G40 League House Rule project

[Jennifer]

Keep in mind, there are currently two playoff tiers.  I undeleted the struck out rules section of the league rules.  So those who do not qualify based on number of games, can still qualify for the junior varsity play offs.

[gamerman01]

I will go re-review the league rules at this time.
I might color code players who are eligible for the different playoffs - is that why you’re telling me this?

[Jennifer]

@Gamerman01:

I will go re-review the league rules at this time.
I might color code players who are eligible for the different playoffs - is that why you’re telling me this?

If you so choose to do so. lol.

Yes, I wanted to remind people that the playoffs were opened up and double downed.  Is that really a phrase?  Anyway….to more easily find the wording, it’s in the opening post of the league rules, you can still read through the strike out line.

[gamerman01]

Yeah, thanks, I knew where to find it - just got sidetracked with other stuff.  Going there now (maybe)

[gamerman01]

Can you not edit the first post with the league rules?
In the posts following that, you have some changes/addenda (is that the plural of addendum?)

I see behind the strikethrough that the # of games played for the minor leagues was 0-13.  Shouldn’t that be 4-13 because of the minimum to qualify?

I believe the current rule is that you need 13 games played (against 6 opponents or something like that) to be able to play best of 5 against another player who has 13 games played.  But it’s 14 games to get to the major playoff.  Any chance you could decide to make them both 13 or both 14, so I can just do a single color to show that?

Again, can you not edit the first post of the league rules?  Because at this point, to know all of the league rules you would not only have to read the first post, but all the posts after that.  If you can’t edit the first post, I would ask that you copy the first post to a new stickied thread called “2013 G40 league rules” and edit it to be accurate to the current league rules.

IMO it is your responsibility to give us all the current league rules in one location.  Thanks.

[gamerman01]

@Gamerman01:

Any chance you could decide to make them both 13 or both 14, so I can just do a single color to show that?

And, of course, to improve consistency and reduce confusion among players.

[Jennifer]

Yea, it’s been a long effort on my part to get Djensen to fix my access to that forum.  I can’t edit, remove, etc in there.  I had to have DM lock the thread for us.  Not a problem for me on say, the GD forum, or the Miniatures, etc…just the play games forum.  I think a checkbox may not have been applied, not that I’m complaining, DJ has his mods because he’s a busy man!

[gamerman01]

It is even more clear to me now that it was time to make Tier 4.
I just realized I needed to make a separate subtotal for the wins and losses by Axis and Allies for the new tier -

Separating them, tier 3 now has a .389 win pct as Axis and .250 as Allies, which is much higher than before the separation, and creation of tier 4.

This is interesting (and is always at the right side of my spreadsheet):
Tier 1 win pct; Axis/Allies: .802; .683
Tier 2 .638; .548
Tier 3 .389; .250

Axis has 17% more wins than Allies among tier 1, 16% among tier 2,  and 56% among tier 3.

However, consider this: A big reason the Axis is getting more wins is because tier 1 has played many more games as Axis than as Allies.

Games played as Axis/Allies
Tier 1 96, 60
Tier 2 69, 84
Tier 3 72, 84
Tier 4 23, 32

So you shouldn’t just look at the overall win % of .577 and .423 as Axis and Allies.
The disparity would be much smaller if the top 15 players weren’t disproportionately taking the Axis.

Tier 1’s who love to take Axis:
Boldfresh
Wheatbeer
Zhukov
Hank
Arathorn
Stalingradski

If these guys had taken the Allies as much as they had taken the Axis, I think the # of Allied wins would be close to the same as Axis wins right now.

[gamerman01]

@Gamerman01:

If these guys had taken the Allies as much as they had taken the Axis, I think the # of Allied wins would be close to the same as Axis wins right now.

This is ambiguous.
I didn’t mean if these players had played Allies the same number of times as Axis, I meant….
Well, here’s an example.

Wheatbeer played 22 games as Axis and 4 games as Allies.

I’m saying if he had played only 4 games as Axis and 22 games as Allies, and the other tier 1’s had done the same, Axis and Allies over all right now would be close to equal, or maybe the Allies would even be ahead.

Basically, a major reason the Allies are getting beat up so bad overall is because many tier 1 players strongly favor taking the Axis and they are beating up on weaker players, many times.

[gamerman01]

And this is where the record keeping for each game really pays off.
If we had merely tracked # of Axis wins vs. # of Allied wins, we would conclude that that Allies need a bid of at least 20.  Seriously.  At least 20.

However, since I have tracked Axis and Allies results by player and by tier, it is easy to analyze what may actually be going on in the league.
The fact that tier 1 players as a group have played 60% more games as Axis than as Allies makes it very difficult to project how much, if any, advantage the Axis has over the Allies.  One thing I am sure of, is the disparity between the .577 to .423 winning percents is greatly inflated by the fact that weaker players have taken the Allies far more than the stronger players.
Or is it that the players in tier 1 who have taken the Axis so often are over-rated because they took the stronger side, and just got easier wins?  And the tier 2 and tier 3 and tier 4 players are where they are in part because they are players who took the Allies more??  I think that’s a fair question, too.

I leave it here for you to decide/discuss now.

[Cow]

I love the Axis, simply because I get to decide when the game ends whenever I feel like it.

In AA50 I could actually take berlin/italy… In global… GOOD LUCK WITH THAT. So basically the axis decide between 1) economic game 2) vc win or bust. At any point in the game they can decide vc win or bust.

So yeah.

[Cow]

So basically I prefer the axis because the allies sometimes get super boring. Like my game against hobo, is really boring and in hindsight I wish I just shoved everything in front of him round 2 and start skirmishing hard rather than block him from as many islands as I could.

[Cow]

Oh wait, you didn’t have me listed as one of the tier 1 players who played the axis heavily.  Well Zhukov feels the same way, he prefers to dictate the pace of the game.

[arathorn]

I have always been an Axis-player at heart - especially with Germany. Ever since I had a 32 IPC starting income, struggling if I should go with 4 inf and 4 tanks, or 6 tanks etc. :) Oh the memories. Not only because of my interest in German military history, but also because I always liked to be the “underdog”.

Historically, I think that Axis has “always” been the harder part to play well. All the way back to Classic, where people needed to put in home rules such as “USSR restricted” or give a heavy bid to the Axis players. Though this might have changed a little up through the years, I still feel that a “weaker” player has a better chance of doing well with the Allies than with Axis.

This is due to the fact that the Axis player has to hurry up and get a consistent strategy going, or else the combined economy of the Allies can just wait them out. Of course, against a skilled Axis player, the Allied player has to play well to prevent a fast win, but if the Axis player gets “stuck” or the momentum slows down, it usually favours the Allies, which is why a less strong player could have a chance at evening things out.

I remember with Classic/Europe/Pacific, I never lost as the Allies, since I was usually the stronger player. Though I didn’t always win with the Axis, that was the only way I could get a challenge, since it was much tougher being the Axis.

That’s just my two cents for what it is worth.

Deutshcland Über Alles!

[gamerman01]

It’s not easier to take the Allies in G40, or AA50-41 (with Dardanelles open).  Before that, yes.

[arathorn]

I don’t disagree with you - but I do think that it takes a little more to push for a win with the Axis, due to the need for a quick, consistent strategy to slow down the Allied economic advantage. A good Axis player will know what to do, whereas a weaker Allies player playing against a weaker Axis player will have the advantage of only needing to slow down the Axis sufficiently enough.

[Karl7]

I used to think I was a good Axis player, but most my losses to Tier 1 players has been by me playing the Axis.  I think the Axis have become a lot harder to win with now that Allied play seems to be picking up.  Indeed, as Cow and I have been discussing, I don’t see a very good counter against the Allies just killing Japan and then reinforcing Moscow with fighters at the critical moment.  I can usually get Germany to Moscow, but when they get there in force there’s not ever a slim chance they can take Moscow.

Cow thinks the solution is to use Japan to flank the Allies in the Middle east, but in my experience this allows the US and Anzac to go insane – producing multitudes of planes that end up in Moscow anyway.

[boldfresh]

@Karl7:

I used to think I was a good Axis player, but most my losses to Tier 1 players has been by me playing the Axis.  I think the Axis have become a lot harder to win with now that Allied play seems to be picking up.  Indeed, as Cow and I have been discussing, I don’t see a very good counter against the Allies just killing Japan and then reinforcing Moscow with fighters at the critical moment.  I can usually get Germany to Moscow, but when they get there in force there’s not ever a slim chance they can take Moscow.

Cow thinks the solution is to use Japan to flank the Allies in the Middle east, but in my experience this allows the US and Anzac to go insane – producing multitudes of planes that end up in Moscow anyway.

yeah, cow tried that against me and it failed miserably (flanking middle east with japan that is).

[Stalingradski]

@Karl7:

I used to think I was a good Axis player, but most my losses to Tier 1 players has been by me playing the Axis.  I think the Axis have become a lot harder to win with now that Allied play seems to be picking up.  Indeed, as Cow and I have been discussing, I don’t see a very good counter against the Allies just killing Japan and then reinforcing Moscow with fighters at the critical moment.  I can usually get Germany to Moscow, but when they get there in force there’s not ever a slim chance they can take Moscow.

Cow thinks the solution is to use Japan to flank the Allies in the Middle east, but in my experience this allows the US and Anzac to go insane – producing multitudes of planes that end up in Moscow anyway.

I’m in the middle of learning this the hard way against Allweneedislove. He will soon change his name to Allweneedisbombers  :-D

Allied play will improve as more people adapt to this style - it’s a winning formula for the Allies. But, as with anything, something is lost for what is gained. The trick for everyone facing the decimation of Japan by air is to find out what has been conceded by the Allies, and exploit it. I haven’t accomplished this yet!  :-)

[Jennifer]

If it’s air power, the concession is probably boots on the ground.  So where are they lacking in ground forces?  I mean, other than India, Australia and the United States?

Perhaps if Japan went balls to the walls on an invasion on US Soil to keep them off guard while snatching VCs in the Pacific?  In my mind’s eye, I am seeing a round 3 DOW on the US to prevent them from collecting all that money that a Round 1 DOW gives them.  (-45 IPC + 6 IPC = net -39 IPC just from that, not counting Hawaii NO, etc just Philippines and that stupid as crud Continental NO.)

Might have to ignore China for a few rounds just to really hammer the south hard while keeping pressure on America’s fleet making ability.  If Japan can get annoying enough, those planes won’t be flying to Moscow at all.  Or at least the way I envision it….not sure how to really go about putting it in practice just now, but that’s just a matter of playing a few games and seeing what develops.