I have found that it isnt worthwhile for japan to attack the US fleet in Hawaai on their first turn. instead, I have found that it is better to buy a IC and infantry for your transports & then put your whole fleet on japan with two aircraft on your carrier. Your fleet is larger than the US because you have 2 battleships, let the us come to you. besides, who cares if they take the solomons?
with regards to what SUD said, let me reiterate that a pearl lite may be a good idea in that it could well sucker the US into attacking your fleet. This would cost it heavily in losses of ftrs and bmbs, or the trn and BB if it is smart. After Pearl, Japan really does not need that AC, or those BB’s, and can afford to lose them and would not hurt as much as the allies without the US air power and add’l boats in the Atlantic.
I kind of like the idea of not Pearl-ing at all, but old habits die hard, i guess.
@cystic:
with regards to what SUD said, let me reiterate that a pearl lite may be a good idea in that it could well sucker the US into attacking your fleet. This would cost it heavily in losses of ftrs and bmbs, or the trn and BB if it is smart. After Pearl, Japan really does not need that AC, or those BB’s, and can afford to lose them and would not hurt as much as the allies without the US air power and add’l boats in the Atlantic.
I kind of like the idea of not Pearl-ing at all, but old habits die hard, i guess.
well put CC… The 2 BB’s are better used to knock out the US fleet then to sit still and do nothing… There only major use is to really do Land Bombard and what can you hit with that… India You might say but then you could sail in 2 turns down to India so on turn 3 do an attack (which usually happens anyway on turn 3 if the Japanese are lucky, if the Transport hasn’t brought 2 inf. from Aus.)… and if they get pounded by the BB, Tran., 2 Fighters, and a bomber awesome… the US will take on average 3 hits (if my math is right) and lose a tran. and 2 FIGHTERS which would have served in the European theatre better…
I’ve always gone Pearl heavy and used Pearl Harbor for an invasion of Western U.S.A. I’ve never tried this in a real game, but once I took Eastern U.S.A. by then using Western U.S.A. as a staging point for the assault. Do you think I’m crazy? Thoughts. Thanks again everyone :D :D .
Jeeez SUD… I think you put the rest of us to shame about analyzing the Pearl Hvy vs. Pearl lite debate :D
Pearl Heavy with Hawaii land assault is the biggest risk of all, in this sense. One less tranny available to consolidate against a possible US sub, 2 fewer Inf in Asia, 1 less Ftr in the Naval attack…reducing odds of getting 3 hits on first attack.
I just want to add I agree with this 100%.
Truly a first-rate reply, S_U_D! Excellent risk analysis and assault force breakdowns. Pearl lite is quite obviously a very viable gambit for J1.
my friend pulled of a, well, unorthodox japanese strategy that didn’t work out well but got me thinking.
he focused on the islands, australia, and NZ, then went for brazil.
he built in IC in F-IC, and bought time in asia, ended up taking india and holding out. he also sent a transport to africa later on to help the germans (there was a bit of a standoff going on).
that was one hell of a messed up game.
Pearl Lite…
The US should never ever declare an OOL in-advance at Pearl.
When Japan Pearl’s Heavy with all 3 Capital ships, the US should seriously consider taking 2 hits on the AC & Ftr first, if they have a chance to withdraw the sub. Thus, wait to see how many hits before deciding casualties.
That pesky US sub can attack undefended transports in the Sea of Japan (potential disaster for Japan depending on builds).
That sub can ‘force’ Japan to keep her trannies together, possibly
stopping her from going to Burma on J1.SUD
very good strat SUD….
I like to build an IC in Manchuria at least by the third round,after taking on Pearl Harbor,China and India.In the mean time,transport troops and planes to that area.If for some reason you lose transports,you will still be able to get troops,tanks to the mainland.
@wonder:
I like to build an IC in Manchuria at least by the third round, after taking on Pearl Harbor, China and India.
Although there is much debate as the value/necessity of any country buying IC’s … I am in favor of an IC with Japan in either the 2nd or 3rd round as well.
In a game last night I saw Japan attack Pearl with a fighter, 2 BB’s, and a sub (I think). They took heavy casualties, and ended up having to retreat their two BB’s! Has anyone ever seen this happen before? Thanks again for all of the help :D :D .
If I were playing the US and the Japanese didn’t build an IC in Asia, they would definately lose, paritcularly if they don’t take out my fleet in Hawaii. When I see they’re buying tranports instead of an IC, I sink all my money into my pacific navy and after a few turns, take the water around japan. Japan then has no way of getting troops into asia and it’s too expensive to buy fighters and bombers to use against boats. The US can keep them out of the game by outspending them. This takes japan out of the game and leaves Russia and UK to fight Germany which they can do easily without Japan.
In a game last night I saw Japan attack Pearl with a fighter, 2 BB’s, and a sub (I think). They took heavy casualties, and ended up having to retreat their two BB’s! Has anyone ever seen this happen before? Thanks again for all of the help.
I am not surprised that they got knocked around in that battle with only taking those few units in. See Mista Biggs e-mail from 8/29 - you have to bring in an overkill force to take them out here just in case you roll really badly. As far as the first turn, I always purchase 1 transport, 1 tank & 1 Industrial complex in Manchuria. Someone mentioned that you can’t build at this IC until the 3rd round, which is not true. I would suggest building 3 tanks in the 2nd round to give you some punch in knocking the Allies out of Asia. If the UK builds an IC in India, you should be able to take it in a round or two. If they don’t, that just makes it easier. If Germany is in trouble against Russia, you can always build another IC in India and enable Japan to build 6 tanks/round in Asia. I wouldn’t build a mass amount of transports until after Russia is eliminated and you want to take down the US. Besides, an IC is only $12 and you can build 3 units/round of any type if you place it in Manchuria. Transports are $8 each and can only transport either 2 infantry or 1 tank at a time and these units will arrive on the Asian mainland 1 round later than units built in an IC in Asia. I’ve never seen the Japanese do well at all without at lease 1 IC in Asia.
Besides, an IC is only $12
Is this a house rule of yours? ICs are $15.
My mistake - I’ve been playing a lot more A&AE lately where you can’t build new ICs. At $15 for an IC, buy 1 IC and 1 transport in the first round. It’s still worth it because you can get units to the Asian mainland faster.
Here’s what I do in the first couple of rounds with japan.
Rnd 1 (2 Hit Battleship)
By Transport and IC.
Attack Pearl Harbor with Transport with 2inf, 1Fighters, 2Battleship, 1 Sub, ACC. I take Pearl with no loses, then I land on Pearl with 2Inf and 1fighter. By taking Hawaii America’s counter attack is less because they cannot land on the Island.
2 inf on Transport attack India with 1 fighter. (Which we have UK usually take kwangtung).
Rest of Air Force and 1 inf from Burma attacks Manchuria (Usually taken by Russia) or Kwangtung).
Rnd 2 - 3
3 Tanks + Transport, if possible 2 inf.
Do the usual attacks on Asia, start moving toward Russia.
Move your Transport that you just built in Rnd 1 to Wake Island with 2 inf.
Next round this one attacks with 2 Bombardments and Air Support. The Transport that was at Western US send it 2 spaces towards Japan. Doing this with 3 Transports is effective.
Basically Every round you attack Western US with:
2 Bombardments
2 Fighters
2 Inf.
This way US really needs to start putting money on Western US. It’s cheap for Japan (6IPC’s/Rnd) but it helps a great deal Germany and it stinks for the Yanks.
The only way the Yanks will get this cleared up is if they leave their Air force in US to attack the japanese fleat and build a new Air Force.
Our Rules:
2 Hit Battleship
Bombardment (Like Anti Air Craft)
Submerge sub.
We call it “The Rotation” :evil:
I love playing with Japan and I usually do a different tactic than most i’ve seen. On the first move I send zero transports to Hawaii. I sent 2 battleships, carrier, sub and 2 planes. Only a few times have I lost nearly everything but most times I still kill most of the american fleet there. So what if the americans retaliate and I loose my fleet? That’s alright. I half consider the fleet a write off before the even leave dock anyways. Here’s why:
I but 2 fighters on turn #1. The transports respectively go to far east in russia and india with the remaining fighters and bomber going where they’re most obviously needed. send the 2 inf from kwangtung into china with a plane. Everytime I do this I always take india and the far east. half the time china. If germany does their job right then they should put pressure on russia to defend their western border and pretty much leave their rear open. It’s too much pressure on russia. I do build factories in asia … depending on how hard the fighting is decides how many. Usually just one, sometimes 2. I usually build the first factory in turn #2 if there is absolutely no way another country can touch it.
I usually buy 2-3 planes per turn. Why planes? because you can’t sink planes and planes have a defense of 4. I can attack with my planes and use my factory to build a tank or two a turn to conquer territories. But usually I have enough left over from taking the countries in turn #1 that I only need to build a few tanks.
So, in a few games the USA killed my navy right off and … stayed the hell away from japan and my islands. why? because I had a ton of planes and russia was done. i can always fly my planes back in time to defend japan. by the time the usa is knocking on my door i’m making a ton of money to buy 4-5 planes a turn. to us has to buy transports … troops. maybe battledhips or cariers and planes. and the whole time barely gaining money … they loose money from china.
My only problem with my strategy using japan is that i’ve never tried it on someone who is very good at A&A … just some friends who are ok at it and the computer. wins the game for me everytime. but … the computer is weak and can be beaten everytime. Maybe some of you guys will give this strategy a try. it usually messes with people because they never expect a move like this from japan and it makes them have to rethink their plans. Try it out … just once. Oh yeah, one more thing. if germany is getting pummeled you now have a ton of planes to rushb to their support. and if germany is getting beat down it usually means the usa abondoned the pacific to fight in europe anyways.
i’m sure someone can come up with a way to beat this … if they knew it was going to happen in teh first turn. but most people don’t expect and it makes japan the big winner in the short term on mainland asia and the big winner in the long term if you play your cards right.
One more thing. With planes every time you take new territories the planes are forced to land on old terrtitories which is a bonus. The planes land on other territories with shoreline to defend from quick transport attacks from britain or possibly the usa.
hmmm… immediately my mind thinks NO! there is only the best way to do it… but thinking about it, it isn’t that bad… the aircraft on the mainland obviously will be versatile in attacking land as well as sea targets, but does your friend(s) as the USA attack Germany or Japan or both???.. if Japan, then your strategy is good in the fact that you can sink the USA fleet(s) before it attacks the fatherland… if both then your strategy is still good, just the USA won’t have as much to sink… if Germany then it is looking a bit low… the one problem is that your strategy doesn’t allow yourself to take casulties… buying all fighters will eventually run thin… ofcourse you maybe TG Moses’s sister and be the terror of Axis Factory workers, and the scourge of Allied Sailors(but nevermind :wink: ) then your strategy is perfect you are an AAA Master!!! but assuming you roll like the rest of us, then japan will go down fighting, blowing enemy vehicles and men left and right, but she will go down… just a thought. this is not saying your strategies bad, “intelligence” always can be defeated by dice… :( 8)
GG
I just played a game before I wrote this against the computer where the usa spent 90% of their money attacking germany. the dice went against me and i lost nearly everything. the germans lost finland and the ukrain pretty fast too. the germans looked like they were done except i had placed a factory and was pumping out 3 tanks (on my mainland factory) and 1-2 planes per turn.
in the first round i had managed to get india, one of the chinese provinces and the 2 eastern russian provinces. that’s probably why i lost so many troops. I spread them to thin. turn #2 i lost india and SE asia to britain and i captured them back right away and sunk their transport. i had about 2 infantry and 3 planes spread across my whole frontier, but russia had wasted some troops attacking me.
germany held on for a few turns and it was looking dim for them but my tanks started rolling in and my planes rushing in for some kamikazi action and sunk 8 american transports while i lost 4 planes. germany took moscow and i think you can imagine how it went from there.
i hate when i attack a territory with 3 inf and 2 planes and they have 2 inf and i miss completely for 2 turns and they get dead on hits both turns :P that’ll make you rethink your strategy in that area right quick. luckily the closest enemy factory is moscow which is concentrating on germany.
if you are japan and can capture all of asia and place a few factories there or even only one russia is pretty much done and all the germans have to do is hold off britain and the usa. after that the game is done. it seems every time. that’s why i stopped playing with japan with my friends. i always ended up owning asia and half the time africa too.
