3
                Casualties for Japanese: 1 infantry
            Battle in Kwangsi
                Chinese attack with 5 artilleries, 1 fighter and 5 infantry
                Japanese defend with 1 airfield, 4 artilleries, 2 bombers, 4 fighters, 3 infantry and 6 tactical_bombers
                Japanese win with 2 artilleries, 4 fighters and 6 tactical_bombers remaining. Battle score for attacker is -4
                Casualties for Japanese: 2 artilleries, 2 bombers and 3 infantry
                Casualties for Chinese: 5 artilleries, 1 fighter and 5 infantry

Non Combat Move - Chinese

Place Units - Chinese
            1 infantry placed in Hopei
            1 infantry placed in Kweichow
            1 artillery and 1 infantry placed in Hunan
            1 artillery placed in Chahar

Turn Complete - Chinese
            Chinese collect 11 PUs; end with 11 PUs total
            Objective Chinese 1 Burma Road: Chinese met a national objective for an additional 6 PUs; end with 17 PUs

Territory Summary for Chinese :

Kweichow : 1 infantry
    Hunan : 2 artilleries and 2 infantry
    Hopei : 1 infantry
    Chahar : 1 artillery and 1 infantry