If you play ALOT against experienced players like me, your 4 inf 1 fighter purchase would be suicide (no offense)
Japan first turn most always buys 3 trs, then attacks pearl with All fleet within range (including 2 transports) and then moves on to South American on J2, then Brazil J3, puts an IC in Brazil J4, then kicks some ass later in the game and helping Germany. All the time taking out China, India, and Russia.
Your bombers are wasted Strat bombing USA, and if they plan to make a presence on the mainland, Bomb the factory, most times thereisnt an AA gun.
And I still dont see how a 1 fighter buy will help this much, would you accept the math or just take my word for it?
If America attacks you he is a fool and you deserve to woop him. This spells time for Germany to kill Russia.
Alternatively (dont know if I mentioned this) Why not send a trans with 1 inf to Swiss country, and Spain and build an IC. Then pump 2 inf a turn and help Germany out.
I belive that attacking hawaii with you fleet is a large mistake. The american can easily take out your entire fleet on his turn which is disaterous for you. You need that fleet in case the americans do decide to build a fleet (I know it sounds crazy but maybe they tought doing what their enemy thinks they won’t do was a good idea, hmmm). You can not afford to lose your fleet, the americans can.
Instead you should attack the US fleet with your airforce while keeping your fleet out of range of the american airforce.
Djensen, thats the opposite of what you want. If USA builds a fleet thats GREAT! Germany can hold Africa and take Karelia easy. Your mainland effort might suffer, but Germany will win.
Yanny, that is exactly what i mean. By attacking Pearl Harbor, you make the US spend much on defences and a retaliation fleet/planes. when they grow too strong, leave and will have diverted all that time when they could of put pressure on the germans on you.
also i don’t see how the US can destroy the jap fleet in pearl harbor on their first turn.
it isn’t possible unless they roll really really good and you just roll 5’s and 6’s.
Waffen_AH
Us can kill the attacking pearl harbor fleet, at the expense of their own air force. You can attack with 1 BS, 1 Trn, 2 Ftr, 1 Bmr and the sub if it survived. This will usually take a big chunk of the Japaneese fleet out, but kill all US planes.
Yanny, i don’t see how the US has 2 fighters to attack with. the one on E. US can’t make it if i take hawaii.
1)E US –-> W US
2)W US —> ocean
3)ocean —> fleet
4)where does it go?
Hawaii (sp)
As the US nothing could make me hapier then having my entire fleet survive round one.
As Japan I will risk the atack with all but my Aircraft Carrier if I loose the battle ships I can still rebuild around my AC. I also build transports on the first several turns.
Also did you say in your original post that you place the infantry on the mainland? Is this a rule variation that you use?
Yanny, like i said, Japs take hawaii on their first turn.
Oh, my mistake. Well in that case As america I’d just build enough inf to hold you off, then continue to build trn for Anti - Germany, not actually countering you. One thing I would do though, is if the sub survived do a hit and run, and evac the rest of my fleet to the Atlantic.
dezerfish, yeah i play that you can place one inf anywhere you have controlled from the beginning of your turn. im not sure if its in the rules, but i have been taught the game that way and have always played it that way.
yanny, what if i take a couple of transports and land 4 inf in panama. wouldn’t that create a real pain in the ass for you? unless you had a decent amount on inf in mexico, that would buy a few turns of you retaliating and put my fleet within attacking range of yours.
Waffen
The Infantry placement you use is not in the rules. It is in the World @ War expansion, and I like the idea, however it makes it tough to discus strategy when you play by different rules. :smile:
I like the invasion of Hawaii idea. Especialy the panama follow through.
Red
[ This Message was edited by: dezrtfish on 2001-11-16 10:42 ]
Personally, I dont like the Panama invasion. I like to land the 4 inf into Argentina then move them into Brazil next turn. Only reason for my prefering this is to get to Brazil on Turn 3 and then an IC there on turn 4.
Now, this might sound REALLY crazy… but is it worth it not even attacking the American fleet on the first turn? This is ALWAYS the dilemma i face playing…
first, players are usually the same. The friends I play with…
1. Russia: good at stopping Germany… too good for me (I play entire Axis, 3 friends play Allies). However, I dominate him in Asia. Its basically a rush to see if I can take Moscow with Japan before he can take Berlin.
2. United Kingdom: usually defeats me to eat my German fleet (I take his, but he can rebuild). without a fleet, I invariably lose Africa, which sets me up to be constantly Normandyed : (
3. United States Not very good. I could probably use the ships I lost better than he could use the ships he lost… the battleship will always end up dying, I really like amphibious invasions on mainland Asia.
maybe I’m insane (something a lot of friends would tell you is true), but wouldn’t it be a good thing for the US if he did something unexpected against the Japanese, like say focusing on them instead of the Germans? Think about it. The Russians can probably hold the Germans off, the Brits can probably do a lot of damage to them with strategic bombing raids. Japan is Russias main problem since in your sratagies it seems to be them and not the Germans who do major damage to the Russians. Would it not make sense then to try and attack the Japanese (since according to your plans he’s not expecting that; hmmm, doing something unexpected, that might work), you know, try to prevent them from getting unstopable. That’s just crazy me; watch out, I’m crazy
[ This Message was edited by: bossk on 2001-11-24 18:02 ]
Ok, answering both your questions.
Doctor, if the US is smart, he wont counterattack your guys after the Hawaii attack. Why you ask? Because they destroys your navy, but his navy and airforce. This is a major blow. It makes it hard for… leading up to Bossk’s question
Bossk, A good german player could always take Russia without American. this is because, once Africa is taken (and low cash Britan is only one to defend it) Britan has an economy of -8 or so, and the Germans are up at least 8. Now with modest airforce buys (1 fighter every other turn) Germany can keep destroying the British navy whenever it comes in. (Britan cant buy a whole lot with max of 22 cash a turn). This enables Germany to put more inf and tanks on the front lines, into Africa, and to Flank Russia and attack India and China (Thats another -5 to Britan.) Now, if America wants to attack Japan, he needs lets say 4 turn prep time. This time, Japan is cashing out in Asia and building subs and fighters for anti americanism. Britan is so rapped up in Europe that it cant do much in india, and cant even think about Australia and New Zealand (Another -3 IPCs) Russia is so help up with Germany Asia can’t be reinforced. Japan has free reign over Asia, except maybe a Sinkang IC, which would delay Japan but would add more turns neededfor the US to prepare for attacking Japan, basically cancelling itself out.
Now, with average luck, in the 4 turns you took to repair, you could have 12 inf in Karelia or Britan or Africa or WEurope. Britan could be delaying Japan in India, Germany would be pressured enough that Russia could put some inf toward the East. Slowing down Japan further. Then when the allies Shuck-Shuck Berlin, They move everything else they have toward Japan for the quick kill or surrender.
“History is just a set of lies agreed upon”
[ This Message was edited by: Yanny on 2001-11-24 20:45 ]
Japan must have IC’s in Asia to take Russia down. Japan doesn’t have time to transport it all…
Transport vs Industrial Complex? Transport all the way!
Turn 1 - Japan Builds 2 Transport 2 inf and Transports 4 inf to the mainland VS
Turn 1 - Japan builds 1 Industrial Complex, 10$ of whatever, Transports 4 inf to the mainland
Turn 2 - Japan builds 2 Transport However many infantry, Transports 4 inf 1 tank to the mainland VS
Turn 2 - Japan Builds 1 Industrial Complex, and Builds 3 tanks from T1 Complex.
Turn 3 - Japan Builds enough inf to fill Transports and uses other money for whatever, Transports 6 inf to mainland or so (depends on Japan’s Income at this time)
Turn 3 - Japan Builds 6 Tanks, saves rest (not likely to have much more)
Turn 4 - Japan builds whatever, transports 10 inf to mainland
Turn 4 - Japan Builds 6 tanks
See the problem? By Turn 4 Japan would of transported around 25 inf to the mainland, vs 18 tanks. but Japan now has money leftover for whatever and 10 inf per turn.
If Japan wants tanks on the mainland - the best way to do it is through a factory.
If Japan wants infantry on the mainland - the best way to do it is through transports.
A factory in Manchuria, Kwantung, Burma, or India can produce three tanks on the mainland. To ship three tanks from Japan would require 3 transports. A factory costs 15 and 3 transports cost 24. Also, once a transport is sunk, it’s gone. If a factory is over-run, you can take it back.
But, for infantry - factory’s cost 15 and can only produce 3 men - that’s 5 ipc’s of investment per man. Transports cost 8 and can ship two - that’s 4 ipc’s of investment per man. Transports are the best way to get men to the mainland.
