UK barbarossa strategies

[questioneer]

No Cow wants to ignore them altogether.  My argument is that you have to deal with them sooner or later.  Like I said, take Calcutta, Russia defends even stronger and Allies take Shanghai and Manila- tit for tat.

Realize that I could just as easily send the 18inf to Moscow which defeats the Axis right there!!! 
India sends mech and ftrs up to help defend.  US now can put a stronger force in Pac to keep the pressure.  Britain will open a second front alone b/c Germany wants to go balls to the walls on Russia.  Africa and Middle East will be in Allied hands through builds in SAfrica (don’t even need the IC in Egypt) and pressure on the Med.

For my games right now, I’m just trying the “bend don’t break” model by sending the 18inf to Japan and still see if Moscow can hold- its actually and Allied gambit opening!!!

[Cow]

put it this way, when I play revised or v4, I almost always be 4 tanks and an artillery and I always attack ukraine and west russia and if you stack karelia I always send every available unit (unless it is revised and your bid was 9 and you drop 3 infantry on europe, in which case I buy 3 infantry 3 tank and kick you out a round later). I race for berlin in revised. v4 allies get hit with such a hard nerfbat… it is harder to race, because you can’t just buy transports and men so you end up playing the money game, which is why I don’t play v4 and play revised.

in AA50, axis usually have all of africa, while I got italy and france. berlin usually goes before or at the same time as moscow. When I am japan, it is all about india burma FIC ICs spamming tanks. chucking 4 tanks of japan a round as well. screw australia, screw new guinea, screw new zealand, screw those islands, RUSSIA NOW. I do take egypt/transjordan and cross the canal if i can.

Screw east indies complex… especially in tech games, you have to keep your naval back in case of long range aircraft, especially if you were able to cross canal. Vs people who put full egypt bid… I go italy bombard caucasus, germany slam, japan drop persia. Game is won or lost in caucasus and axis got the odds so F IT. So what if there is a 20% chance I will be unhappy and lose, this is a dice game and you got to gamble at some point.
~

Vance Japan goes before USA. Japan is usually busy with dutch islands/calcutta on that round. USA don’t need to fly jack in, russia can just hold it (japan usually out of range with air as well).

Japan can’t go south and be north at the same time.
~

Japan deals with them later, like way later. There is not much income up there. just 3 korea and 3 manch, sure you can go further south, but then you are in range of the full might of japan… you don’t want to do that usually.

Like I said, it depends if you are going full pac or not how things look for japan. Yes, you need those units to do KJF. Yes you are racing for japan before russia falls.

Yes it is a race. Yes you can win the race. Yes KJF is a viable strategy. Lots of allies players chant PACIFIC PACIFIC PACIFIC. Yes I do this from time to time. It is easier than atlantic / split income. I usually provide UK with fleet to convoy 97 or drop men off UK with… but that is it. I almost never invest in transports for the atlantic and if I do it is because your japan is weak.

[Noll]

I’m developing a funny Axis strategy that involves Japan dows on turn 1 and rushing calcutta like you usually do Cow, but Europe is totally different.

[Cow]

@ Noll, that is good to hear.

yeah I mix things up with germany often too. Japan always DOW 1 or 2 and always the same… unless russia is stacked in amur round 1 then they are sucking my fun and I hit them.

[questioneer]

LOL

1. Comparing your successes in AA50/Revised and comparing it to Global is apples to oranges.

2. the Geography works against the Axis in Global- bigtime.

3. Ok, 20% shot???  Nothing to boast about.  That just means you have a good time losing.

4. Let’s just say you get Moscow.  I can guarantee you will lose multiple VCs on your backside (Manila, Shanghai, HongKong, Paris, Cairo, Rome)- you won’t have enough VCs then to win, but you’ll feel great cause you won Russia with and infantry!!! :lol:

[Cow]

I never lose france or west germany without a pacific win. I don’t know what you are talking about. Transports do not defend themselves and you need naval to guard it, too much investment into atlantic for usa to get the cole train ready.

I am not comparing anything, I am just telling you what kind of play style I prefer. Give me greater than 50% odds and I’ll gamble.

USA has an easier time doing early pacific than waiting till later, germany’s full income goes toward russia rounds 1-5 before you have much of an impact on europe, unless you want to get sunk.

Even if I J1 DOW. Bring it. Many have tried. Full atlantic is the only thing that does not work for usa in global, except when japan DOW round 3 or something then yeah you can full atlantic till round 4. Who the hell waits that long and lets uk pac and anzac bank that hard?

May as well just play EUROPE 1940, if you aren’t going to go to war with japan.

[questioneer]

Who says US needs to make an impact on Europe til round 5 anyway.  The moment you attack G1/G2 and I know you go Barbarossa, I build to take Africa, MidEast and rebuild navy in Atlantic.  Britain can stand on its own IF you are throwing everything at Russia.  You’re right transports need to be defended from what??? Aircraft.  If your dedicating aircraft to stall the Brits from landing then that aircraft not used on the Eastern Front.  I’ll trade ships and aircraft with you all day, cause that means you won’t have the firepower to take Moscow when needed.  Russia can match you tank for tank and beat you in building infantry.  Russia, India, ANZAC, US, China can coordinate easily to sack Japan by round 5-6.

I never go full throttle on anything with US.  Its always a balance depending how the Axis open.  Out of all the gambits you have presented, I like the G2/J2 combo- I think that is playable, but not unstoppable like you seem to claim it is. :roll:

Saying the Axis have the advantage in this game presumptuous.  I’ve seen a G1 and G2 already with the Russian crush, but in your layouts of these strats you ignore many counters.  If Allies are played with great coodination, they win out most of the time- period.

[Cow]

it is not an assumption, you merely have to tally up axis wins and allies wins across games.

Slight favorite is not unstoppable. Also I seldom see allies win low luck global games without a bid, like once in a blue moon.

Also if you delete all ICs airbases and naval bases at the end of round 1, the total unit value between axis and allies is about even, allies just have an income advantage, but they are out of position.

At some point you have to match japan’s income with usa, unless you are doing the whole usa gets the carriers anzac gets the fighters… but there is a trick to beating that.

Also germany can’t wait past round 10 for russia. +19 from african NOs for russia means he will always make 10 inf, you get good odds rounds 7-9. buy tanks off minors and bombers off germany/west germany. blam hit it.

split income means split chances for axis to win europe VCs and pacific VCs. I am sorry but Japan comes through when germany can’t and vice versa in most games.

also usually germany doesn’t sink uk naval just presents the threat of doing so, sure if you got 5 transports and you give germany 75%+ he’ll sink it.

axis 55% win for dice games. 70% LL.

[questioneer]

@Cow:

it is not an assumption, you merely have to tally up axis wins and allies wins across games.

Slight favorite is not unstoppable. Also I seldom see allies win low luck global games without a bid, like once in a blue moon.

Also if you delete all ICs airbases and naval bases at the end of round 1, the total unit value between axis and allies is about even, allies just have an income advantage, but they are out of position.

Way to early to tally up anything, Final Alpha has only been out for like 2 months, way too much overreacting.  I think you have to give G40 Final Alpha a year of play first, then start tallying up the wins for Axis and Allies.  Early stats hold very little weight b/c many players are playing with a new ruleset/setup and many mistakes by everyone.

Again, you are comparing apples to oranges again.  I’ve played lowluck a few times too.  Playing lowluck is is completely different than regular b/c entering battles you know what the outcome will be and what units will be left- changes strategy quite a bit- very bad comparison.

Interesting delete ICs/bases thought.  I think the game was meant to be started that way.  Again, doesn’t prove anything- strike 3.

[Cow]

it does prove something, you are looking at hard unit total value.

If you play both sides, you should know the problems allies have.

This is the wrong thread for this topic. Also axis react easier to allies than the other way around, axis have the advantage of positioning and centralized power.

Because of the russian NO from africa, there is no waiting for axis, it is a race and usa is far away.
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1. more people prefer axis according to polls 2) axis win more games 3) experienced players agree the axis has the edge 4) LL players went from 0 bid to a small bid for allies 5) I included games germany lost round 1 because of the 1% chance france has to defend so the tally changes if you include those games or not, but I do because those are allies wins however lackluster they may be.

Two months is plenty of games for people to get in. Forum games take longer so there is more waiting involved, but not live games. Actually the game been out 3 months. 1-3 games a week. I did not include my games for these, I only lost three games with axis out of 10 and allies i lost when germ went barb instead of london, then I picked up more wins exploiting Russia’s NO off italy africa and doing egypt minor to convoy 97, when most of my money goes to the pacific, I tend to win. When I split income, it depends on how the dice goes on russia and japan’s naval. Two cracks at the game is not good.

yet to lose ll game as axis. Allies is lame to play for low luck, you have to follow a set strategy to win. you always calculating if germany buys all bombers can he take russia next round if answer is yes fly more air to russia if answer is no russia is fine.

[questioneer]

@Cow:

it does prove something, you are looking at hard unit total value.

If you play both sides, you should know the problems allies have.

This is the wrong thread for this topic. Also axis react easier to allies than the other way around, axis have the advantage of positioning and centralized power.

Because of the russian NO from africa, there is no waiting for axis, it is a race and usa is far away.
~

1. more people prefer axis according to polls 2) axis win more games 3) experienced players agree the axis has the edge 4) LL players went from 0 bid to a small bid for allies 5) I included games germany lost round 1 because of the 1% chance france has to defend so the tally changes if you include those games or not, but I do because those are allies wins however lackluster they may be.

Two months is plenty of games for people to get in. Forum games take longer so there is more waiting involved, but not live games. Actually the game been out 3 months. 1-3 games a week. I did not include my games for these, I only lost three games with axis out of 10 and allies i lost when germ went barb instead of london, then I picked up more wins exploiting Russia’s NO off italy africa and doing egypt minor to convoy 97, when most of my money goes to the pacific, I tend to win.

Again, you ignore my post addressing the issue, you are wrong on all counts- doesn’t prove thing- pure opinion.  I’ll post it again for you.

[questioneer]

@questioneer:

@Cow:

it is not an assumption, you merely have to tally up axis wins and allies wins across games.

Slight favorite is not unstoppable. Also I seldom see allies win low luck global games without a bid, like once in a blue moon.

Also if you delete all ICs airbases and naval bases at the end of round 1, the total unit value between axis and allies is about even, allies just have an income advantage, but they are out of position.

Way to early to tally up anything, Final Alpha has only been out for like 2 months, way too much overreacting.  I think you have to give G40 Final Alpha a year of play first, then start tallying up the wins for Axis and Allies.  Early stats hold very little weight b/c many players are playing with a new ruleset/setup and many mistakes by everyone.

Again, you are comparing apples to oranges again.  I’ve played lowluck a few times too.  Playing lowluck is is completely different than regular b/c entering battles you know what the outcome will be and what units will be left- changes strategy quite a bit- very bad comparison.

Interesting delete ICs/bases thought.  I think the game was meant to be started that way.  Again, doesn’t prove anything- strike 3.

[Cow]

you are silly, i am done talking to you. whoever you are playing needs to play axis better. join garg’s tournament or hush.

[questioneer]

Already there buddy.  Whoever you are playing against as Allies sucks.

You don’t want to talk b/c you are afraid to play my me.  You’re a fraud.

Back up your claims- fire up a game or “hush”.

[Cow]

If we pair, I don’t care what the dice says, you be allies or you be coward.

[questioneer]

Oh, what’s wrong can’t play both sides of the board???  Whose the coward.

Fire up a real game- chicken.  You vs. Me- solo.  I don’t want you hiding behind your partners, blaming them when you lose.  Your willing to do Garg’s tourny PBF yet you told me you “didn’t have time”.

I smell blood- you’re weak- fresh meat. :evil:

[Guest]

@Cow:

Vance Japan goes before USA. Japan is usually busy with dutch islands/calcutta on that round. USA don’t need to fly jack in, russia can just hold it (japan usually out of range with air as well).

Japan can’t go south and be north at the same time.
~

Japan deals with them later, like way later. There is not much income up there. just 3 korea and 3 manch, sure you can go further south, but then you are in range of the full might of japan… you don’t want to do that usually.

What I was getting at is not the issue of Japan killing off the Russians; if Japan ignores the Russians the Americans can land a bunch of fighters on Korea with the protection of the Russians (unless Japan hasn’t declared war by round 3 which is unlikely).  By USA5 those fighters can be defending Moscow.  Ignoring the Russians leaves a big hole for the allies to get those fighters to Moscow and America can afford to replace them so its a huge plus for the allies.  So the question I have is, how does Japan kill the Russians on J2 (in Amur) or J3 (in Korea) AND also do the India crush?

[Noll]

@Vance:

@Cow:

Vance Japan goes before USA. Japan is usually busy with dutch islands/calcutta on that round. USA don’t need to fly jack in, russia can just hold it (japan usually out of range with air as well).

Japan can’t go south and be north at the same time.
~

Japan deals with them later, like way later. There is not much income up there. just 3 korea and 3 manch, sure you can go further south, but then you are in range of the full might of japan… you don’t want to do that usually.

What I was getting at is not the issue of Japan killing off the Russians; if Japan ignores the Russians the Americans can land a bunch of fighters on Korea with the protection of the Russians (unless Japan hasn’t declared war by round 3 which is unlikely).  By USA5 those fighters can be defending Moscow.  Ignoring the Russians leaves a big hole for the allies to get those fighters to Moscow and America can afford to replace them so its a huge plus for the allies.  So the question I have is, how does Japan kill the Russians on J2 (in Amur) or J3 (in Korea) AND also do the India crush?

If USA is sending all that planes to Moscow, Japan would probably have an easy time in the seas.

[Guest]

Yes that is true, so would it be better for Japan to leave the Russians alone and hope that the allies send those planes to Russia?  It would be better for Japan but bad for Germany.  I dunno its just a thought.

[Jennifer]

One does not need Calcutta to win the game.  A combined Axis threat on Russia is usually enough to stop the Allies from winning - however, the necessity is to stop Allied air from getting to Moscow and to do that, you need the norther Russian territories, for at least a turn.  20-26 ground units in Nentsia is pretty significant, with Italy going for Ukraine and Germany focusing on Baltic/E. Poland area, the Russians are split two ways without any way for the Allies to realistically send help (come on, you cannot both hold India AND send reinforcements from there.)  Add in Japanese streaming through China and it’s pretty much a done deal for Russia.